Has Halo been forever ruined?

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I keep seeing people say that random weapon drops destroy teamwork and that teamwork is the foundation of the series. In all my years of playing Halo I don't think I've ever heard anyone actually trying to legitimately strategize, and the closest people ever came were all in modes that only had starting weapons anyways like SWAT. None of these are massive changes, it's just evolution and the series has evolved before. We'll live.

Besides, there is still that thing called the campaign. You know, that thing that everyone remembers from the first Halo but that everyone seems to have stopped talking about after 2. The thing that served as the primary reason why I kept buying these games. Maybe that'll be good right?

As a long time Halo fan, I have to say no, not even freaking close. As one person once said on this very website "people always fly off of the hook when they learn about game mechanics, when what really matters is not which game mechanics are used, but how they work within the context of the game." or something like that. And considering that we know bugger all about how this game is going to work, I say that these cries of "RUINED FOREVER!" Are rather premature. OH NO now you can see through walls, that's slightly better than the radar which told you exactly where people are and if they were above or below you. It seems like a useless ability to be honest.

Also power weapon camping is now impossible? THANK YOU!

The best part is that anything that might resemble CoD gets instantly hated. Is it so damn hard to just wait and see and play the game when it comes out and go from there?

SmashLovesTitanQuest:
Its just not Halo anymore. Halo is dead.

Not truly dead... Just evolved in a way that many of you don't enjoy. I, for one, like the way reach plays, but I also adore the way 3 played as well. Personally, I'd love more of a combination of the two..

OT: I'm more pissed about not being able to be an Elite in 4.
So I taught myself how to make most of the Elite sounds for nothing? Naw, kidding. that's just fun!
I'm always an Elite when I can be... This is really disappointing :(

Well maybe the single player will be lengthy and robust...and I can't even finish that sentence since we all know FPS titles are almost always laser-focused on multiplayer.

Dansen:

Just so I can understand where you are coming from, what do you think makes Halo multiplayer what it is?

Certainly not where weapons spawn! Good level design (mostly), varied game modes. Teamwork (but no spawn killing), Chaos and throw in some great vehicles for good measure :)

Very balanced weapons, and i suppose now using the armor abilities to your advantage.

Plus the art design etc.

Thats what makes halo for me.

Shoggoth2588:
Well maybe the single player will be lengthy and robust...and I can't even finish that sentence since we all know FPS titles are almost always laser-focused on multiplayer.

Halo has had stronger campaigns than most shooters. Except 2.

One Epic Phail:
I guess if you like everything being changed to the Call of Duty style of multiplayer and gameplay, it's alright.

Wait... it hasn't always been like that? I never really saw Halo as much more than Call of Duty in space. Two weapon limit, regenerating health, overpowered vehicles.

I never cared to play Halo much (never play my consoles online since I can't really aim for shit with analog sticks while sober), but the multiplayer pissed me off constantly (the few times I did split screen). Shields were the worst thing to ever come to gaming. When I shoot a guy with a rocket, then they can hide behind a rock and be back to full health in a matter of seconds, something is wrong. Same reason why I would only play Call of Duty on hardcore mode (CoD2/4/5 - sucked after that).

One Epic Phail:
I guess if you like everything being changed to the Call of Duty style of multiplayer and gameplay, it's alright.

Halo 4 will essentially be a re-skin of Reach.

I'm sorry to tell you this, but you don't get to say a game is being completely overhauled and that it's also the same as the previous game. Pick a complaint and stick with it.

EDIT: I guess I should make my post more substantial.

I'm not a fan of the instant respawns, and I'm not sure what to think of the randomly spawning power weapons, but if they just make the power weapons harder to use effectively or at least include a playlist that makes them appear in set locations, then I don't mind. I'm more interested in the single player, anyways.

SmashLovesTitanQuest:
Yes.

Did you see the leaks from that magazine? Instant respawns, a perk that lets you see through walls, powerful weapons drop on the map in random position, class loadouts....

Its just not Halo anymore. Halo is dead.

o wow that sounds pretty fucked up. (I was looking forward to the game but not as much as previous ones so I wasn't really reading up on it.)

Give me a good campaign and I'm a-okay. Multiplayer has always come second for me. The best mode is campaign co-op for me.

Also, I would be Master Chief's baby mamma if he every wanted little Spartan babies walking around, under the circumstance I was cryogenically frozen for over 500 years and Halo is our future.

daveman247:

Shoggoth2588:
Well maybe the single player will be lengthy and robust...and I can't even finish that sentence since we all know FPS titles are almost always laser-focused on multiplayer.

Halo has had stronger campaigns than most shooters. Except 2.

Halo was the first game to ever make me say "this is stupid" and quit playing the campaign, I never went back to it after that. Halo 2 was falsely marketed... "The battle has come to earth" ... yeah, for a whole 10 minutes. That was the only entertaining and replayable part of the entire game. Never played through the rest, but saw some people playing 3 and it didn't look much better. So, I completely disagree with you there.

Shoggoth2588:
Well maybe the single player will be lengthy and robust...and I can't even finish that sentence since we all know FPS titles are almost always laser-focused on multiplayer.

Disagree with that, too. Yeah, your generic shooters are focused on multiplayer (Halo, Call of Duty, Battlefield), but there are tons that are focused on, or at least take the time to make a decent campaign (most id Games, Crytek games until the horrid Crysis 2, Polish FPS titles [Hard Reset, Painkiller, NecroVisioN], Bulletstorm), and I could go on for a bit.

I hated the entire idea of continuing the trilogy. This new info only makes me even sadder about it. Some of the stuff they're adding is interesting, but most of it? Other games have done before. And I don't trust 343 to make the story very well, considering what we know of it. It already sounds a little stupid. Also, "Forerunner Vision". What. The. Hell. This isn't fucking Batman with his Detective Mode. Why the fuck would you add in an X-Ray power to Halo?

Edit: Since I didn't really answer the question posed by the thread. No. I refuse to say it's ruined forever until I've actually played it. Am I skeptical? Hell yes. I don't trust 343. I may hate the idea of continuing the trilogy, but I also refuse to cry out "RUINED FOREVER!!" until I've been able to play it long enough to have experienced all the new changes. Who knows, maybe the new trilogy will be better than the first? Wouldn't that be awesome?

erttheking:
As a long time Halo fan, I have to say no, not even freaking close. As one person once said on this very website "people always fly off of the hook when they learn about game mechanics, when what really matters is not which game mechanics are used, but how they work within the context of the game." or something like that. And considering that we know bugger all about how this game is going to work, I say that these cries of "RUINED FOREVER!" Are rather premature. OH NO now you can see through walls, that's slightly better than the radar which told you exactly where people are and if they were above or below you. It seems like a useless ability to be honest.

It's fine to judge mechanics on how they function in the system but Halo that doesnt feel like Halo is still a dissapointment.

Random weapon drops are really indefensible no matter how you look at. Tho it's something that can be fixed easily once they patch in the MLG playlist.

...Well, by now, what hasn't been ruined forever? Let me check some 2012 releases-

-Final Fantasy XIII-2: Ruined by XIII.

-Soul Calibur V: Don't know, pretty sure everyone hated 3 or 4 but it was never really popular in the first place.

-The Darkness II: Ruined by not being like the first game.

-Alan Wake's American Nightmare: Ruined for being to actiony.

-SSX: Ruined for being too serious and having Survive It runs.

-Mass Effect 3: No fucking explanation needed.

-Silent Hill: Downpour: Ruined a long time ago, was it 3 that was the last "good" one?

-Ninja Gaiden 3: Ruined because it sucks.

Actually, this is kinda fun. Let's go back to 2011 because we can.

-Star Wars: The Old Republic: Ruined KotOR by not being KotOR 3.

-Assassin's Creed: Revelations: Ruined because of yearly releases and multiplayer.

-Sonic Generations: I think we all know the story. At least it's widely accepted that it's on a comeback, though.

-The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword: Ruined for... something, can't remember what exactly but there was a lot of complaining.

-Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3: Ruined because re-releases are the antichrist.

-Halo: Combat Evolved Anniversary: Oh look, Halo was already ruined because HD remakes are also the antichrist.

-Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3: ...Yeah. Moving on.

-Battlefield 3: Ruined for being a "CoD clone".

-Gears of War 3: Ruined a long time ago for accidentally starting the stump-necked gritty brown TPS movement.

-F.E.A.R. 3: Ruined for being average and getting rid of most of the series' horror roots.

-Red Faction: Armageddon: Ruined for being a generic TPS.

-Fable III: Ruined for lots of reasons.

-Crysis 2: Also ruined for being a "CoD clone".

-Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood: See Revelations.

-Dragon Age II: No explanation needed here either.

-Pokémon Black and White: Ruined by being "the same game released over and over".

And that's good for now. So what's the moral of the story here kids? That's right, take anything a gamer says with a huge pinch of salt, even if it's yourself. Almost every high profile release for two or three years has had threads exactly like this one, because the hate bandwagons and self-replicating hyperbolic nature of the internet has made it so no one can ever trust a developer to just put out a good product. Nope, if you hear something that sounds off, the game must be shit and the developer must be shit and you might as well boycott them.

/end venting. Been meaning to make this post for a while.

EDIT: Also, it's hilarious that people are seriously, unironically going ZOMG RUINED FOREVER over fucking weapon spawns. People are becoming the jokes we were telling a year ago, and they don't even stop to think about it.

Oh please nothing can be ruined ruined forever. If they cock up this Halo the next one isn't predetermined to also be terrible, maybe it will be good even if this one is just a cash in. Maybe I have too much faith in people wanting to make something amazing rather than something that will sell a lot of money though.

One Epic Phail:
I guess if you like everything being changed to the Call of Duty style of multiplayer and gameplay, it's alright.

Just to simply milk the cash cow that is first person shooters right now, instead of being innovative. Halo 4 will essentially be a re-skin of Reach. I'm not saying it's a bad idea, people are stupid enough to fork out $64 every year for a re-skinned game then do it. The original halos were all about being competitive, trying to be the best. Making maps balanced, making the playing field pretty even. Instead, the maps are horrible, the ranking system is gone, and the game is horribly unbalanced.

There is literally no replay value to Halo anymore, because there isn't a hard goal to achieve. Getting a higher rank in Halo 2 was hard as hell, Halo 3 was still difficult but not nearly as hard. If you take away goals that people can't achieve, or it's very hard to achieve. Then the game is nothing more than the copy and paste shit that is Call of Duty. CoD isn't a horrible game to play, it just can't hold my attention span because it is stupid easy.

15th prestige? Holy hell, I have to play a few extra months than CoDMW2 LOL

Opinions?

If the "perk" rumor about Halo 4 multiplayer is true than all hope is lost...

I'll still play the shit out of the campaign though.

But about the replayability/leveling thing, as much as I didn't like Reach as much as Halo 3... it took like a year and a half to get to the highest rank on Reach.

Phlakes:
...Well, by now, what hasn't been ruined forever? Let me check some 2012 releases-

-Final Fantasy XIII-2: Ruined by XIII.

-Soul Calibur V: Don't know, pretty sure everyone hated 3 or 4 but it was never really popular in the first place.

-The Darkness II: Ruined by not being like the first game.

-Alan Wake's American Nightmare: Ruined for being to actiony.

-SSX: Ruined for being too serious and having Survive It runs.

-Mass Effect 3: No fucking explanation needed.

-Silent Hill: Downpour: Ruined a long time ago, was it 3 that was the last "good" one?

-Ninja Gaiden 3: Ruined because it sucks.

Actually, this is kinda fun. Let's go back to 2011 because we can.

-Star Wars: The Old Republic: Ruined KotOR by not being KotOR 3.

-Assassin's Creed: Revelations: Ruined because of yearly releases and multiplayer.

-Sonic Generations: I think we all know the story. At least it's widely accepted that it's on a comeback, though.

-The Legend of Zelda: Skyward Sword: Ruined for... something, can't remember what exactly but there was a lot of complaining.

-Ultimate Marvel vs. Capcom 3: Ruined because re-releases are the antichrist.

-Halo: Combat Evolved Anniversary: Oh look, Halo was already ruined because HD remakes are also the antichrist.

-Call of Duty: Modern Warfare 3: ...Yeah. Moving on.

-Battlefield 3: Ruined for being a "CoD clone".

-Gears of War 3: Ruined a long time ago for accidentally starting the stump-necked gritty brown TPS movement.

-F.E.A.R. 3: Ruined for being average and getting rid of most of the series' horror roots.

-Red Faction: Armageddon: Ruined for being a generic TPS.

-Fable III: Ruined for lots of reasons.

-Crysis 2: Also ruined for being a "CoD clone".

-Assassin's Creed: Brotherhood: See Revelations.

-Dragon Age II: No explanation needed here either.

-Pokémon Black and White: Ruined by being "the same game released over and over".

And that's good for now. So what's the moral of the story here kids? That's right, take anything a gamer says with a huge pinch of salt, even if it's yourself. Almost every high profile release for two or three years has had threads exactly like this one, because the hate bandwagons and self-replicating hyperbolic nature of the internet has made it so no one can ever trust a developer to just put out a good product. Nope, if you hear something that sounds off, the game must be shit and the developer must be shit and you might as well boycott them.

/end venting. Been meaning to make this post for a while.

I disagree with a lot of those.

-Brotherhood was an amazing and my favorite of the AC series. Multiplayer was innovative and smart. Didn't like Revelations nearly as much though, I can agree with that.

-ME3 is great except for the last 10 minutes

-Crysis 2 is anything but a "CoD Clone"

-Halo: Combat Evolved Anniversary was a hella fun to go back an play one of the best FPS's of all time with great graphics.

-The Old Republic was just KOTOR 3 plus 7 more campaigns.

And for the rest of those, I can agree with a few of those being "ruined" but you didn't give any damn reasons.

btw people are overeacting.

Default Halo always sucks/ is filled with unbalaced or retarded mechanics that appeal to scrubs. Halo 3 was the best one imo and it had assault rifle default and those fucking stupid equipments.

MLG will remove all the superfluous garbage in due time so that we hopefully end up with a decent game lol.

Jaeke:
le snip

Oh, no, I'm not agreeing with them at all, it's just what I've seen here on the interwebs. I loved probably half of those games and I'll defend ME3 to the death. This is just about the internet in general.

The concept of respawning is obvious, people want to keep playing and if they die they don't want to wait for the next round to play again. The only problem is it removes all purpose to play with caution, so tons of idiots playing. Thats why I liked Gears of War 2 and the old Medal of Honor games (let us not speak of that sellout trash we got recently)

no, because A the game isnt even made yet, when the alpha/beta hits then we'll see

secondly, i dont think its true or even confirmed, i have found no other sources on the matter, not wikipedia, not halo pedia, not rooster teeth, nothing, none, zip.

secondly, its not COD style because COD has neither style or originality. everything it has done has been a rip off of previous games, or movies.

thirdly, its being made by the same heads (O'Connor and people) who i doubt are that stupid.

people heard this, and dont realize halo doesnt need to change, its still one of the most successful games EVER without turning to shit and lowering to COD's standards.

Assassin Xaero:
[snip

You played a bit of 1, and a bit of 2 - Your perspective is a bit limited :P

1 was great until the last few levels, 2 wasnt good. 3 was very good and had one of the first 4 player co op. ODST was a masterpiece and reach was ok. So i disagree with you too!

Ah well, opinions opinions. And all the games you mentioned had no better story than halo XD

So what would you prefer? That they release a reskinned version of Halo 2? Because there really isn't much for them to innovate on if they don't try taking new steps for the multiplayer.

I'll agree with you, I thought the class setup with the different perks was fucking stupid, to the point of where I stopped playing the game (fuck armor lock), but I think it's safe to wait until the game comes out before you condemn it.

Plus, there'll be a beta. Reach was a different game during the beta than what it turned out to be. Patience.

daveman247:

Assassin Xaero:
[snip

You played a bit of 1, and a bit of 2 - Your perspective is a bit limited :P

1 was great until the last few levels, 2 wasnt good. 3 was very good and had one of the first 4 player co op. ODST was a masterpiece and reach was ok. So i disagree with you too!

Ah well, opinions opinions. And all the games you mentioned had no better story than halo XD

Whoops, left that part out. I played one until the Library level. Up until that part it was decent, but that level still stands out to me as the worst level in video game history. As for the story part, well, I rarely pay attention to stories. "Better" tends to be opinionated, but for my opinion on that one, BioShock takes the cake.

Jaeke:
-Crysis 2 is anything but a "CoD Clone"

I'm sorry, but that is the funniest thing I read all day. From all the multiplayer videos I saw on Crysis 2, the only way I could tell it apart from Call of Duty 4 was one had a nano suit (well, and I guess since it is in New York and not generic Middle-Eastern-stan). Hell, they even straight up copied the kill streak bonuses and reskinned them to be more "Crysis themed".

The campaign, what I've played so far, is more like Call of Duty than Crysis. It is a tad more objective based, but still linear and pretty dumbed down. Guess that part wasn't really coping CoD, but I blame console limitations for that and for them completely trashing the story.

Assassin Xaero:

snip

Yup, the library was balls. Things started to fall apart a little after that. And i know halo doesnt have the best story (of course bioshock is better, im not that silly.) I was just saying it is stronger than most, such as all these modern miltary shooters we be getting all day. :)

Halo Fanboy:

erttheking:
As a long time Halo fan, I have to say no, not even freaking close. As one person once said on this very website "people always fly off of the hook when they learn about game mechanics, when what really matters is not which game mechanics are used, but how they work within the context of the game." or something like that. And considering that we know bugger all about how this game is going to work, I say that these cries of "RUINED FOREVER!" Are rather premature. OH NO now you can see through walls, that's slightly better than the radar which told you exactly where people are and if they were above or below you. It seems like a useless ability to be honest.

It's fine to judge mechanics on how they function in the system but Halo that doesnt feel like Halo is still a dissapointment.

Random weapon drops are really indefensible no matter how you look at. Tho it's something that can be fixed easily once they patch in the MLG playlist.

Well considering that no one has played it yet, we really can't say if it feels like Halo or not can we? And no they're not, I'm stoked for that idea, the whole "map control" thing that halo has really annoyed me. "Hey we have this massive map to fight on, but we're only gonna use one tenth cuz that's where the power weapons are.". Power weapon hoarding, spawn camping, that one hyper obsessive mlg guy hogging them all, these are all things that I won't miss. Maybe now we can just relax and have fun and just killing each other instead memorizing the location of each and every power weapon and the spawn timer. Never bothered with that stuff, too much preperation and study when i just want to unwind.

To me, Halo's an arcade style shooter where I can get together with some friends, put on some music and just have a great time blasting away, messing around in Forge and being stupid with vehicles. If Halo 4 retains those features, it'll be okay in my book. It's not the kind of game where I'm expecting much depth, to be honest.

I personally welcome any changes that come to new Halo games. In regard to weapon spawns and how they affected matches in previous games: Are random spawns really changing anything for the worse? I mean the only thing we're losing with random spawns is the memorization and camping. The whole "map-control" issue is actually improved seeing as now competitive teams will have to adapt to the spawns. Teams will still be fighting over power weapons and areas of the map, they just won't be the same areas every game. Is that really a bad thing? Anyway, I'm excited for Halo 4 seeing these leaks.

The multiplayer in Reach, while some could argue isn't quite as good as 3, is pretty much perfect. Not that there isn't room for change there's just not as much room for change as there was from 1-2 or 2-3, etc.

I dunno, time will tell or something.

Halo for me has been primarily about the story and co-op since 2 anyway, so as long as those are good - I'm good.

So this thread is focused entirely on the multiplayer, regardless of the fact that it isn't the only thing in the game, I guess I'm just one of those freaks who actually enjoys the single player part of the series.

Bravo though on jumping the gun to a ridiculous extreme, not even proper pictures yet, and already you are crying out that it's "Ruined forever".

erttheking:

Halo Fanboy:

erttheking:
As a long time Halo fan, I have to say no, not even freaking close. As one person once said on this very website "people always fly off of the hook when they learn about game mechanics, when what really matters is not which game mechanics are used, but how they work within the context of the game." or something like that. And considering that we know bugger all about how this game is going to work, I say that these cries of "RUINED FOREVER!" Are rather premature. OH NO now you can see through walls, that's slightly better than the radar which told you exactly where people are and if they were above or below you. It seems like a useless ability to be honest.

It's fine to judge mechanics on how they function in the system but Halo that doesnt feel like Halo is still a dissapointment.

Random weapon drops are really indefensible no matter how you look at. Tho it's something that can be fixed easily once they patch in the MLG playlist.

Well considering that no one has played it yet, we really can't say if it feels like Halo or not can we? And no they're not, I'm stoked for that idea, the whole "map control" thing that halo has really annoyed me. "Hey we have this massive map to fight on, but we're only gonna use one tenth cuz that's where the power weapons are.". Power weapon hoarding, spawn camping, that one hyper obsessive mlg guy hogging them all, these are all things that I won't miss. Maybe now we can just relax and have fun and just killing each other instead memorizing the location of each and every power weapon and the spawn timer. Never bothered with that stuff, too much preperation and study when i just want to unwind.

Being on a good team that takes advantage of the weapon spawns is what some people would call "playing the game." This works for Halo because the weapons (if in a br spawn mode) are actually well balanced. A good BR player can kill anyone as long as he knows camping and sniper positions.

Even if you don't like this design, RANDOM spawns are the worst solution possible. Custom loadouts are better, weapon restrictions based on class is better, giving the player every single weapon at spawn is better. random just adds an unnecessary element of luck to the system and it exasperates weapon balance problems because teams can't actually plan around having or fighting against those weapons.

EDIT: and in team objective the sniper and rl are like five feet away from the flag in most maps (atleast the ones people actually play) the only weapons that are majorly contested by both teams are usually shotguns, swords and the S-lazer.

Halo was so perfect before.

sadface.

Halo ruined?
No, the copy of Halo: Combat Evolved in my CD drive right now is still good, and always will be, no matter how many shitty sequels and remakes Bungie makes to try and cash in on it's success.

OlasDAlmighty:
Halo ruined?
No, the copy of Halo: Combat Evolved in my CD drive right now is still good, and always will be, no matter how many shitty sequels and remakes Bungie makes to try and cash in on it's success.

I think this is the 119th time I've had to mention that Halo 4 is being developed by a non-Bungie studio... though it sounds like you don't care very much, so it doesn't matter.

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