FieryTrainwreck:
Isn't it awesome how the more we learn about Origin, the worse it gets?

I'm reminded of all the folks who came down on the "both companies are greedy" or the "wait and see" side of the EA vs. Valve debate.

When you're dealing with the devil, you really don't need to hear the details.

Honestly, they are making it harder and harder for me to buy their games now. I want to be as carefree as the next guy and dismiss all of this bullshit so I can play seemingly great games like BF3, ME3, etc. But it's either at or very near the point where I don't feel comfortable supporting EA with my purchases anymore.

Valve is evil in its own right, tell me that they aren't evil for offering a pocket medic or a teddy engi for $10.

Tell me the whole Mann Co. store isnt pure evil.

Evil that has so far cost me $45.........

but thats one thing, keeping tabs on your player base then selling the information they gathered to third parties, regardless if its your browsing history or recent purchases on other websites is an entirely different level of evil.

I was hoping to play some BF3 when it gets released, but sadly it looks like Im going to have to buy it on the 360.

Vonnis:
This is why I won't be buying any games that use it. I just hope ME3 won't require Origin.

it will, all future EA games on PC will, unless it fails

Valve, EA and Blizzard. You can't trust anyone these days.

spartandude:

Vonnis:
This is why I won't be buying any games that use it. I just hope ME3 won't require Origin.

it will, all future EA games on PC will, unless it fails

If that's the case, I'll just have to wait for its failure. Shouldn't be too long.

webepoop:
yes steam does this too, although I don't think they monitor websites.

http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey

I like how µTorrent is 23rd on that list with 29% of people having it installed. Shows how many pc gamers are dirty pirates

Overreaction much? Companies gather info on what you do to try to market things that they believe may be in your interests. Everyone.

No matter how biased you view of EA is you can't sanely convince yourself that they're going to sell your personal info (email account for spam e-mail does NOT count. Never has.) to someone to get your account stolen...

God people really want to hate EA's program over Steam's for no reason other than to hate...

bbad89:
This is spying, plain and simple, and I'm fairly certain it's against the law. Can't we do anything about this?

Steam?

I think this is kind of appropriate (Epic paint skills incoming):

I was on the fence about Origin before now, I was gonna wait for a bit and see if EA could be trusted before buying a game throug it (BF3) but this kinda blew that notion out of the water.

Hopefully people see this and it gets changed when the outrage reaches critical mass, then again Facebook seems to be getting away with similar.

That's nothing. You should see the clause where they reserve the right to take your firstborn child.

Here's some sad facts for you. Companies now-a-days are making restricting DRM's. AC2 was a prime example, you needed a constant internet connection to play it. Some weren't aware of that and ended up paying $60 for a brick of worthless shelf-space.

Guess who stepped in to save the day? That's right; the same hackers that Ubi was trying to smother. Instead of turning away hackers, they actually involved a smaller population of people who play PC games without much internet usage.

I don't agree with EA's policy for origin. I really hope TOR doesn't use it as a launcher. If they do, and I want to keep my privacy; I will turn to the hacking community to find a solution :] 1-up guys!

Yea, Steam does this too. And where is the option to opt out? Well, I have no idea. A friend just told me that information is in the privacy policy document. I'm however not a native English speaker and despite changing my Steam GUI to my native language, the privacy policy remains in a foreign language. So, I use my English skills to skim the document at hand, but there are no headlines that say "Opting out of information gathering service". But hey, maybe it's too much to expect it to sit in the OPTIONS menu?

So. Stop whining. You can't get anything that doesn't profile you and use this profiling to make money. Google does it. Microsoft does it. Apple does it. Hell, every day something like a million smartphones are activated, and people happily install tracking apps that use GPS to pinpoint your location and broadcast it to Facebook and Google or whatever, so now apple, google, and Facebook know where you're going about in real life, not just your online shopping habbits. Valve does it and now that you took the time to read the Origin terms of use and privacy policy, you know that EA does it too! What a surprise! You're a great champion in the war for privacy. Except, we all know the only reason people care about this is because of some fanboyism that makes it mandatory to hate EA and love Valve.

Stop using the Internet if you're afraid someone is profiling you, because they all are. Even that proxy you're telling yourself is keeping your identity all secret and your porn habits out of Google's claws.

Then there's the fact that these privacy policies, EULAs, Terms of Use and all the rest, are all worded extremely broadly to protect EA from the horrors of the US courtsystem, and other nonsense where they can be sued for doing anything that's not already covered by billions of words of legal text. It's the same with every EULA, TOS, TOU, PP, and so on and so forth. Go ahead, start reading. I'm pretty sure soon you'll not be making threads like this, or you'll be doing nothing else, on every forum ever.

Stupidity, it's probably the only resource we'll never run out of.

That Hyena Bloke:

bbad89:
This is spying, plain and simple, and I'm fairly certain it's against the law. Can't we do anything about this?

Yes, you can. You can avoid installing Origin on your computer. Problem solved.

But that means I have to miss out on that game I want! That is SO unfair!

...Actually, it always puzzles me how we can, as community, demand we and our medium be treated maturely when we act like children.

Again, collectively, not picking out anyone in particular.

That Hyena Bloke:

bbad89:
This is spying, plain and simple, and I'm fairly certain it's against the law. Can't we do anything about this?

Yes, you can. You can avoid installing Origin on your computer. Problem solved.

It's not spying when you say "OK" at the point of installing. And it's not a solution not to install it. He's here on this website, so he's also being tracked right now by escapistmagazine and all the searchproviders that escapist uses to provide statistics with, he's being tracked by google, maybe by facebook, by the advertisers on this site, and probably a few more.
Then there's all those other programs he has running on his PC that sends information to whereever without telling you about it because it's in the legal documentation.

Origin, the beginning of the end.

dfphetteplace:
Does EA realize there is a program for downloading all their games that doesn't do this type of activity? uTorrent. They are making it much more appealing to just steal their software even by people who don't want to pirate.

I absolutely hate piracy, but there comes a point where enough is enough.

I might start stealing games and sending cash to the developers (not the publishers) in unmarked envelopes.

Keava:

Dirty Hipsters:
Well ok, not really, but EA's Origin does watch everything you do on your computer.

If you read the End User License Agreement for Origin it states that by installing Origin you're giving EA the right to monitor your PC and to make a profile of you, including what programs you have installed (and whether you have any illegally downloaded material), what websites you use, etc., and that EA reserves the right to share or sell this information to third parties.

Why have I heard NOTHING about this yet? Where is the outrage? Is it just that no one actually reads the EULA, or is it that in the age of facebook no one cares about people monitoring everything they do?

Because Steam does it too.

By using Valve's online sites and products, users agree that Valve may collect aggregate information, individual information, and personally identifiable information, as defined below. Valve may share aggregate information and individual information with other parties.

It's normal practice. Don't like it? Don't connect to internet, because these days majority of software does collect information about your PC and what you use on it. It's called market research, just a cheap version where they don't have to survey people individually from a limited pool.

Steam warns you about that up front though, and even lets you opt out of it on installation. EA on the other hand hides their intentions to monitor you, and makes it compulsory. How can you not see a difference?

If they're going to be monitoring people, they should be forced to full disclosure, instead of some fine print at the bottom of a EULA that 99.9% of people aren't going to read. Hell, the only reason I even read the EULAs is because I'm a law major and I like to read convoluted documents like this as practice.

godofslack:
I severely doubt it has the ability to do anything threatening. In fact I doubt it does anything crazy. I'm sure it can easily be blocked by any competent anti virus.

I notice a whole lotta "I think" in there.

Kalezian:

Valve is evil in its own right, tell me that they aren't evil for offering a pocket medic or a teddy engi for $10.

Yes, how dare they offer extras to gamers not necessary in the least to enjoy the game.

As opposed to, say, forcing an intrusive program on users even on offline installs.

Tell me the whole Mann Co. store isnt pure evil.

Considering that the user-supplied items actually generate revenue for their creators, they're not pure evil.

Evil that has so far cost me $45.........

Assuming you're not joking, it's not their fault you have poor impulse control. No one was forcing me to make bacon sandwiches every day straight for a week before I came home from college.

but thats one thing, keeping tabs on your player base then selling the information they gathered to third parties, regardless if its your browsing history or recent purchases on other websites is an entirely different level of evil.

In that it actually is evil, yes.

Awexsome:
Overreaction much? Companies gather info on what you do to try to market things that they believe may be in your interests. Everyone.

Firefox doesn't actually look for information that I don't need to run it for marketing purposes. Nor does Chrome, Notepad++, or any one of several programs I use all the time. There's a vast difference between "Companies", "gaming companies", and "pushing the limits of privacy for fat monies". Heck, every time someone tries something like this, they get castigated. Google "Sony rootkit scandal".

No matter how biased you view of EA is you can't sanely convince yourself that they're going to sell your personal info (email account for spam e-mail does NOT count. Never has.) to someone to get your account stolen...

1. Telling people what they can and can't believe. 1b. Alternatively, dismissing people's opinion out of hand with flat denial. That's kind of what a self-centered jerk does.
2. Straw man.
3. You don't actually know what they plan to do with the information they collected. And even if they don't plan to do anything nefarious now, there's absolutely nothing to keep them from changing their minds later.

God people really want to hate EA's program over Steam's for no reason other than to hate...

I think "spying on users" is a pretty good reason. I (and I assume others) was actually quite indifferent to the matter until now. Very few people hate for hate's sake. I also assume most of the people who were against the service before didn't trust EA, or didn't like having to install a program just to play the game. Admittedly, it's little different from Steam and Half-Life 2, but even then Valve had a better record of customer service.

Matt Fetterman:
Here's some sad facts for you. Companies now-a-days are making restricting DRM's. AC2 was a prime example, you needed a constant internet connection to play it. Some weren't aware of that and ended up paying $60 for a brick of worthless shelf-space.

Guess who stepped in to save the day? That's right; the same hackers that Ubi was trying to smother. Instead of turning away hackers, they actually involved a smaller population of people who play PC games without much internet usage.

I don't agree with EA's policy for origin. I really hope TOR doesn't use it as a launcher. If they do, and I want to keep my privacy; I will turn to the hacking community to find a solution :] 1-up guys!

And by "hackers", you mean "pirates".

While I think the AC2 DRM was silly of Ubi, you don't have any kind of right to a DRM-free version of a game just because you don't like the one you bought. Caveat Emptor. Not to mention all the plain ol' pirates who never paid a sou, yet still think they deserve the entire game for free.

FieryTrainwreck:

dfphetteplace:
Does EA realize there is a program for downloading all their games that doesn't do this type of activity? uTorrent. They are making it much more appealing to just steal their software even by people who don't want to pirate.

I absolutely hate piracy, but there comes a point where enough is enough.

I might start stealing games and sending cash to the developers (not the publishers) in unmarked envelopes.

Nope. Piracy is never justified. You never have a right to get a game for free, no matter how much the legal version may inconvenience you. You don't even have a right to a version without nonsense intrusion like this. You do, however, have the right to complain. On forums, in letters, wherever.

AlmondMan:

That Hyena Bloke:

bbad89:
This is spying, plain and simple, and I'm fairly certain it's against the law. Can't we do anything about this?

Yes, you can. You can avoid installing Origin on your computer. Problem solved.

It's not spying when you say "OK" at the point of installing. And it's not a solution not to install it. He's here on this website, so he's also being tracked right now by escapistmagazine and all the searchproviders that escapist uses to provide statistics with, he's being tracked by google, maybe by facebook, by the advertisers on this site, and probably a few more.

There are programs to block all of those.

Then there's all those other programs he has running on his PC that sends information to whereever without telling you about it because it's in the legal documentation.

Name one.

Dirty Hipsters:

Steam warns you about that up front though, and even lets you opt out of it on installation. EA on the other hand hides their intentions to monitor you, and makes it compulsory. How can you not see a difference?

It's in the EULA, and these days with all that's happened, anyone remotely responsible should be reading them. The "nobody reads those" excuse is old and tired. At some point, we have to start taking responsibility.

Zachary Amaranth:

Dirty Hipsters:

Steam warns you about that up front though, and even lets you opt out of it on installation. EA on the other hand hides their intentions to monitor you, and makes it compulsory. How can you not see a difference?

It's in the EULA, and these days with all that's happened, anyone remotely responsible should be reading them. The "nobody reads those" excuse is old and tired. At some point, we have to start taking responsibility.

Except that this is what happened when people did exactly that. They read the EULA, and found it not to their liking. By your terms, taking responsibility.

webepoop:
yes steam does this too, although I don't think they monitor websites.

http://store.steampowered.com/hwsurvey

You see the paragraph at the top where it's plainly stated to be optional?

psychodynamica:
Slightly disturbed by this. Maybe if we all started some form of action, like reposting this all over every forum we use. to all those who say "you only noticve this now, all EULA do this. That is no defence and if i am not mistaken this is the only one i have read that says it can take anything and sell it on. please my friends, spread this and make sure people know, i want to play BF3 but i will be happy to forgo that if EA does not get it's act together, they may simply not realise hopw this could effect their sales. keeping in mind that when gamers scream boycott. they often just don't.

if you are going to boycott EA, F*CKING do it. if not, enjoy your internet/download history being sold to news companies so they can report on how "Our youth are porn addicted criminals."

Get the word out. Anonymous is not pleased.

Anonymous? You mean the guys who are known for being trolls, and who sexually harassed a 12-year old girl?

Gamers. Gamers are not pleased.

Zachary Amaranth:

Dirty Hipsters:

Steam warns you about that up front though, and even lets you opt out of it on installation. EA on the other hand hides their intentions to monitor you, and makes it compulsory. How can you not see a difference?

It's in the EULA, and these days with all that's happened, anyone remotely responsible should be reading them. The "nobody reads those" excuse is old and tired. At some point, we have to start taking responsibility.

You do realize that EULAs are specifically designed to not be read right? Companies and their lawyers design them to have as few people willing to read them as possible, and for even less people to be able to fully understand them. It's what gives them the power to pull half the shit they do.

This isn't about people being irresponsible, it's about companies being irresponsible and getting away with it by covering their asses with legal bullshit that no normal person understands.

JonnWood:
Except that this is what happened when people did exactly that. They read the EULA, and found it not to their liking. By your terms, taking responsibility.

That's clearly not what Dirty Hipsters was complaining about. Please don't argue against my words out of context, that's not only dishonest but not particularly nice either.

For example:

Dirty Hipsters:

You do realize that EULAs are specifically designed to not be read right? Companies and their lawyers design them to have as few people willing to read them as possible, and for even less people to be able to fully understand them. It's what gives them the power to pull half the shit they do.

This isn't about people being irresponsible, it's about companies being irresponsible and getting away with it by covering their asses with legal bullshit that no normal person understands.

Now, what we have here is someone making excuses for why people don't read EULAs. The same poster I was talking to before, in fact.

DH, I do realise that, which is all the more reason to keep on your toes.

Zachary Amaranth:

JonnWood:
Except that this is what happened when people did exactly that. They read the EULA, and found it not to their liking. By your terms, taking responsibility.

That's clearly not what Dirty Hipsters was complaining about. Please don't argue against my words out of context, that's not only dishonest but not particularly nice either.

For example:

Dirty Hipsters:

You do realize that EULAs are specifically designed to not be read right? Companies and their lawyers design them to have as few people willing to read them as possible, and for even less people to be able to fully understand them. It's what gives them the power to pull half the shit they do.

This isn't about people being irresponsible, it's about companies being irresponsible and getting away with it by covering their asses with legal bullshit that no normal person understands.

Now, what we have here is someone making excuses for why people don't read EULAs. The same poster I was talking to before, in fact.

DH, I do realise that, which is all the more reason to keep on your toes.

I see your one to subscribe to a situational prevention theory of blaming the victims. What you're saying basically amounts to a woman being raped and then people saying "well it's her own damn fault for wearing a short skirt and walking around at night." Of course all of us should be careful, but you can't fault the victims for a wrong that is obviously not their fault. If companies weren't being malicious with their software then what I'm saying would be a moot point, but they are malicious, and I really don't see how for you the blame doesn't fall on them ENTIRELY for being that way.