The Guild Wars 2 Flood Begins.

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GrandmaFunk:

woodaba:

Have you played the game, Officer Fanboy? No? Then, tell me, where's the proof that these consequences exist? Hmm? Because all I've heard or seen is the word of the devs

the "proof" would be in the reports from the hundreds of ppl that played the game last year at various game conventions, the videos posted online and the various articles by journalists who have gotten to try the game.

also, nice tone, captain douchy.

Sorry, just find it difficult to take someone seriously when their title declares their rabid fanboyism before they even open their mouths.

Game journalism isn't worth anything. Previews mean precisely fuck all. Remember the early previews of Jurrasic Park: Trespasser? Remember the game? I rest my case.

Show me one video that demonstrates these consequences, and I'll believe you.

80Maxwell08:
I don't know what the hell that other guy is talking about it won't even take a full year to get 50/50 in HoM if you are actually trying.

Nahh, I know. I am not that casual, it would probably take me 2-3 months of hardcore grinding or 4-6 of semi casual grinding; but playing that game is painful and my steam library is about to burst with unused games that feel much better than GW 1, don't have any intentions of keep playing GW or joining a guild, and GW 1 solo experience is horrible compared to almost any modern MMO or single player RPG...

So those rewards can go to heck, I am not grinding them.

Tanakh:

80Maxwell08:
I don't know what the hell that other guy is talking about it won't even take a full year to get 50/50 in HoM if you are actually trying.

Nahh, I know. I am not that casual, it would probably take me 2-3 months of hardcore grinding or 4-6 of semi casual grinding; but playing that game is painful and my steam library is about to burst with unused games that feel much better than GW 1, don't have any intentions of keep playing GW or joining a guild, and GW 1 solo experience is horrible compared to almost any modern MMO or single player RPG...

So those rewards can go to heck, I am not grinding them.

My thoughts exactly hence why I only got up to 30/50 and now I just play for whatever fun I can wrangle out of it.

80Maxwell08:
My thoughts exactly hence why I only got up to 30/50 and now I just play for whatever fun I can wrangle out of it.

Has there been any word on HoM being kept after launch? If GW 2 is as good as it seems and I really fell for it, might end up farming GW 1.

This game looks great
And I'll be getting a new computer to play it on
So 'twill be pretty awesome
Going to be a thief, yeah

Tanakh:

80Maxwell08:
My thoughts exactly hence why I only got up to 30/50 and now I just play for whatever fun I can wrangle out of it.

Has there been any word on HoM being kept after launch? If GW 2 is as good as it seems and I really fell for it, might end up farming GW 1.

Well if I remember this correctly then it should remain afterward so people can go back and get stuff. It might say more on the guild wars wiki that someone linked eariler but I'm fairly certain it should.

80Maxwell08:

I don't know what the hell that other guy is talking about it won't even take a full year to get 50/50 in HoM if you are actually trying.

unless they've drastically altered the game in the last year, I don't see how you could max out all the titles in a year of playing.

all the PVE titles..yes, though cartography/vanquish can suck up a lot of time.
PVP titles? all maxed in one year? I find that hard to believe.

then you have all the gold sinks like party/sugar/drunk titles, minis, armour components...unless the economy is totally inverted from what I expect it to be...I just don't see that as being very feasible.

GrandmaFunk:

80Maxwell08:

I don't know what the hell that other guy is talking about it won't even take a full year to get 50/50 in HoM if you are actually trying.

unless they've drastically altered the game in the last year, I don't see how you could max out all the titles in a year of playing.

all the PVE titles..yes, though cartography/vanquish can suck up a lot of time.
PVP titles? all maxed in one year? I find that hard to believe.

then you have all the gold sinks like party/sugar/drunk titles, minis, armour components...unless the economy is totally inverted from what I expect it to be...I just don't see that as being very feasible.

They've drastically altered the game in the last year. Also it seriously is that easy if you are trying.

Tanakh:
Any estimations on how much time would a fresh GW character need in order to get 20-30 Hall of Monument points if the player knows nothing about GW?

I bought the first one in a steam sale, and it's lying around but playing it is a little painful, dated graphics and mechanics. Still i would force myself if i were to find a guide or if someone tell me it's not that long.

You'll need all the campagins to do some of these points, but it's not that hard and it certainly won't take "years" like the other guy said.

You get 3 points for free, just by linking your account to an NC soft account (required to transfer your HOM to GW2 anyway). Total: 3

1 Statues in the "Honor" Memorial will earn you 2 more points. You get one statue for beating each campaign (each of which can be done inside of a week of casual play, plus weekend, if you're bulldozing to the end instead of enjoying your way through the games). Factions is the fastest, other than a rather poorly-considered mid-game slog for faction reputation points.
Total: 4

4 more statues will earn you another 3 points. Assuming you complete the other two campaigns, that leaves two. An easy one is "Eternal Survivor" (Get a legendary survivor character). For the last, you can either complete one of the 5 "elite" areas (You can H/H Sorrow's Furnace, though the last leg might be tough) or get another one of the "title" statues (You should be at least Sunspear Rank 8 by the time you finish Nightfall, and double-faction weekends make for a great time to max that and/or Lightbringer rank).

Total: 7, and that's just one monument. (7/18 Honor. More available if you work on title farming).

Devotion: (Minipets) (2/8) For 40k or so, you can get a rare minipet (Lich, etc) which will give you both the points for "Any statue" and "Rare statue". You can get more points if you buy a bunch of old white minis (pretty cheap) and can get to 20/30/40/50, but the more you have the harder to get ones you don't have, and it gets more expensive. Stick with just the one rare for a start :)

Total:9

Fellowship (Ranger pets/heroes): (5/8 easy points)
1. Get MOX (Requires all 3 campaigns), add him to monument.
2. Complete "Beak of Darkness" quest in Factions quest to capture black Moa. Add it to monument.
3. Complete Factions and capture an Imperial Phoenix from the endgame area. Add it to monument
4. Capture any random ranger pet and add it to monument.,
5. Buy 1 hero armor upgrade (whatever's cheapest), upgrade a hero's armor, and add it to the monument.

Total: 14

Valor (Weapons): (3/8 points)
This can get VERY expensive if you try to fill it. Start out with an "Oppressor Weapon" of choice. You can get that after beating Prophesies. Play through the fun (if horribly balanced) "War In Kryta" questline, and get one of these as a reward. That's two points.
A destroyer weapon is about 50-60k, last I checked. By now you should be able to afford that, or at least scrape it up with little effort.

Total: 17

Resilience (Armor): 4/8 points.
Not hard at all, but possibly expensive. Buy 5 sets of elite armor. Save some money by neglecting the headpieces (they don't count anyway). Cost about 300k plus mats, but getting money is easy with a little practice. (You might save some money by going for the Eye of the North armors, since they total about 10k less crafting cost, but you'll need to grind title ranks).

Total: 21

This is just a basic idea. You can switch things around: get more titles for points in "Honor" or buy hero armor upgrades for "Fellowship" for example, to save on the cost of elite armors. You can do that inside of two or three months with light play, and you have a lot of wiggle room.

Of course, if you don't enjoy the game, which I got the impression was the case, this is all pointless. Don't force it for the sake of e-peen in GW2. There are enough 50/50 GWAMMs running around that it's not going to impress anyone, and just make you waste a lot of time while you're not even enjoying yourself.

OTOH, if you find that you do like the game and need a hand, send me a PM here, and I'll shoot you my char name.

GrandmaFunk:

80Maxwell08:

I don't know what the hell that other guy is talking about it won't even take a full year to get 50/50 in HoM if you are actually trying.

unless they've drastically altered the game in the last year, I don't see how you could max out all the titles in a year of playing.

all the PVE titles..yes, though cartography/vanquish can suck up a lot of time.
PVP titles? all maxed in one year? I find that hard to believe.

then you have all the gold sinks like party/sugar/drunk titles, minis, armour components...unless the economy is totally inverted from what I expect it to be...I just don't see that as being very feasible.

You don't actually need to max out all the titles to get 50/50. Most PvP statues only require Rank 4 or lower, and you only need the statues for the points. I got Eternal Zaishen in two months of half-assed farming in Zaishen Elite and Jade Quarry; it is possible get to rank 4 (200 keys) significantly faster than I did.

The only reason to max them is bragging rights or GWAMM, and that takes bloody forever.

On topic: I'm really quite excited by all this press beta stuff. There is SO MUCH MORE than those few videos... even Guru can't keep up with all of it. But they're trying.

woodaba:

GrandmaFunk:

woodaba:

Have you played the game, Officer Fanboy? No? Then, tell me, where's the proof that these consequences exist? Hmm? Because all I've heard or seen is the word of the devs

the "proof" would be in the reports from the hundreds of ppl that played the game last year at various game conventions, the videos posted online and the various articles by journalists who have gotten to try the game.

also, nice tone, captain douchy.

Sorry, just find it difficult to take someone seriously when their title declares their rabid fanboyism before they even open their mouths.

Game journalism isn't worth anything. Previews mean precisely fuck all. Remember the early previews of Jurrasic Park: Trespasser? Remember the game? I rest my case.

Show me one video that demonstrates these consequences, and I'll believe you.

Totalbiscuit did an event where a camp had been overrrun, where he took it back, and as a result a camp appeared.

Here it is at about 8:10 or so, goes to about 11:30. It is a success consequence, there have been no videos of a failure consequence, simply because if you have just a few people attempting them, you will probably succeed. If the event is ignored, then it fails.

GrandmaFunk:

80Maxwell08:

I don't know what the hell that other guy is talking about it won't even take a full year to get 50/50 in HoM if you are actually trying.

unless they've drastically altered the game in the last year, I don't see how you could max out all the titles in a year of playing.

all the PVE titles..yes, though cartography/vanquish can suck up a lot of time.
PVP titles? all maxed in one year? I find that hard to believe.

then you have all the gold sinks like party/sugar/drunk titles, minis, armour components...unless the economy is totally inverted from what I expect it to be...I just don't see that as being very feasible.

OP wasn't talking 50 out of 50. He said 20-30 out of 50.

Also, you don't need all PvP titles for 50/50. You need 1. You can also eschew several of the cash titles if you play enough of the game. And there's no shortage of cash to be had with a halfway decent farm.

woodaba:

Have you played the game, Officer Fanboy? No? Then, tell me, where's the proof that these consequences exist? Hmm? Because all I've heard or seen is the word of the devs, and anyone with a passing experience of Peter Molyenuex knows that isn't worth shit.

Also, by raids I mean Raid groups, not those boring-as-shit collection of rooms you run into in every modern MMO and spam the the number keys. And while there is no healer, there are certainly support abilities, and I stand by my point. There will be supporters, there will be tanks, there will be DPS. I stand to be corrected when the game comes out, but I have seen NOTHING that tells me that the Holy Trinity is gone.

You realize there is no real tanking skills in GW2? That boss aggro varies between boss and some attack based on damage done to them (so Your idea of dpser would suddenly become a tank), based on who is nearest party member or completely randomly and You can't just say that Guy A tanks? No taunting or anything silly like that. You take a beating and Your teams job is to make sure You don't die by using their support skills or bringing You up when You get knocked down.

Then again You made up Your mind. Good for You. I won't cry. Hope You won't either.

targren:
Of course, if you don't enjoy the game, which I got the impression was the case, this is all pointless. Don't force it for the sake of e-peen in GW2. There are enough 50/50 GWAMMs running around that it's not going to impress anyone, and just make you waste a lot of time while you're not even enjoying yourself.

OTOH, if you find that you do like the game and need a hand, send me a PM here, and I'll shoot you my char name.

Nahh, I dont enjoy GW 1, I would have done it back in the day, but ATM i am already running late in playing ToR, Skyrim and Witcher (for my RPG needs) while doing casual SC II and DotA 2 to keep some edge for PvP. Reading your post has convinced me NEVER to do that :D

A shame, it seems like a game i would have loved to death in 2005.

2xDouble:
...
On topic: I'm really quite excited by all this press beta stuff. There is SO MUCH MORE than those few videos... even Guru can't keep up with all of it. But they're trying.

Ooh, I'll be sure to add that link into the main post. Thanks for the heads up.

Keava:

You realize there is no real tanking skills in GW2? That boss aggro varies between boss and some attack based on damage done to them (so Your idea of dpser would suddenly become a tank), based on who is nearest party member or completely randomly and You can't just say that Guy A tanks? No taunting or anything silly like that. You take a beating and Your teams job is to make sure You don't die by using their support skills or bringing You up when You get knocked down.

In all fairness, there were very few tanking skills in GW1, either, until the meta got clever with the combinations, and for a long time, Holy Trinity was alive and well.

My biggest fear is that the combat may become less accessible... I'll be seriously bummed if I can't con my girlfriend into playing with me because she can't do the combat (she still maintains that getting her the Trilogy + EotN in 2008 was the best Valentine's Day present ever. We got a lot of mileage out of it).

woodaba:

Korten12:

woodaba:
raids and the like, you're being very naive. Many MMOs have come and claimed the exact same thing

Thiis invalidates anything as there is NO RAIDs.

And no there is no holy trinity, no class has a set of skills that would allow them to dedicate to healing so being a healer only, you won't be doing much.

The Public questing system (in fact the questing system as a whole) is just a copy-pasting of warhammer's system. It's not new.

Your trolling.

So in Warhammer, if you failed a public quest, a town would burn down and you would have to save it? Or if you succeeded you would need to push back the enemies back to their fort.

Or stop an army from invading and slowly taking over the zone and setting up outposts and expanding...

Yeah, sounds like Warhammers static public quests that held no coseqences.

Have you played the game, Officer Fanboy? No? Then, tell me, where's the proof that these consequences exist? Hmm? Because all I've heard or seen is the word of the devs, and anyone with a passing experience of Peter Molyenuex knows that isn't worth shit.

Also, by raids I mean Raid groups, not those boring-as-shit collection of rooms you run into in every modern MMO and spam the the number keys. And while there is no healer, there are certainly support abilities, and I stand by my point. There will be supporters, there will be tanks, there will be DPS. I stand to be corrected when the game comes out, but I have seen NOTHING that tells me that the Holy Trinity is gone.

they talk about how dymanic events work here http://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/dynamic-events/dynamic-events-overview/
they talk about how healing and death work here
http://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/dynamic-events/dynamic-events-overview/
in fact just go to the main site and all your complaining gets answered.

I've got high hopes for this game, from everything I've read and heard. Even if it doesn't turn out to be any better than WoW or Rift from a gameplay standpoint, it'll still be better than them overall on the grounds that there's no subscription fee.

But my overall impression is the game is going to be much better than just being "as good as WoW." The plot looks clever and well thought-out, the graphics, from the in-game clips I've seen, look better than WoW and about on the same level as Rift. Gameplay, from what I've heard (and I've not gotten around to watching the beta videos yet, only the clips from the GW2 website showing various in-game profession skills and gameplay trailers) is supposed to have a number of innovations that move away from the standard one-click-combat mechanics. The persistent world is supposed to have some new mechanics for in-game interactions with the world around you and there's supposed to be plenty of options for character appearance customizing, both in character bodies and with armor and clothing. Questing is supposed to be handled differently from the standard "kill 10 rats then come back to me for a reward" structure, too.

I think all the elements are here for a real ground-breaker. If promises are made good on and expectations lived up to, this could potentially be the game that unseats WoW on the MMO throne.

Worgen:

woodaba:

Korten12:

Thiis invalidates anything as there is NO RAIDs.

And no there is no holy trinity, no class has a set of skills that would allow them to dedicate to healing so being a healer only, you won't be doing much.

Your trolling.

So in Warhammer, if you failed a public quest, a town would burn down and you would have to save it? Or if you succeeded you would need to push back the enemies back to their fort.

Or stop an army from invading and slowly taking over the zone and setting up outposts and expanding...

Yeah, sounds like Warhammers static public quests that held no coseqences.

Have you played the game, Officer Fanboy? No? Then, tell me, where's the proof that these consequences exist? Hmm? Because all I've heard or seen is the word of the devs, and anyone with a passing experience of Peter Molyenuex knows that isn't worth shit.

Also, by raids I mean Raid groups, not those boring-as-shit collection of rooms you run into in every modern MMO and spam the the number keys. And while there is no healer, there are certainly support abilities, and I stand by my point. There will be supporters, there will be tanks, there will be DPS. I stand to be corrected when the game comes out, but I have seen NOTHING that tells me that the Holy Trinity is gone.

they talk about how dymanic events work here http://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/dynamic-events/dynamic-events-overview/
they talk about how healing and death work here
http://www.guildwars2.com/en/the-game/dynamic-events/dynamic-events-overview/
in fact just go to the main site and all your complaining gets answered.

Missed the point of my post. I said you shouldn't really trust what a developer says as 100% true.

Berenzen:

woodaba:

GrandmaFunk:

the "proof" would be in the reports from the hundreds of ppl that played the game last year at various game conventions, the videos posted online and the various articles by journalists who have gotten to try the game.

also, nice tone, captain douchy.

Sorry, just find it difficult to take someone seriously when their title declares their rabid fanboyism before they even open their mouths.

Game journalism isn't worth anything. Previews mean precisely fuck all. Remember the early previews of Jurrasic Park: Trespasser? Remember the game? I rest my case.

Show me one video that demonstrates these consequences, and I'll believe you.

Totalbiscuit did an event where a camp had been overrrun, where he took it back, and as a result a camp appeared.

Here it is at about 8:10 or so, goes to about 11:30. It is a success consequence, there have been no videos of a failure consequence, simply because if you have just a few people attempting them, you will probably succeed. If the event is ignored, then it fails.

Well, I hadn't seen that, and it looks pretty cool. I still don't think its as amazing or as revolutionary a system as people say, I recall something like that being in Planetside.

That said, I apologise. I stand corrected, though I'm not taking back my opinion that the game is being way too overhyped and overrated.

I like the look of the game more now, though. Thanks!

Keava:

woodaba:

Have you played the game, Officer Fanboy? No? Then, tell me, where's the proof that these consequences exist? Hmm? Because all I've heard or seen is the word of the devs, and anyone with a passing experience of Peter Molyenuex knows that isn't worth shit.

Also, by raids I mean Raid groups, not those boring-as-shit collection of rooms you run into in every modern MMO and spam the the number keys. And while there is no healer, there are certainly support abilities, and I stand by my point. There will be supporters, there will be tanks, there will be DPS. I stand to be corrected when the game comes out, but I have seen NOTHING that tells me that the Holy Trinity is gone.

You realize there is no real tanking skills in GW2? That boss aggro varies between boss and some attack based on damage done to them (so Your idea of dpser would suddenly become a tank), based on who is nearest party member or completely randomly and You can't just say that Guy A tanks? No taunting or anything silly like that. You take a beating and Your teams job is to make sure You don't die by using their support skills or bringing You up when You get knocked down.

Then again You made up Your mind. Good for You. I won't cry. Hope You won't either.

The word "you" shouldn't be capitalized like that. Grammar Nazi, away!

That doesn't mean there won't be tanks. Tanking will be done differently in GW2, and Tank specs will be different than most games in GW2, I never disputed that. I am not believing anyone when they say that The Holy Trinity is gone until I play the game. Yes, I'm going to play the game. It looks good! I am legitimately excited for it. But, I'm not going to make up stuff that isn't there in my eyes. I'm a cynic. It's what I do.

targren:
My biggest fear is that the combat may become less accessible... I'll be seriously bummed if I can't con my girlfriend into playing with me because she can't do the combat (she still maintains that getting her the Trilogy + EotN in 2008 was the best Valentine's Day present ever. We got a lot of mileage out of it).

It's an MMO, there will be always content you two can do together. And if she is casual then in any MMO that content would be non bleeding edge, more farmy stuff, so... really I don't see the issue.

Curiously enough, the twitchy combat and the (hopefully) PvP focus are my biggest 2 reasons to want this game; hated PvP and PvP balance being an aftertought in almost every MMO, hated specially in WoW (even thought it was not the worse on that). You might be right on it not being a fit for you two.

Edit: Then again you two can buy it and have fun there if you do a good sales pitch for it and play taking care of her being happy :D

Edit 2: If you focus on 2 player RPGs, I would consider giving a try to Skyrim multiplayer mods.

targren:

Keava:

You realize there is no real tanking skills in GW2? That boss aggro varies between boss and some attack based on damage done to them (so Your idea of dpser would suddenly become a tank), based on who is nearest party member or completely randomly and You can't just say that Guy A tanks? No taunting or anything silly like that. You take a beating and Your teams job is to make sure You don't die by using their support skills or bringing You up when You get knocked down.

In all fairness, there were very few tanking skills in GW1, either, until the meta got clever with the combinations, and for a long time, Holy Trinity was alive and well.

My biggest fear is that the combat may become less accessible... I'll be seriously bummed if I can't con my girlfriend into playing with me because she can't do the combat (she still maintains that getting her the Trilogy + EotN in 2008 was the best Valentine's Day present ever. We got a lot of mileage out of it).

GW1 had much more role dedicated classes however. You had things like direct heals, etc. As for combat... it actually looks more accessible, much more streamlined and easier to comprehend on basic level. Generally GW2 gives me the vibe of "easy to pick up, hard to master". For Your girlfriends casual needs I'm sure it won't much much of a hassle, but if anyone is looking for more competitive game play there is plenty of potential for smart use of available weapon skill sets.
If You watch some of the "average" vids You will see how whole lot of people just spam the basic attack-chain (since certain attacks can chain into next skill, so pressing 1 first time does attack A, pressing it again performs different attack, and then final attack on 3rd keypress) so if anything it should actually feel smoother and easier than GW1.

woodaba:

Keava:

You realize there is no real tanking skills in GW2? That boss aggro varies between boss and some attack based on damage done to them (so Your idea of dpser would suddenly become a tank), based on who is nearest party member or completely randomly and You can't just say that Guy A tanks? No taunting or anything silly like that. You take a beating and Your teams job is to make sure You don't die by using their support skills or bringing You up when You get knocked down.

Then again You made up Your mind. Good for You. I won't cry. Hope You won't either.

The word "you" shouldn't be capitalized like that. Grammar Nazi, away!

That doesn't mean there won't be tanks. Tanking will be done differently in GW2, and Tank specs will be different than most games in GW2, I never disputed that. I am not believing anyone when they say that The Holy Trinity is gone until I play the game. Yes, I'm going to play the game. It looks good! I am legitimately excited for it. But, I'm not going to make up stuff that isn't there in my eyes. I'm a cynic. It's what I do.

Ok. I am going to head this off right here. The devs never said they were getting rid of all trinities, they said they were getting rid of the Holy Trinity of Tank-Heal-DPS. The new system is Control-Support-Damage, a 'soft' trinity if you will. People will still fill these rolls, but all classes will be able to fill them on the fly. A Controller does just that- controls the enemy, they debuff them with stuff like vulnerability or weakness, cripple them, or yes, maybe taking a hit or two, however they won't be able to stand in front of the creature and just get wailed on, they'll either get loss of interest, or get slaughtered, armor does not make a massive difference in this game. I think an armor comparison in one of the demos showed only something like a 15 or 20 percent difference between light armor and heavy armor.

The supporter is where the people that love to heal will probably feel best at home with. These people are the buffers, the saviours. They will put down the walls that can reflect missiles, put the restoration, or aegis or other boons onto nearby characters. There are even some basic healing spells in a supporter's repetoire. However, these healing spells are just additions, a supporter will not be able to singlehandedly keep a health-bar topped with just their healing spells. The self healing spells will be the main componenent of healing in this game.

The last role- the Damager- hasn't really changed much from the idea of DPS- what can you really change? The damager is all about just laying waste to their enemies, they put down the poison and burning and lay waste to their enemies. However, this role seems to be a bit more uncommon, there are only a few weapon sets/toolkits/attunements that really focus on this role, many of the other sets play more towards the other two roles, not to mention, all of the weapon skills that a supporter or controller has also can deal a massive amount of damage. The idea of the straight up damager is still there, it's just been reduced.

So those are the three roles. What Arenanet is trying to do is to get people to be able to fluidly switch between these roles even in mid-combat. I plan on rolling an elementalist, and from what it looks like, I can switch from the pure damage role(fire), to a supporter role(water), to a controlling role (earth), to a bit of an amalgamation between all three (air). And I'll be able to do this mid-combat, be able to fill in any role that might need more focus on, then when less focus is needed there, switch to another role. It's not going to be, OK I'm tank and that's the only role I am going to have for this entire dungeon.

Gamebreaker has a video of the Ascalon Catacombs dungeon(The only dungeon available to the press in the Beta- they capped out the Beta at 30, which is the level the first dungeon is at), which shows the way the party works in GW2. It can be found here

Tanakh:

Curiously enough, the twitchy combat and the (hopefully) PvP focus are my biggest 2 reasons to want this game; hated PvP and PvP balance being an aftertought in almost every MMO, hated specially in WoW (even thought it was not the worse on that). You might be right on it not being a fit for you two.

Edit: Then again you two can buy it and have fun there if you do a good sales pitch for it and play taking care of her being happy :D

Edit 2: If you focus on 2 player RPGs, I would consider giving a try to Skyrim multiplayer mods.

I hope you're wrong about the PvP focus, since that really hobbled the original Guild Wars in its early stages. Even when I'm playing something she doesn't, I have no interest in it at all, and when it bleeds over into PvE (usually in the form of heavy-handed nerfs, in GW's case) it's a real killjoy.

I'm not so much worried about it being too hard for her as it being too fast. Sometimes, 3-D games give her vertigo. For some reason, GW didn't, and if GW2 doesn't, then she'll be willing to learn to play it.

She can't play Skyrim on her PC and, even if she could, I doubt the mod is any good.

Berenzen:

woodaba:

Keava:

You realize there is no real tanking skills in GW2? That boss aggro varies between boss and some attack based on damage done to them (so Your idea of dpser would suddenly become a tank), based on who is nearest party member or completely randomly and You can't just say that Guy A tanks? No taunting or anything silly like that. You take a beating and Your teams job is to make sure You don't die by using their support skills or bringing You up when You get knocked down.

Then again You made up Your mind. Good for You. I won't cry. Hope You won't either.

The word "you" shouldn't be capitalized like that. Grammar Nazi, away!

That doesn't mean there won't be tanks. Tanking will be done differently in GW2, and Tank specs will be different than most games in GW2, I never disputed that. I am not believing anyone when they say that The Holy Trinity is gone until I play the game. Yes, I'm going to play the game. It looks good! I am legitimately excited for it. But, I'm not going to make up stuff that isn't there in my eyes. I'm a cynic. It's what I do.

Ok. I am going to head this off right here. The devs never said they were getting rid of all trinities, they said they were getting rid of the Holy Trinity of Tank-Heal-DPS. The new system is Control-Support-Damage, a 'soft' trinity if you will. People will still fill these rolls, but all classes will be able to fill them on the fly. A Controller does just that- controls the enemy, they debuff them with stuff like vulnerability or weakness, cripple them, or yes, maybe taking a hit or two, however they won't be able to stand in front of the creature and just get wailed on, they'll either get loss of interest, or get slaughtered, armor does not make a massive difference in this game. I think an armor comparison in one of the demos showed only something like a 15 or 20 percent difference between light armor and heavy armor.

The supporter is where the people that love to heal will probably feel best at home with. These people are the buffers, the saviours. They will put down the walls that can reflect missiles, put the restoration, or aegis or other boons onto nearby characters. There are even some basic healing spells in a supporter's repetoire. However, these healing spells are just additions, a supporter will not be able to singlehandedly keep a health-bar topped with just their healing spells. The self healing spells will be the main componenent of healing in this game.

The last role- the Damager- hasn't really changed much from the idea of DPS- what can you really change? The damager is all about just laying waste to their enemies, they put down the poison and burning and lay waste to their enemies. However, this role seems to be a bit more uncommon, there are only a few weapon sets/toolkits/attunements that really focus on this role, many of the other sets play more towards the other two roles, not to mention, all of the weapon skills that a supporter or controller has also can deal a massive amount of damage. The idea of the straight up damager is still there, it's just been reduced.

So those are the three roles. What Arenanet is trying to do is to get people to be able to fluidly switch between these roles even in mid-combat. I plan on rolling an elementalist, and from what it looks like, I can switch from the pure damage role(fire), to a supporter role(water), to a controlling role (earth), to a bit of an amalgamation between all three (air). And I'll be able to do this mid-combat, be able to fill in any role that might need more focus on, then when less focus is needed there, switch to another role. It's not going to be, OK I'm tank and that's the only role I am going to have for this entire dungeon.

Gamebreaker has a video of the ascalon catacombs dungeon, which shows the way the party works in GW2. It can be found here

Isn't controller exactly what tanks do? Y'know, controlling mobs to ensure they target who you want them to target? Supporter sounds just like a healer with support abilities, and damager is just DPS.

The Holy Trinity is still there. That is not a bad thing in and of itself. It's dominance has been reduced, and you are no longer stuck in one area of a the trinity.

But, when it comes right down to it, when you're going after a big quest, or heart, or whatever, there will be DPS'ers, there will be Controllers, and there will be supporters. I don't mean to sound stubborn or rude, but, from my point of view, the Trinity is still there. Yes it works differently. Yes, it's been rebranded. But it's still there, and if you think otherwise, you have been misinformed, you are kidding yourself, or you are a raging fanboy unwittingly creating advertising for ArenaNet. /opinion

targren:
I'm not so much worried about it being too hard for her as it being too fast. Sometimes, 3-D games give her vertigo. For some reason, GW didn't, and if GW2 doesn't, then she'll be willing to learn to play it.

She can't play Skyrim on her PC and, even if she could, I doubt the mod is any good.

Ohh, have been there ( in the "3-D games give her vertigo" camp), my solution was to give her seabands.

About the skyrim stuff, it works right now, but it's buggy and in alpha, the problem is obv the game wasn't coded for that, but SKSE might solve this, and quoting the autor (lazy quote)

"It will not be an MMO like I said on the forums it will be a Guild Wars like system, crowded cities but instanced outside of cities (you would only see your party's members).

Anywho still working on it when I have time.
And mostly waiting for SKSE updates."

So i would keep an eye on this.

targren:

I hope you're wrong about the PvP focus, since that really hobbled the original Guild Wars in its early stages. Even when I'm playing something she doesn't, I have no interest in it at all, and when it bleeds over into PvE (usually in the form of heavy-handed nerfs, in GW's case) it's a real killjoy.

I'm not so much worried about it being too hard for her as it being too fast. Sometimes, 3-D games give her vertigo. For some reason, GW didn't, and if GW2 doesn't, then she'll be willing to learn to play it.

She can't play Skyrim on her PC and, even if she could, I doubt the mod is any good.

They're going to focus on PvP and PvE equally, trying to avoid balance issues that hobble one side of the game or the other. It doesn't seem like it's going to be too fast, at least, not at first. From the beta footage that we've got, it seems like it is fairly forgiving, you can take a power attack to the face, but you won't be able to take every single one. It's probably so you can learn. Apparently the explorable mode dungeons are tougher than nails, so you'll probably want to be fairly skilled before taking those on. The rest though, shouldn't be too bad.

targren:

Tanakh:

Curiously enough, the twitchy combat and the (hopefully) PvP focus are my biggest 2 reasons to want this game; hated PvP and PvP balance being an aftertought in almost every MMO, hated specially in WoW (even thought it was not the worse on that). You might be right on it not being a fit for you two.

Edit: Then again you two can buy it and have fun there if you do a good sales pitch for it and play taking care of her being happy :D

Edit 2: If you focus on 2 player RPGs, I would consider giving a try to Skyrim multiplayer mods.

I hope you're wrong about the PvP focus, since that really hobbled the original Guild Wars in its early stages. Even when I'm playing something she doesn't, I have no interest in it at all, and when it bleeds over into PvE (usually in the form of heavy-handed nerfs, in GW's case) it's a real killjoy.

I'm not so much worried about it being too hard for her as it being too fast. Sometimes, 3-D games give her vertigo. For some reason, GW didn't, and if GW2 doesn't, then she'll be willing to learn to play it.

She can't play Skyrim on her PC and, even if she could, I doubt the mod is any good.

It's been said by ArenaNet that they're trying to focus on both equally. There won't be any nonsense where you have to PVE to get good PVP gear, or vis versa. Even players that you kill in PVP will drop gold and items. Real items, not stupid vendor trash items (though I'm sure those will be there too). You can really do any of it with out being punished for not doing the other parts. or you can do both AND your personal story.

As for combat: From the videos i've seen, it looks much slower than WoW (i've not played GW1 pvp) when you're going against other people. The pace is a bit slower, and the fights take a LOT longer. No 3 second burn and you're dead before you come out of a stun. That's not to say there isn't skill involved, but you'll actually have time to acknowledge that a fight is happening, before you die :)

woodaba:

Berenzen:
snip

Isn't controller exactly what tanks do? Y'know, controlling mobs to ensure they target who you want them to target? Supporter sounds just like a healer with support abilities, and damager is just DPS.

The Holy Trinity is still there. That is not a bad thing in and of itself. It's dominance has been reduced, and you are no longer stuck in one area of a the trinity.

But, when it comes right down to it, when you're going after a big quest, or heart, or whatever, there will be DPS'ers, there will be Controllers, and there will be supporters. I don't mean to sound stubborn or rude, but, from my point of view, the Trinity is still there. Yes it works differently. Yes, it's been rebranded. But it's still there, and if you think otherwise, you have been misinformed, you are kidding yourself, or you are a raging fanboy unwittingly creating advertising for ArenaNet. /opinion

I never said that the trinity wasn't there, I said that the idea of the 'Tank'- the guy that just absorbs hits- or the pure 'healer' has been melded into something a little bit more broad. The devs never said that they completely got rid of the trinity, that's something that has been corrupted by the telephone game.

One thing that I do disagree with what you said is that the supporter is a healer with a few support abilities, instead it's more like a buffer- and some combinations have a couple healing abilities that can help someone out a little bit. There are 27 skills in the entire game that grant the regeneration boon, and only 18 that do direct healing. Of those 18, 9 of them do healing to allies, and most of those have long cooldowns.

The only thing I'm on the fence about is deciding which profession I'm going to start with, lol.

Berenzen:

woodaba:

Berenzen:
snip

Isn't controller exactly what tanks do? Y'know, controlling mobs to ensure they target who you want them to target? Supporter sounds just like a healer with support abilities, and damager is just DPS.

The Holy Trinity is still there. That is not a bad thing in and of itself. It's dominance has been reduced, and you are no longer stuck in one area of a the trinity.

But, when it comes right down to it, when you're going after a big quest, or heart, or whatever, there will be DPS'ers, there will be Controllers, and there will be supporters. I don't mean to sound stubborn or rude, but, from my point of view, the Trinity is still there. Yes it works differently. Yes, it's been rebranded. But it's still there, and if you think otherwise, you have been misinformed, you are kidding yourself, or you are a raging fanboy unwittingly creating advertising for ArenaNet. /opinion

I never said that the trinity wasn't there, I said that the idea of the 'Tank'- the guy that just absorbs hits- or the pure 'healer' has been melded into something a little bit more broad. The devs never said that they completely got rid of the trinity, that's something that has been corrupted by the telephone game.

One thing that I do disagree with what you said is that the supporter is a healer with a few support abilities, instead it's more like a buffer- and some combinations have a couple healing abilities that can help someone out a little bit. There are 27 skills in the entire game that grant the regeneration boon, and only 18 that do direct healing. Of those 18, 9 of them do healing to allies, and most of those have long cooldowns.

I know, I was just clarifying it to the raging fanboys that seem to be everywhere. I stand by my original statement, with one minor ommission after seeing that TotalBiscuit video.

By the way, your knowledge of the game is nothing less than creepy. Are you one of the devs? If so, good job, keep up the hard work, looking forward to the game.

If not, well, thats just scary. 0_0

woodaba:

I know, I was just clarifying it to the raging fanboys that seem to be everywhere. I stand by my original statement, with one minor ommission after seeing that TotalBiscuit video.

By the way, your knowledge of the game is nothing less than creepy. Are you one of the devs? If so, good job, keep up the hard work, looking forward to the game.

If not, well, thats just scary. 0_0

No, but I've done a lot of work on the wiki, and I have a very good memory. I was also part of the Test Krewe for GW1, but that's about as close as being on the dev team that I was, and that's pretty far off.

Nexxis:
The only thing I'm on the fence about is deciding which profession I'm going to start with, lol.

I already know I'm jumping right into an Engineer. Flamethrowers, Turrets and a Shield spell that lets me hold and fire spells back at people? Yes please!

Keava:

Can we really stop using the "WoW-clone" term? WoW was nothing more than iteration upon EQ.

I'm not sure what would irritate me more, GW2 getting the predictable and downright retarded "OMG its just a WoW-clone why can't anyone be original" (because evidently you have to completely revolutionize the entire gaming industry every time you make a game) OR if it didn't get any of that because I would so often immediately see "can't wait for GW2, it will completely revolutionize the entire gaming industry" after the aforementioned bitching.

It's lose-lose for me. Edit: Actually, I would consider it a win if the aforementioned people just threw themselves off a cliff.

LetalisK:

Keava:

Can we really stop using the "WoW-clone" term? WoW was nothing more than iteration upon EQ.

I'm not sure what would irritate me more, GW2 getting the predictable and downright retarded "OMG its just a WoW-clone why can't anyone be original" (because evidently you have to completely revolutionize the entire gaming industry every time you make a game) OR if it didn't get any of that because I would so often immediately see "can't wait for GW2, it will completely revolutionize the entire gaming industry" after the aforementioned bitching.

It's lose-lose for me. Edit: Actually, I would consider it a win if the aforementioned people just threw themselves off a cliff.

There's easy solution. Don't bother with what people are saying, since never, neither fanbois nor haters are right. Both groups exaggerate either the games flaws or merits. And as for people constantly moaning about "genre changing", They simply mean that they have no idea what They really want.
Design, of pretty much anything, not just games, is all about iteration and improving previous ideas. If something changes the core ideas too much it instantly becomes unfamiliar which leads to people not wanting to waste time to learn everything from scratch. It's like asking FPS genre to suddenly not be about running and shooting dudes while in first person perspective.

I used to tell people that moan about "clones" to go try EVE Online. They often respond "But it's too hard to get into and so complicated and i have no character avatar to run around with and kill mobs. and can't really play it forever alone (insert more complaints that the game is not like WoW)".

woodaba:
I know, I was just clarifying it to the raging fanboys that seem to be everywhere. I stand by my original statement, with one minor ommission after seeing that TotalBiscuit video.

Can we PLEASE throw this word the fuck out already? It's an ad hominem attack, it's against the TOS, and I'm getting tired of reading it in 9 out 10 topics. I know it's fun to just insult people rather than discuss the topic at hand, but this is some seriously exhausting shit.

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