Have you ever used a hack, glitch or exploit to win an online multiplayer game?
Yes. I do it all the time.
0.6% (1)
0.6% (1)
Yes. Sometimes, if I really need to win.
1.1% (2)
1.1% (2)
Yes. But only if the other team does too.
6.6% (12)
6.6% (12)
No. Never.
19.9% (36)
19.9% (36)
No. And I hate anyone who does!
70.7% (128)
70.7% (128)
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Poll: Hacking in Online Multiplayer Games

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I was just wondering how many escapists have cheated the system while playing internet multiplayer games.

In case you don't know exactly what I'm talking about, here's one of my old Metal Gear Online videos. I've noted the parts of the video that demonstrate glitching. This match was particularly upsetting in that it was the final round of a competition. At the end of the video you can see my consolation prize for getting second place (first prize was a beret). You can bet that I was pretty freakin' upset after this round.


You can find more of my MGO vidoes, including ones that show glitching here: http://www.youtube.com/user/daemon37

I suck at MGO, I can't play shooters to a competitive level with controllers. Anyway, glitching/hacking/cheating ruins the game, that's why I stick to dedicated servers and favourite the ones which I know have admins on.

Glitches and Exploits aren't the same as Cheats or Hacks in any way or form so this Poll fails by definition xD

The first two are "game features" that people use in an unintended or creative way, which gives them an edge over others... everyone playing the game can use them. Cheats/Hacks are mostly done through third party tools (Aimbot, Maphack, Wallhack, Speedhack etc.) and deliberately inject into a games memory imprints changing how the game is supposed to work and giving someone an impossible edge over the others.

This poll is screwed up.

The only form of cheating is modifying program code to do things not intended by the creators of the game. This does not include mods, because modding a game does not effect the online portion of the default game.

Hell, some games you can accidentally glitch in, like in Diablo 1 there were countless times when I turned invulnerable due to a glitch times when I wasn't even trying to!

x0ny:
I suck at MGO, I can't play shooters to a competitive level with controllers. Anyway, glitching/hacking/cheating ruins the game, that's why I stick to dedicated servers and favourite the ones which I know have admins on.

Yeah, MGO has some pretty weird controls but once you get used to them it can be a lot of fun. I generally didn't see much cheating when playing MGO. But when it came to the weekly tournaments (hosted by Konami), it seemed like every other match had a team with at least one or two glitchers.

I used to hack our local LAN shop's CS servers all the time. Just for fun though when we were all playing around. Lot's of us did, it was no biggie. I never did it when we were being serious.

But there really isn't a poll option for that is there?

Dexter111:
Glitches and Exploits aren't the same as Cheats or Hacks in any way or form so this Poll fails by definition xD

The first two are "game features" that people use in an unintended or creative way, which gives them an edge over others... everyone playing the game can use them. Cheats/Hacks are mostly done through third party tools (Aimbot, Maphack, Wallhack, Speedhack etc.) and deliberately inject into a games memory imprints changing how the game is supposed to work and giving someone an impossible edge over the others.

That's the exact same rationale that a lot of these glitchers would try to give me. Here's the problem your logic, doing these things makes other players angry and ruins the fun for them unless they play by your rules. And your rules are not explained in any instruction manual, strategy guide or tutorial.

Fredrick2003:
This poll is screwed up.

The only form of cheating is modifying program code to do things not intended by the creators of the game. This does not include mods, because modding a game does not effect the online portion of the default game.

Hell, some games you can accidentally glitch in, like in Diablo 1 there were countless times when I turned invulnerable due to a glitch times when I wasn't even trying to!

No program is perfect, which is why patches exist. Quite often in online games, players will find ways to do things that the programmers did not intend for them to be able to do (aka glitching). Taking advantage of these programming errors is cheating. Sometimes this happens on accident, but far too often it clearly is intentional.

I cheated once in CoD 2, nothing hard core, just Chams, and they didn't even work properly.

And it was a once time use, mostly for the laughs.

No, because I'm not an ass.

daemon37:
That's the exact same rationale that a lot of these glitchers would try to give me. Here's the problem your logic, doing these things makes other players angry and ruins the fun for them unless they play by your rules. And your rules are not explained in any instruction manual, strategy guide or tutorial.

The only "rules" a game is played by is defined by the way it can be played. I couldn't care less if "other players get angry" or "it ruins their fun", they can do it as much as everyone else.

The problem with your logic is that there's always someone unable or just uninterested in doing something well... Rocketjumps? Strafing? Camping? Performing tricks or wall-gliding, sniping from a certain spot or using nades effectively etc.? Nah, can't do it, too hard/don't like it so it's "glitching"... because I can't noone should be able to.

As long as something is possible in a game its fair game, if something is deemed damaging or obstructing/spoiling gameplay there's something called "Patches" and its the developers job to fix it not some player(s) that think they're the moral police.

Never
but on stickarena (flash game) If they didn't have god mode on, I could always kill them

felt like sharing that

No. Hacking in an online game just proves how much you suck if you need to cheat to win. I hate anyone who does this, it unbalances the game to everyone else.

daemon37:
I was just wondering how many escapists have cheated the system while playing internet multiplayer games.

In case you don't know exactly what I'm talking about, here's one of my old Metal Gear Online videos. I've noted the parts of the video that demonstrate glitching. This match was particularly upsetting in that it was the final round of a competition. At the end of the video you can see my consolation prize for getting second place (first prize was a beret). You can bet that I was pretty freakin' upset after this round.


You can find more of my MGO vidoes, including ones that show glitching here: http://www.youtube.com/user/daemon37

I found that glitch/hacking/cheaping to be the work of assholes. They think it's OK to stomp over other people just to make themselves feel good/get a high score, but it just proves that they don't deserve to play online, and ruins it for everyone else. Multiplayer was designed to let people test their skills and knowledge of the game against other players. By hacking/glitching those individuals no longer are playing multiplayer, and are breaking both the physical rules and sense of fair play in the MP.

If this was done in any physical sport, such as holding the ball in your hand or hitting/insulting other players, the person in question would be thrown out of the match. If this kind of thing were to persist, then the individual would be banned. I think that this same idea should be applied to game like this:

Should a player be found to be an exceptionally bad (as in assholeish) player or repeated hacker, then the next time they go online with that game the connection activates a code within the game disc itself which removes the MP as a playable option. This can only be repaired by sending the disc in and getting it re-set for a third of the price of buying the game. If the disc is locked three times, then it remains locked permanently, so the douche has to either buy another disc at full price (which at today's prices would cost over $100, plus the 2 unlocks) or stop playing MP, thereby solving the problem.

I can't understand why you would want to play a game and then let the computer do all the work. All I can assume is the 'dick' factor, that is idiots out there that get off by ruining the fun of other people.

Never did it, except the duplication glitch in the original Diablo, and I was just a dumb kid then.

Dexter111:

The only "rules" a game is played by is defined by the way it can be played. I couldn't care less if "other players get angry" or "it ruins their fun", they can do it as much as everyone else.

The problem with your logic is that there's always someone unable or just uninterested in doing something well... Rocketjumps? Strafing? Camping? Performing tricks or wall-gliding, sniping from a certain spot or using nades effectively etc.? Nah, can't do it, too hard/don't like it so it's "glitching"... because I can't noone should be able to.

As long as something is possible in a game its fair game, if something is deemed damaging or obstructing/spoiling gameplay there's something called "Patches" and its the developers job to fix it not some player(s) that think they're the moral police.

You're assuming three things:
1) Developers care about fixing the problems.
2) Developers have the money to do so.
3) That fixing a glitch won't result in a whole bunch of new glitches.

No program is perfect, and no matter how many times you patch it, it never will be. But I'm pretty sure you already know that. So I don't understand why you would argue such a point.

Hiphophippo:
I used to hack our local LAN shop's CS servers all the time. Just for fun though when we were all playing around. Lot's of us did, it was no biggie. I never did it when we were being serious.

But there really isn't a poll option for that is there?

Sorry, I thought it was clear I wasn't talking about private matches between friends. I only meant public games, especially public competitions.

daheikmeister:
I found that glitch/hacking/cheaping to be the work of assholes. They think it's OK to stomp over other people just to make themselves feel good/get a high score, but it just proves that they don't deserve to play online, and ruins it for everyone else. Multiplayer was designed to let people test their skills and knowledge of the game against other players. By hacking/glitching those individuals no longer are playing multiplayer, and are breaking both the physical rules and sense of fair play in the MP.

If this was done in any physical sport, such as holding the ball in your hand or hitting/insulting other players, the person in question would be thrown out of the match. If this kind of thing were to persist, then the individual would be banned. I think that this same idea should be applied to game like this:

Should a player be found to be an exceptionally bad (as in assholeish) player or repeated hacker, then the next time they go online with that game the connection activates a code within the game disc itself which removes the MP as a playable option. This can only be repaired by sending the disc in and getting it re-set for a third of the price of buying the game. If the disc is locked three times, then it remains locked permanently, so the douche has to either buy another disc at full price (which at today's prices would cost over $100, plus the 2 unlocks) or stop playing MP, thereby solving the problem.

I agree 100% with the first paragraph. I think the second paragraph is hilarious and true. But I don't think your solution in the third paragraph would work for many reasons, though I do agree that a solution is needed.

CharlesA:
Never did it, except the duplication glitch in the original Diablo, and I was just a dumb kid then.

That is indeed a glitch, but I don't have a problem with it because you probably didn't use the glitch to win an online multiplayer game.

daemon37:

daheikmeister:
I found that glitch/hacking/cheaping to be the work of assholes. They think it's OK to stomp over other people just to make themselves feel good/get a high score, but it just proves that they don't deserve to play online, and ruins it for everyone else. Multiplayer was designed to let people test their skills and knowledge of the game against other players. By hacking/glitching those individuals no longer are playing multiplayer, and are breaking both the physical rules and sense of fair play in the MP.

If this was done in any physical sport, such as holding the ball in your hand or hitting/insulting other players, the person in question would be thrown out of the match. If this kind of thing were to persist, then the individual would be banned. I think that this same idea should be applied to game like this:

Should a player be found to be an exceptionally bad (as in assholeish) player or repeated hacker, then the next time they go online with that game the connection activates a code within the game disc itself which removes the MP as a playable option. This can only be repaired by sending the disc in and getting it re-set for a third of the price of buying the game. If the disc is locked three times, then it remains locked permanently, so the douche has to either buy another disc at full price (which at today's prices would cost over $100, plus the 2 unlocks) or stop playing MP, thereby solving the problem.

I agree 100% with the first paragraph. I think the second paragraph is hilarious and true. But I don't think your solution in the third paragraph would work for many reasons, though I do agree that a solution is needed.

Why do you think that the system would not work? Might as well discuss the advantages and drawbacks if we're to find a proper solution

EDITED QUOTES FOR CONCISENESS

daheikmeister:
Should a player be found to be an exceptionally bad (as in assholeish) player or repeated hacker, then the next time they go online with that game the connection activates a code within the game disc itself which removes the MP as a playable option. This can only be repaired by sending the disc in and getting it re-set for a third of the price of buying the game. If the disc is locked three times, then it remains locked permanently, so the douche has to either buy another disc at full price (which at today's prices would cost over $100, plus the 2 unlocks) or stop playing MP, thereby solving the problem.

daemon37:
I don't think your solution would work for many reasons, though I do agree that a solution is needed.

daheikmeister:
Why do you think that the system would not work? Might as well discuss the advantages and drawbacks if we're to find a proper solution

Well for starters, you'd need the DVD/blu-ray player that can write, not a read-only one (as is what I believe all consoles currently have).

Also, who determines what is "bad"? As you can see in this thread, not everyone thinks glitching, cheating, and/or hacking are bad things to do.

Lastly, who enforces these rules? Hopefully not the players, because then you'll get people calling each other hackers, simply because they were playing the game very well (as Marion describes in the newest issue of Reliable Source: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/columns/reliable-source/7227-Reliable-Source-I-Once-Punched-a-13-Year-Old-in-the-Face )

Dexter111:

The only "rules" a game is played by is defined by the way it can be played. I couldn't care less if "other players get angry" or "it ruins their fun", they can do it as much as everyone else.

The problem with your logic is that there's always someone unable or just uninterested in doing something well... Rocketjumps? Strafing? Camping? Performing tricks or wall-gliding, sniping from a certain spot or using nades effectively etc.? Nah, can't do it, too hard/don't like it so it's "glitching"... because I can't noone should be able to.

As long as something is possible in a game its fair game, if something is deemed damaging or obstructing/spoiling gameplay there's something called "Patches" and its the developers job to fix it not some player(s) that think they're the moral police.

Let me come with an example:

In Killing Floor it's about to survive all the waves with the rest of your teammates. In a map you could use a glitch to get on top of a gate where all the monsters couldn't hit you, basically guaranteeing a win with no effort.

Sure, I could use it too but I don't think it's fun because it removes any challenge in the game. Sure it got patched as well (I think). Do you honestly think it was fine people used that glitch though?

I don't think it's being a moral police, just using some common sense. If it's obviously not intended, I don't see why it's okay to use it just because it's in the game. Also, saying you don't care about the other people having fun is just being an asshole. I don't mean to call you an asshole but ruining the fun of 9 others just so a single person can have fun makes me mad.

Grr! Speed hacks...

I went into a speed-hacked Search and Destroy lobby, chased after a guy, got caught on the environment, bounced 50ft into the air, then died. :(

daemon37:
EDITED QUOTES FOR CONCISENESS

daheikmeister:
Should a player be found to be an exceptionally bad (as in assholeish) player or repeated hacker, then the next time they go online with that game the connection activates a code within the game disc itself which removes the MP as a playable option. This can only be repaired by sending the disc in and getting it re-set for a third of the price of buying the game. If the disc is locked three times, then it remains locked permanently, so the douche has to either buy another disc at full price (which at today's prices would cost over $100, plus the 2 unlocks) or stop playing MP, thereby solving the problem.

daemon37:
I don't think your solution would work for many reasons, though I do agree that a solution is needed.

daheikmeister:
Why do you think that the system would not work? Might as well discuss the advantages and drawbacks if we're to find a proper solution

Well for starters, you'd need the DVD/blu-ray player that can write, not a read-only one (as is what I believe all consoles currently have).

Also, who determines what is "bad"? As you can see in this thread, not everyone thinks glitching, cheating, and/or hacking are bad things to do.

Lastly, who enforces these rules? Hopefully not the players, because then you'll get people calling each other hackers, simply because they were playing the game very well (as Marion describes in the newest issue of Reliable Source: http://www.escapistmagazine.com/articles/view/columns/reliable-source/7227-Reliable-Source-I-Once-Punched-a-13-Year-Old-in-the-Face )

Very concise. I approve

But, more importantly the points in order of appearance:

Considering the capabilities that even the standard game console has, Blu-ray rewriting shouldn't be far off. However, that doesn't mean that doing this now isn't possible. Even old discs can have codes built into them that activate after a certain trigger signal is sent to them(eg. telling you that you can't copy a disc). It'd be as simple as an "IF this happens, THEN do this" to tell the disc to change to this mode until given the clear back at company. And with current disc security systems you'd have to have your own disc-making factory to undo it.

In regards to who decides if it's bad, the system would go off of the number of reports that one gets on the subject. If it's just one or two, then it's ignored as luck or bad losers. But if there are over 50 reports, then the mods go in and review replays the matches in question, as well as send a confirmation message to the reporters for clarification. If these are truly just ranting on an exceptionally good player, then the reporters get a warning, or in exreme cases even a proverbial "strike" to their, name, which will eventually lead to the same fate that they themselves were trying to inflict on the reportee.

System covered, no?

Exploiting and hacking aren't the same thing, sure exploiting pisses some people off, but that's mostly the people who don't know how to counter it. For example, in TF2 there is a ledge above the last point on the first section of Goldrush, an Engineer can build a dispenser and jump up to it, there is enough room to build a teleporter, sentery and dispenser. A lot of people call this spot unfair because the sentry is partially blocked by the platform and can see most of the battlefield. The easiest way to counter this is to get a demoman to launch stickies up there but noone does. I've been kicked for using the platform just because people were to lazy to use simple teamwork to get rid of me.

People who cheat in multi-player, should have to serve a week in armed combat. See where your cheats get you then.

Calgetorix:
Let me come with an example:

In Killing Floor it's about to survive all the waves with the rest of your teammates. In a map you could use a glitch to get on top of a gate where all the monsters couldn't hit you, basically guaranteeing a win with no effort.

Sure, I could use it too but I don't think it's fun because it removes any challenge in the game. Sure it got patched as well (I think). Do you honestly think it was fine people used that glitch though?

I don't think it's being a moral police, just using some common sense. If it's obviously not intended, I don't see why it's okay to use it just because it's in the game. Also, saying you don't care about the other people having fun is just being an asshole. I don't mean to call you an asshole but ruining the fun of 9 others just so a single person can have fun makes me mad.

I actually don't mind those kind of glitches, simply because it's a co-op game. When you and your buddies decide to glitch an online game so your team can beat the computer, that fine (though it may cheapen the game a bit). But when you use a glitch against other human players, that's not fine. Not at all.

Janus Vesta:
Exploiting and hacking aren't the same thing, sure exploiting pisses some people off, but that's mostly the people who don't know how to counter it. For example, in TF2 there is a ledge above the last point on the first section of Goldrush, an Engineer can build a dispenser and jump up to it, there is enough room to build a teleporter, sentery and dispenser. A lot of people call this spot unfair because the sentry is partially blocked by the platform and can see most of the battlefield. The easiest way to counter this is to get a demoman to launch stickies up there but noone does. I've been kicked for using the platform just because people were to lazy to use simple teamwork to get rid of me.

I know hacking and exploiting aren't the same thing, I never said they were. Also, I don't think your example is offensive, and I wouldn't call it exploiting. But I can see why some people would get annoyed, because they're noobs.

Mornelithe:
People who cheat in multi-player, should have to serve a week in armed combat. See where your cheats get you then.

Awesome, yes. I like it.

i hate everyone who hacks online, if you wan to cheat, play offline, if you can't win, play offline >:|

daheikmeister:
Very concise. I approve

But, more importantly the points in order of appearance:

Considering the capabilities that even the standard game console has, Blu-ray rewriting shouldn't be far off. However, that doesn't mean that doing this now isn't possible. Even old discs can have codes built into them that activate after a certain trigger signal is sent to them(eg. telling you that you can't copy a disc). It'd be as simple as an "IF this happens, THEN do this" to tell the disc to change to this mode until given the clear back at company. And with current disc security systems you'd have to have your own disc-making factory to undo it.

In regards to who decides if it's bad, the system would go off of the number of reports that one gets on the subject. If it's just one or two, then it's ignored as luck or bad losers. But if there are over 50 reports, then the mods go in and review replays the matches in question, as well as send a confirmation message to the reporters for clarification. If these are truly just ranting on an exceptionally good player, then the reporters get a warning, or in exreme cases even a proverbial "strike" to their, name, which will eventually lead to the same fate that they themselves were trying to inflict on the reportee.

System covered, no?

Yeah that would work. Now we just need to convince the game developers/publishers to do this, and that won't be easy. Unless it's a subscription based game, where you (and the other players) could threaten to cancel your subscription unless they fix it.

Dexter111:
Glitches and Exploits aren't the same as Cheats or Hacks in any way or form so this Poll fails by definition xD

The first two are "game features" that people use in an unintended or creative way, which gives them an edge over others... everyone playing the game can use them. Cheats/Hacks are mostly done through third party tools (Aimbot, Maphack, Wallhack, Speedhack etc.) and deliberately inject into a games memory imprints changing how the game is supposed to work and giving someone an impossible edge over the others.

Try using those "Game features" in an unintended or creative way on a dedicated server when an admin is on and see how far they get you.

Modern Warfare 2 isn't any worse than any other game for hacking, but what disappoints me the most is that Infinity Ward clearly don't care that people are hacking their way to the top of the leaderboards. Have a look if you haven't already, at the amount of people at the top of the global leader-boards that are in 10th Prestige and have the same score

If you can't win in a fair fight, you can't win.

richasr:
Modern Warfare 2 isn't any worse than any other game for hacking, but what disappoints me the most is that Infinity Ward clearly don't care that people are hacking their way to the top of the leaderboards. Have a look if you haven't already, at the amount of people at the top of the global leader-boards that are in 10th Prestige and have the same score

Actually, from what I've heard, Modern Warfare 2 takes the prize for the most cheaters playing online matches than any other game out today. I assume this is due to 2 things, its overall popularity, and the fact that a large amount of its players are approximately 12 years old.

This is why I am in no rush to start playing said game.

Ranorak:
If you can't win in a fair fight, you can't win.

Whats your definition of fighting "fair"?

Personally, I'll do anything that can be done (and have it done to me without complaint) within the game that doesn't involve modifying it.

If you rule out glitching and exploits, where does one draw the line - in both of those cases they can be as easily used against you as they can be used by you.

But really, where is the line for "fair"? Is it fair to shoot someone in the back? Is it fair to shoot someone while they're reloading? Is it fair to fight against infantry in a tank they can't damage? Is it fair to use an AWP in Counter-Strike?

Of course it is, because someone can come along and do the same thing to you. So why is using one's intimate knowlege of the game to ones advantage unfair? How is it considered any less of a skill than being able put a bullet in someones head every time? Both are about knowing the mechanics of the game and using them to your advantage.

DarkSaber:

Dexter111:
Glitches and Exploits aren't the same as Cheats or Hacks in any way or form so this Poll fails by definition xD

The first two are "game features" that people use in an unintended or creative way, which gives them an edge over others... everyone playing the game can use them. Cheats/Hacks are mostly done through third party tools (Aimbot, Maphack, Wallhack, Speedhack etc.) and deliberately inject into a games memory imprints changing how the game is supposed to work and giving someone an impossible edge over the others.

Try using those "Game features" in an unintended or creative way on a dedicated server when an admin is on and see how far they get you.

Try doing anything that puts an admin into a negative KDR and see how long you stay on a server...

Right, if its against the server rules, thats cool - its thier server, you're thier guest and should respect that. If it isn't, tough luck. Do what one is supposed to do in a competitive environment - adapt and overcome.

Bob_Marley42:

Ranorak:
If you can't win in a fair fight, you can't win.

Whats your definition of fighting "fair"?

Personally, I'll do anything that can be done (and have it done to me without complaint) within the game that doesn't involve modifying it.

If you rule out glitching and exploits, where does one draw the line - in both of those cases they can be as easily used against you as they can be used by you.

But really, where is the line for "fair"? Is it fair to shoot someone in the back? Is it fair to shoot someone while they're reloading? Is it fair to fight against infantry in a tank they can't damage? Is it fair to use an AWP in Counter-Strike?

Of course it is, because someone can come along and do the same thing to you. So why is using one's intimate knowlege of the game to ones advantage unfair? How is it considered any less of a skill than being able put a bullet in someones head every time? Both are about knowing the mechanics of the game and using them to your advantage.

DarkSaber:

Dexter111:
Glitches and Exploits aren't the same as Cheats or Hacks in any way or form so this Poll fails by definition xD

The first two are "game features" that people use in an unintended or creative way, which gives them an edge over others... everyone playing the game can use them. Cheats/Hacks are mostly done through third party tools (Aimbot, Maphack, Wallhack, Speedhack etc.) and deliberately inject into a games memory imprints changing how the game is supposed to work and giving someone an impossible edge over the others.

Try using those "Game features" in an unintended or creative way on a dedicated server when an admin is on and see how far they get you.

Try doing anything that puts an admin into a negative KDR and see how long you stay on a server...

Right, if its against the server rules, thats cool - its thier server, you're thier guest and should respect that. If it isn't, tough luck. Do what one is supposed to do in a competitive environment - adapt and overcome.

Can't say I've ever been kicked off/banned from a server for being better than an admin, or done that to anyone myself.

As for "But really, where is the line for "fair"? Is it fair to shoot someone in the back? Is it fair to shoot someone while they're reloading? Is it fair to fight against infantry in a tank they can't damage? Is it fair to use an AWP in Counter-Strike?"

None of those are abusing exploits or glitches for an advantage,

I found a glitch all on my own once, and was so proud I used it for the rest of the match.

'Twas nothing serious, however, just changed the color of my muzzle flash. It was a f2p game anyway, so most others were hacking serious shit like aimbots.

ok so yeah anyone who has done this should burn, i mean come on if its a versus game then youre just taking the competition out of it and whats the point where as if its an MMO then how hooked do you have to be to hack? i mean really

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