BE WARNED, LOTS OF READING AND SUCH, MIGHT HURT THE BRAINS OF SOME, OR BORE PEOPLE WHO DON'T CARE FOR MASS EFFECT LORE.
Lately I decided to play through the entire Mass Effect series again, just cause I'm like that, and while finishing ME1 I noticed something.
The defense of the citadel against the geth was the biggest military blunder ever conceived in a fictional universe. Why? Well lets go over the biggest mistakes.
In case you don't remember the defense of the citadel, or don't know what I'm talking about, I've provided a link.
The Citadel Fleet put the Citadel itself at risk In the scene where Sovereign and the Geth fleet arrive its quite clear that the Citadel fleet is close the Citadel itself, and no where near the mass relay into the system.
What the hell?
There's a few things wrong with this.
One, if a Mass Accelerator round hit even one ward of the citadel, millions would die, as these rounds have been told to cause more damage than atmoic bombs.
Two, the fleet should have been near the Mass Relay itself, this way it gives the citadel time to close, as well as minimizes the chances of a accelerator round hitting the station itself.
Three, if ships in the fleet are destroyed they run the risk of their debris also hitting the wards, causing even more civilian deaths.
To add to all of this there isn't a risk of enemies coming from all directions, as the nebula around the citadel is considered too dangerous to travel through, as kinetic barriers do nothing against its dangerous electrical discharges.
All in all the fleet was doing more harm than good being so close to the citadel.
The fleet formation goes against the stated doctrine of space combat In the various codex entries it is stated that dreadnaughts, the biggest damn things in the galaxy, are great at hitting things from far away with big goddam guns, but can't do crap if something gets to close for its guns to track.
So why were Turian dreadnaughts and the Destiny Ascension on the front lines of the battle? Wouldn't it have made sense for the biggest ships to be in the back for fire support while frigates and cruisers attack the Geth lines?
Evacuating the council to the Destiny Ascension is a HORRIBLE idea The Destiny Ascension is the biggest/most powerful ship in the council fleets, so it makes some sense that you would want to put the most important people in the galaxy on the ship if the place was ever attacked.
Except that an attacking fleet would probably prioritize targeting on the ship that dwarfs all the other ships.
This is even shown in ME1 where the Destiny Ascension is getting its teeth kicked in and is only saved if a full fleet of alliance ships come and save it.
Wouldn't it make more sense to put the Council on a smaller, possibly stealthed ship? Or maybe throw them in a heavily guarded bunker somewhere on the citadel itself? Its sure as hell not a good idea to put them on the most targeted ship in the fleet.
A failure to close to melee range (Except for the ships not equipped for such combat) In the codex entry on space combat its stated that after a bit of throwing Mass Accelerator slugs at each other, fighting fleets normally get really close to each other so they can start burning each other with GARDIAN lasers and such.
Why did no one do this except the Geth?
Towards the end it becomes obvious the Geth did this, but they did it to the ship that couldn't handle it, the Ascension.
Why didn't council frigates and cruisers, the ships who could handle these "Melee" battles, get sent towards the Geth ships?
Concluding Statements Obviously this is all nit picking, and honestly the battle was pretty badass to watch, making it more a victim of "Rule of Cool"
None the less I thought I would share my over-thought...thoughts on the battle, and would welcome any rebuttals or discussion on it.
TL;DR I have way to much time on my hands and decided to nitpick 10 minutes of a cinematic. I also pay way to much attention to the Mass Effect lore.
It's pretty clear that there are two Mass Effect universes; the game world and the cutscene world. They work different ways. Space combat is one aspect, but I most commonly note it when a character will have a weapon in a cutscene that they don't have in game. I most recently noticed this in one of the near-final cinematics for ME3, where Garrus suddenly started one-shotting Cannibals that out-of-cutscene took a few seconds of concentrated assault rifle fire (due to playing on a higher difficulty setting) before hand - and he'd managed to switch to a weaker model of assault rifle on top of that!
Regarding the Destiny Ascension, I got the idea that even though it might have been a priority target for Sovereign / the Geth, it was better than being in any of the other ships, which were all pieces of shit that got blown up from a single hit and could move about as fast as a zombie turtle.
About the formation, it seemed that the fleet didn't actually have time to get into battle formation. They were too busy derping around before the attack started. Think Pearl Harbor's battleship row, I guess.
Leodiensian: It's pretty clear that there are two Mass Effect universes; the game world and the cutscene world. They work different ways. Space combat is one aspect, but I most commonly note it when a character will have a weapon in a cutscene that they don't have in game. I most recently noticed this in one of the near-final cinematics for ME3, where Garrus suddenly started one-shotting Cannibals that out-of-cutscene took a few seconds of concentrated assault rifle fire (due to playing on a higher difficulty setting) before hand - and he'd managed to switch to a weaker model of assault rifle on top of that!
Yeah, again, suffering from rule of cool here
dyre: Regarding the Destiny Ascension, I got the idea that even though it might have been a priority target for Sovereign / the Geth, it was better than being in any of the other ships, which were all pieces of shit that got blown up from a single hit and could move about as fast as a zombie turtle.
About the formation, it seemed that the fleet didn't actually have time to get into battle formation. They were too busy derping around before the attack started. Think Pearl Harbor's battleship row, I guess.
Well that's what I mean, why put them on a ship in the fleet at ALL? Why not a stealth ship or a heavily fortified bunker?
As for the formation, if it was true surprise attack I'd agree but the council WAS expecting an attack so they should've been ready.
Admittedly it's been a couple years since I last played the game (Damn, hard to believe it's that old!) but I was always under the impression that the reason for the battles disorganized state was that it was a bit of a rushed defence against an unexpected attack. Ascension for example might have originally been meant simply to get the council out of there but were unable to leave before the battle broke out.
Because the Citadel fleet was caught with its pants down. It seemed like they sustained heavy losses right out of the gates and were scrambling to restore order to their lines for the rest of the time.
On an other note, the Shepard from that video really needs to trim his eyebrows.
dyre: Regarding the Destiny Ascension, I got the idea that even though it might have been a priority target for Sovereign / the Geth, it was better than being in any of the other ships, which were all pieces of shit that got blown up from a single hit and could move about as fast as a zombie turtle.
About the formation, it seemed that the fleet didn't actually have time to get into battle formation. They were too busy derping around before the attack started. Think Pearl Harbor's battleship row, I guess.
Well that's what I mean, why put them on a ship in the fleet at ALL? Why not a stealth ship or a heavily fortified bunker?
As for the formation, if it was true surprise attack I'd agree but the council WAS expecting an attack so they should've been ready.
Well, the Citadel was being overrun with Geth, so I don't blame them for evacuating while there was still an allied fleet defending the Citadel. As for stealth ships, wasn't Normandy the prototype for stealth? As in, stealth ships weren't available to the Citadel because they weren't in mass production. Also, IIRC, the stealth systems didn't actually make the ships invisible, just more difficult to detect on whatever radar they used. So, like the F-35 or the Eurofighter Typhoon. They'd still be seen in a close fight, and blown up in one shot probably.
On the formation, I don't really remember how the Geth managed to ambush the Citadel fleet. Wasn't there some kind of reason they weren't expecting an attack at the moment. If they were on alert, I assume they would've fired first.
It's been awhile since I played ME1, so my memory of things is sortof hazy.
dyre: Regarding the Destiny Ascension, I got the idea that even though it might have been a priority target for Sovereign / the Geth, it was better than being in any of the other ships, which were all pieces of shit that got blown up from a single hit and could move about as fast as a zombie turtle.
About the formation, it seemed that the fleet didn't actually have time to get into battle formation. They were too busy derping around before the attack started. Think Pearl Harbor's battleship row, I guess.
Well that's what I mean, why put them on a ship in the fleet at ALL? Why not a stealth ship or a heavily fortified bunker?
As for the formation, if it was true surprise attack I'd agree but the council WAS expecting an attack so they should've been ready.
Well, the Citadel was being overrun with Geth, so I don't blame them for evacuating while there was still an allied fleet defending the Citadel. As for stealth ships, wasn't Normandy the prototype for stealth? As in, stealth ships weren't available to the Citadel because they weren't in mass production. Also, IIRC, the stealth systems didn't actually make the ships invisible, just more difficult to detect on whatever radar they used. So, like the F-35 or the Eurofighter Typhoon. They'd still be seen in a close fight, and blown up in one shot probably.
On the formation, I don't really remember how the Geth managed to ambush the Citadel fleet. Wasn't there some kind of reason they weren't expecting an attack at the moment. If they were on alert, I assume they would've fired first.
It's been awhile since I played ME1, so my memory of things is sortof hazy.
Well there has to be a better way to defend the citadel government.
No actually, they WERE expecting an attack, and had reinforced themselves as a result.
The Madman: Admittedly it's been a couple years since I last played the game (Damn, hard to believe it's that old!) but I was always under the impression that the reason for the battles disorganized state was that it was a bit of a rushed defence against an unexpected attack. Ascension for example might have originally been meant simply to get the council out of there but were unable to leave before the battle broke out.
That was always my take anyway.
Goofguy: Because the Citadel fleet was caught with its pants down. It seemed like they sustained heavy losses right out of the gates and were scrambling to restore order to their lines for the rest of the time.
On an other note, the Shepard from that video really needs to trim his eyebrows.
The thing is though that council had reinforced itself and was ready for an attack because they thought Saren was going to try to attack the Council.
Well that's what I mean, why put them on a ship in the fleet at ALL? Why not a stealth ship or a heavily fortified bunker?
As for the formation, if it was true surprise attack I'd agree but the council WAS expecting an attack so they should've been ready.
Well, the Citadel was being overrun with Geth, so I don't blame them for evacuating while there was still an allied fleet defending the Citadel. As for stealth ships, wasn't Normandy the prototype for stealth? As in, stealth ships weren't available to the Citadel because they weren't in mass production. Also, IIRC, the stealth systems didn't actually make the ships invisible, just more difficult to detect on whatever radar they used. So, like the F-35 or the Eurofighter Typhoon. They'd still be seen in a close fight, and blown up in one shot probably.
On the formation, I don't really remember how the Geth managed to ambush the Citadel fleet. Wasn't there some kind of reason they weren't expecting an attack at the moment. If they were on alert, I assume they would've fired first.
It's been awhile since I played ME1, so my memory of things is sortof hazy.
Well there has to be a better way to defend the citadel government.
No actually, they WERE expecting an attack, and had reinforced themselves as a result.
I know they were expecting an attack, but I believe the game gave a reason they had their pants down on that specific attack. Like, somehow they didn't expect Saren's fleet to show up through the mass relay. I don't remember though.
I think putting high value people on the strongest ship isn't necessarily such a bad idea. The Geth wouldn't necessarily target the strongest ship if it was simply trying to escape, while other Citadel battleships actually attacking them.
The thing is though that council had reinforced itself and was ready for an attack because they thought Saren was going to try to attack the Council.
Judging from what I recall of the game, the council might have expected to have to repel some sort of attack but I doubt they were anticipating the sort of fleet that did arrive. Couldn't really have anticipated the reaper either methinks, considering how skeptical of everything the council were throughout the game. So just a matter of too few ships being scrambled in a hodgepodge defence against an unexpectedly strong enemy force, that's what I think.
Whatever the case it made for one hell of a great climax regardless.
The thing is though that council had reinforced itself and was ready for an attack because they thought Saren was going to try to attack the Council.
Judging from what I recall of the game, the council might have expected to have to repel some sort of attack but I doubt they were anticipating the sort of fleet that did arrive. Couldn't really have anticipated the reaper either methinks, considering how skeptical of everything the council were throughout the game. So just a matter of too few ships being scrambled in a hodgepodge defence against an unexpectedly strong enemy force, that's what I think.
Whatever the case it made for one hell of a great climax regardless.
Considering how easily Sovereign could tear through ships I think putting them in the Destiny Ascension is even worse. If it were an enemy more within their technological level then it might make sense. Then you can assume it has a chance at surviving. But against Sovereign? It looked like he just needed one shot against anything if he really wanted to kill it.
Goofguy: Because the Citadel fleet was caught with its pants down. It seemed like they sustained heavy losses right out of the gates and were scrambling to restore order to their lines for the rest of the time.
On an other note, the Shepard from that video really needs to trim his eyebrows.
The thing is though that council had reinforced itself and was ready for an attack because they thought Saren was going to try to attack the Council.
Sorry, maybe I should have explained myself better. The Citadel fleet was "caught with its pants down" because it was complacent, ill-prepared and disorganized.
This is a fleet which hasn't seen action in years and is being told to prepare for an enemy by a Council that doesn't particularly believe it itself. They probably assumed Saren would show up with a handful of ships and instead, the Citadel fleet got the full brunt of a coordinated attack led by an unknown and powerful foe, Sovereign. Look at the first volley from Sovereign and the Geth, it hits the Citadel fleet as it's drifting aimlessly around the Citadel... hell, some of the ships aren't even facing the right direction to begin with.
Once that first volley hit a complacent and unprepared fleet, chaos would have broken out. The fleet's ships would fail to proactively apply the OODA loop in facing this threat and they would be forced to be on the defensive against such an overwhelming force. From that point on, each ship's captain would probably adopt an "every ship for itself" mentality, especially when the fleet is made up of several different races (i.e. Turian captain is less willing to take orders from an Asari superior).
These are just my thoughts on it but I ultimately think the Citadel fleet was just not ready.
Goofguy: Because the Citadel fleet was caught with its pants down. It seemed like they sustained heavy losses right out of the gates and were scrambling to restore order to their lines for the rest of the time.
On an other note, the Shepard from that video really needs to trim his eyebrows.
The thing is though that council had reinforced itself and was ready for an attack because they thought Saren was going to try to attack the Council.
Sorry, maybe I should have explained myself better. The Citadel fleet was "caught with its pants down" because it was complacent, ill-prepared and disorganized.
This is a fleet which hasn't seen action in years and is being told to prepare for an enemy by a Council that doesn't particularly believe it itself. They probably assumed Saren would show up with a handful of ships and instead, the Citadel fleet got the full brunt of a coordinated attack led by an unknown and powerful foe, Sovereign. Look at the first volley from Sovereign and the Geth, it hits the Citadel fleet as it's drifting aimlessly around the Citadel... hell, some of the ships aren't even facing the right direction to begin with.
Once that first volley hit a complacent and unprepared fleet, chaos would have broken out. The fleet's ships would fail to proactively apply the OODA loop in facing this threat and they would be forced to be on the defensive against such an overwhelming force. From that point on, each ship's captain would probably adopt an "every ship for itself" mentality, especially when the fleet is made up of several different races (i.e. Turian captain is less willing to take orders from an Asari superior).
These are just my thoughts on it but I ultimately think the Citadel fleet was just not ready.
That makes a lot of sense and I could see that being the case, just more proof that the defense was poorly handled.
I think I remember reading somewhere that the writing team and the cinematics team weren't communicating with each other while the ending cinematics were being put together, so it doesn't quite represent what the writers had in mind. For example, supposedly Sovereign wasn't meant to be as powerful and unstoppable as he comes across as. If that's all true, it might go some way to explaining a few of your points.
Something I've been thinking about lately is that not choosing to save the Destiny Ascension doesn't really make much sense. Maybe I've missed or I'm forgetting something, but if you choose to go straight for Sovereign, you see the Ascension go boom right? So what happens to all the Geth ships that were distracted by the Citadel fleet? Surely if you didn't deal with them they're just going to attack the Alliance fleet the moment the Ascension is gone anyway, and while they're focussed on Sovereign to boot. Obviously that doesn't happen, so is it a plot hole or have I just missed a detail somewhere?
As someone mentioned in the ME3 plotholes thread, wouldn't the AI on the Citadel have done something to allow Sovereign to win? Or more directly just trigger the mass effect that would allow the Reapers to jump to the Citadel?
Klatz: As someone mentioned in the ME3 plotholes thread, wouldn't the AI on the Citadel have done something to allow Sovereign to win? Or more directly just trigger the mass effect that would allow the Reapers to jump to the Citadel?
for all we know there is a safety switch built into his systems that prevents him from opening the relay himself as a measure to prevent a early/false start on an invasion in the case he went rouge.
Poor writing since they didn't mention one, but there are possibilities.
yeah i'm pretty sure that Saren and the geth overran the citadel using the conduit if my memory serves. so that's why the council was evacuated and the citadel arms were open. how C-sec/specters aboard the citadel lost so quickly.....i have no idea also in ME 3.....
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As for why put the council aboard the Destiny Ascension. The Normandy was prototype for stealth so it would be doubtful that the council had access to a stealth ship however it would be perfect to get passed the geth (geth have no windows, structural weakness :P) and again the citadel was overrun so a bunker would be risky. the Destiny Ascension being the strongest ship well you can see the logic if it was just planning to escape, drop of the council somewhere safe and come back. or if the citadel fleet had given up and were attempting to withdraw the fleet with the council.
on the topic of how the citadel fleet lost so easily sovereign being a reaper could have taken out key ships and broken the citadel fleets formation. remember the entire alliance fleet as well as the remains of the citadel fleet could only beat it after you messed with sovereign's shields by beating Saren. also sovereign was busy hacking/doing his thing/whatever it was with the citadel.
as for why the citadel fleet was stationed near the citadel itself and not the mass relay. It was probably a battle plan. if you got big ships that do their damage at range you want them far away. but you don't want the geth to get to the citadel so you place your fleet near the citadel. you want the geth to take fire as they approach the citadel, which would weaken them enough so they could be finished off in "knife fight" ranged combat near the citadel. also it can be assumed that the citadel had its own kinetic barriers being a technical marvel and all, it don't recall them saying it didn't have kinetic barriers (why they don't mention it has to fill a plot whole is beyond me)
why didn't it work? again reapers tend to mess up the plans of organics.
while not a full proof explanation i hoped it helped. why bioware couldn't explain these issues more clearly...they must just overlooked them would be my guess.
1) The thing about the mass-accelerated slugs is that they hit with the force of 3 atomic bombs, but without the explosion. When hitting a planet, there is admittedly less difference because a meteor (which would be the closest approximation) can be just as destructive as an atomic bomb and kick up so much dust it even looks similar. But ships have kinetic barriers and I imagine the impact being more "hole-punching" than "massive explosion". I also presume the Citadel to be able to generate kinetic barriers quite a lot stronger than any ship, making it relatively safe from stray shots.
2) I always saw the citadel fleet being caught by surprise a lot more thoroughly than you're considering. First, they had no idea at that point just how powerful Sovereign was, so it would be understandable that they couldn't possibly prepare for that. As for the Geth fleet, they keep mentioning in ME1 that the Geth had barely ever been seen beyond their corner of the galaxy, so it stands to reason that no military strategist even knew what kind of fleet the Geth could muster (except maybe the Quarians, but they're not a council race).
But you know, all these (valid) points you make about the fleet being stupidly unprepared to protect the Citadel are (roughly) things I was shouting at my monitor at the very beginning of ME3. When I'm dragged into that "hearing" to discuss the reapers, who subsequently show up within minutes, I was like "What? So what the exact fuck has the Alliance been doing between the destruction of the collectors and now? I mean apart from grounding me and re-fitting my awesome ship? What do you mean not one of our futuristic means of communication was able to warn us ahead of time, if only by a couple minutes, of a fleet of dreadnought-sized ships coming into the Sol system??"
That makes a lot of sense and I could see that being the case, just more proof that the defense was poorly handled.
The defense was, in reality, handled as well as it could have been.
The failure was not how the battle was handled; there was no tactical error. The error was strategic. Simply put, the Citadel fleet was not deployed in defense in the strictest sense. Were this the case, even the simplest defense would be constructed in depth. Light scouting forces would be deployed multiple jumps out. All direct relays to the Citadel would have screening fleets deployed. The bulk of the firepower of the fleet would remain at the mass relay in the Citadel system in order to provide rapid response should the screening fleets come under attack.
But the Citadel fleet was not deployed in depth. It was deployed as a show of force.
But even though this proved to be a mistake, the action was entirely reasonable. There was no reason to believe any force would launch a frontal assault on the Citadel. Even if the fleet was unprepared, casualties would be incredibly high and holding the Citadel itself would, as far as anyone in a position of power was concerned, was a symbolic location versus one of significant strategic importance. To put it another way, there was no information that would lead anyone in a position of power to believe anything more was necessary.
The only evidence to the contrary came from the newest Spectre in the force. A Spectre who's testimony was based on dreams and wild conspiracy theories.
Klatz: As someone mentioned in the ME3 plotholes thread, wouldn't the AI on the Citadel have done something to allow Sovereign to win? Or more directly just trigger the mass effect that would allow the Reapers to jump to the Citadel?
I thourght perhaps the reaper starchild had to be "activated" by the catalyst?
Mr.Tea: What do you mean not one of our futuristic means of communication was able to warn us ahead of time, if only by a couple minutes, of a fleet of dreadnought-sized ships coming into the Sol system??"
So true, I started freaking out when they said that they lost contact with the MOON. Sure, the reapers are pretty advanced, so I can understand them taking out the longer ranged communications, but I can see the moon from my window, wouldn't somebody notice the massive (judging from the wreckage) space battle going on in Earth's own backyard?
Though it won't explain away all the issues with the battle, before you leave for Ilos the council state that fleets were being positioned at every relay connecting to the citadel. I would presume that they anticipated the battle being fought at one of these relays and the citadel fleet was to 'mop up' any ships that sucessfully managed to reach the relay and jump to the citadel relay (of course sovereign stopped this happening). This scenario does rely on the council making some pretty large assumptions and be subsequently pretty overconfident but this is the council we're talking about.
Saviordd1: BE WARNED, LOTS OF READING AND SUCH, MIGHT HURT THE BRAINS OF SOME, OR BORE PEOPLE WHO DON'T CARE FOR MASS EFFECT LORE.
Lately I decided to play through the entire Mass Effect series again, just cause I'm like that, and while finishing ME1 I noticed something.
The defense of the citadel against the geth was the biggest military blunder ever conceived in a fictional universe. Why? Well lets go over the biggest mistakes.
In case you don't remember the defense of the citadel, or don't know what I'm talking about, I've provided a link.
The Citadel Fleet put the Citadel itself at risk In the scene where Sovereign and the Geth fleet arrive its quite clear that the Citadel fleet is close the Citadel itself, and no where near the mass relay into the system.
What the hell?
There's a few things wrong with this.
One, if a Mass Accelerator round hit even one ward of the citadel, millions would die, as these rounds have been told to cause more damage than atmoic bombs.
Two, the fleet should have been near the Mass Relay itself, this way it gives the citadel time to close, as well as minimizes the chances of a accelerator round hitting the station itself.
Three, if ships in the fleet are destroyed they run the risk of their debris also hitting the wards, causing even more civilian deaths.
To add to all of this there isn't a risk of enemies coming from all directions, as the nebula around the citadel is considered too dangerous to travel through, as kinetic barriers do nothing against its dangerous electrical discharges.
All in all the fleet was doing more harm than good being so close to the citadel.
The fleet formation goes against the stated doctrine of space combat In the various codex entries it is stated that dreadnaughts, the biggest damn things in the galaxy, are great at hitting things from far away with big goddam guns, but can't do crap if something gets to close for its guns to track.
So why were Turian dreadnaughts and the Destiny Ascension on the front lines of the battle? Wouldn't it have made sense for the biggest ships to be in the back for fire support while frigates and cruisers attack the Geth lines?
Evacuating the council to the Destiny Ascension is a HORRIBLE idea The Destiny Ascension is the biggest/most powerful ship in the council fleets, so it makes some sense that you would want to put the most important people in the galaxy on the ship if the place was ever attacked.
Except that an attacking fleet would probably prioritize targeting on the ship that dwarfs all the other ships.
This is even shown in ME1 where the Destiny Ascension is getting its teeth kicked in and is only saved if a full fleet of alliance ships come and save it.
Wouldn't it make more sense to put the Council on a smaller, possibly stealthed ship? Or maybe throw them in a heavily guarded bunker somewhere on the citadel itself? Its sure as hell not a good idea to put them on the most targeted ship in the fleet.
A failure to close to melee range (Except for the ships not equipped for such combat) In the codex entry on space combat its stated that after a bit of throwing Mass Accelerator slugs at each other, fighting fleets normally get really close to each other so they can start burning each other with GARDIAN lasers and such.
Why did no one do this except the Geth?
Towards the end it becomes obvious the Geth did this, but they did it to the ship that couldn't handle it, the Ascension.
Why didn't council frigates and cruisers, the ships who could handle these "Melee" battles, get sent towards the Geth ships?
Concluding Statements Obviously this is all nit picking, and honestly the battle was pretty badass to watch, making it more a victim of "Rule of Cool"
None the less I thought I would share my over-thought...thoughts on the battle, and would welcome any rebuttals or discussion on it.
TL;DR I have way to much time on my hands and decided to nitpick 10 minutes of a cinematic. I also pay way to much attention to the Mass Effect lore.
Ah yes, fleet tactics. We have dismissed these claims.
Ok, concerning why the Citadel AI didn't just call in the Reapers; if you ask Vigil all the questions you can on Ilos it explains that the last Prothean survivors that it was able to save, upon finding that there weren't enough of them to form a stable population, went through the Conduit once the Reapers had withdrawn and disabled the Citadel's transmitter. It's strongly implied that in every previous cycle the Reapers had just appeared in precisely the way you describe, with no need for a Reaper to physically reach the Citadel.
On the matter of why the fleet didn't engage the attacking fleet at the relay: two possible explanations.
1) As has already been addressed, complacency: The Council had no idea about Sovereign's capabilities, or the kind of numbers the Geth could field. (bear in mind that the Quarians are the only ones who've fought the Geth and they and the Council don't see eye to eye) Furthermore, Sovereign is mistaken for a Geth ship in the aftermath, showing that the Geth are just as alien and unknown to the Council as the Reapers themselves. Couple that with the Council's demonstrateable arrogance throughout Mass Effect 1 and 2 and you have an explanation for poor strategy: A belief that sheer force of arms would win the day with or without competent strategic planning. It also justifies the Council's presence on the Destiny Ascension: they would have thought that even with focused fire the enemy fleet would be unable to bring down their barriers.
2) And this theory is based on a bit of conjecture and a bit on codex entries. Mass relays aren't device-to-device transit; this is established in the opening dialogue between Joker and Nihlus by the phenomenon referred to as drift. If I recall correctly this drift can be several hundred thousand kilometers. How exactly fleets are able to jump in formation without smashing into one another on arrival I don't know; if you're really looking for holes in the established pseudo-science there's one for you. Now I don't know how long the sensor range on most ships is in Mass Effect, I haven't read about it in that much detail, but working on the assumption that they're less than 5 thousand kilometers or so, when you account for drift the ease with which a fleet could be caught out of position if they were defending the relay is tremendous. This theory is contradicted by Mass Effect 3's opening scenes in which the alliance fleet attempts to defend against the first Reaper attacks at the Sol relay. On the other hand, it appears to be supported by Mass Effect 2's Omega 4 relay in which a Reaper IFF causes the relay's behaviour to change, giving more accurate transit. This would DEFINITELY allow a Reaper-led fleet to bypass a fleet defending at the relay, but the Council and the Citadel defence fleet admirals would not be aware of this at the time.
Given how the Council's arrogance is hammered home with all the subtlety of an anvil throughout the first game I'm in support of theory 1.
Evacuating the council to the Destiny Ascension is a HORRIBLE idea The Destiny Ascension is the biggest/most powerful ship in the council fleets, so it makes some sense that you would want to put the most important people in the galaxy on the ship if the place was ever attacked.
Except that an attacking fleet would probably prioritize targeting on the ship that dwarfs all the other ships.
This is even shown in ME1 where the Destiny Ascension is getting its teeth kicked in and is only saved if a full fleet of alliance ships come and save it.
Wouldn't it make more sense to put the Council on a smaller, possibly stealthed ship? Or maybe throw them in a heavily guarded bunker somewhere on the citadel itself? Its sure as hell not a good idea to put them on the most targeted ship in the fleet.
Take pretty much everything you said about the battle of the Citadel, apply it to the battle above Earth at the end of ME3, and think about the consequences for the planets below of all the rounds fired that missed the Reapers...
The Rule of Cool simply outweighs the laws of physics and canon in a situation like this. Just roll with it IMO :)
I'm actually replaying ME. I didn't think about it before, but I guess I'll look into it when I get there. "Caught with their pants down" or "panic mode" is how I see this thing went down.
Clive Howlitzer: Ah yes, fleet tactics. We have dismissed these claims.
There is of course a lot of 'rule of cool' happening. It's cooler to see the battle of the Citadel, than seeing the skirmish of the relay of system 3467888 even though the latter might have been a tactical turning point.
Assuming that the alliance fleet is disorganized, and I think there are some hints at that, making a last stand at the Citadel does make tactical sense. If Alliance forces rendezvous at the relay and get there too late, the Citadel would be undefended. Making the meeting point the Citadel would be the conservative decision. If the fleet gets there early they can organize defensive formations and maybe move towards the relay, if they arrive late at least they get to fire a few torpedoes. It also depends on the amount of intel available, and we know very little about that.
Putting the council on a flagship instead of a cloaked command boat. Flagships are cool and it makes for drama. There's also some morale advantages, friendly ships can rally around the flagship for a last stand. If the Citadel as a symbol is considered more important than the specific council members, then it makes sense to make that sacrifice. ME naval battles work under the assumption that 1600-1800 naval tactics are in use, long lines of ships slugging it out. It's of course highly unrealistic, it would be more 'realistic' if ships were thousands of miles apart, but it's hard to give cinematic suspense to such a scenario. It would feel more like a modern fleet scenario, little dots moving around on scanners firing weapons at targets outside visual range.
Saviordd1: In the various codex entries it is stated that dreadnaughts, the biggest damn things in the galaxy, are great at hitting things from far away with big goddam guns, but can't do crap if something gets to close for its guns to track.
So why were Turian dreadnaughts and the Destiny Ascension on the front lines of the battle? Wouldn't it have made sense for the biggest ships to be in the back for fire support while frigates and cruisers attack the Geth lines?
Actually I'm pretty sure those were Turian cruisers in the battle. The art book suggests it.
Other then that all I can say it is because of space magic. ;)
Oh yeah..... onne more thing regarding ship proportions. Sovereign was considered 2 km long buuuuut the Citadel tower was said to be 1 km long but when Sovereign molestes it (or whatever it does) why is the Citadel tower longer then Sovereign?
See I always saw it as two things happening at once
A) The Citadel was expecting a joke fleet to attack them, not a Reaper. They were lazy and didn't take the battle at all seriously.
B) With Saren and geth teleprocessing into the Citadel, he was able to cripple communications and thus massively fuck up all attempts to collect and act on information.
As for the Council boarding the destiny Ascension, I thought they just weren't thinks traight and went,
"this is the most powerful ship... Oh shit our fleet is getting it's ass kicked...fuck we have to go... fuck fuck fuck... Destiny Ascension, that's the best...fuck"
I'm too tired to read every post in this topic, but OP, you mentioned that the fleet should be at the Mass Relay to buy the Citadel time to close. Eventhough this makes sense, Saren used the Conduit to travel directly to the Citadel and not the Mass Relay. And, are you shure about the Atom bomb thing? I recall reading something about that in the Codex, but I rember it to say that with the use of mass effect fields theoretically a bullet can do the damage of an Atom Bomb, but the heat output and backfire would be way to high. I may be wrong though, and besides, I bet Sovereign had enough firepower allready...
"The crucial choice for any attack through mass relays is how to divide the fleet for transit. The accuracy of a relay's mass-projection depends on the mass being moved and how far its going. Any long distance and/or high mass jump will see "drift". That is, a ship may be hundreds or millions of kilometers from its intended drop point, in any direction from the relay.
Distance can't be chosen by admirals, but a relay is told how much mass to transit. For example, if told to move a million metric tons of mass, the relay will scan the approach corridor, find four 250,000-ton freighters, and transit them together, maintaining their relative positions."
All of the space battle cutscenes in Mass Effect are terrible. This is because the people who write the story and gameplay don't talk to the people who render the cutscenes, and neither of them talk to the people who write the codex.
BE WARNED, LOTS OF READING AND SUCH, MIGHT HURT THE BRAINS OF SOME, OR BORE PEOPLE WHO DON'T CARE FOR MASS EFFECT LORE.
Lately I decided to play through the entire Mass Effect series again, just cause I'm like that, and while finishing ME1 I noticed something.
The defense of the citadel against the geth was the biggest military blunder ever conceived in a fictional universe. Why? Well lets go over the biggest mistakes.
In case you don't remember the defense of the citadel, or don't know what I'm talking about, I've provided a link.
The Citadel Fleet put the Citadel itself at risk
In the scene where Sovereign and the Geth fleet arrive its quite clear that the Citadel fleet is close the Citadel itself, and no where near the mass relay into the system.
What the hell?
There's a few things wrong with this.
One, if a Mass Accelerator round hit even one ward of the citadel, millions would die, as these rounds have been told to cause more damage than atmoic bombs.
Two, the fleet should have been near the Mass Relay itself, this way it gives the citadel time to close, as well as minimizes the chances of a accelerator round hitting the station itself.
Three, if ships in the fleet are destroyed they run the risk of their debris also hitting the wards, causing even more civilian deaths.
To add to all of this there isn't a risk of enemies coming from all directions, as the nebula around the citadel is considered too dangerous to travel through, as kinetic barriers do nothing against its dangerous electrical discharges.
All in all the fleet was doing more harm than good being so close to the citadel.
The fleet formation goes against the stated doctrine of space combat
In the various codex entries it is stated that dreadnaughts, the biggest damn things in the galaxy, are great at hitting things from far away with big goddam guns, but can't do crap if something gets to close for its guns to track.
So why were Turian dreadnaughts and the Destiny Ascension on the front lines of the battle? Wouldn't it have made sense for the biggest ships to be in the back for fire support while frigates and cruisers attack the Geth lines?
Evacuating the council to the Destiny Ascension is a HORRIBLE idea
The Destiny Ascension is the biggest/most powerful ship in the council fleets, so it makes some sense that you would want to put the most important people in the galaxy on the ship if the place was ever attacked.
Except that an attacking fleet would probably prioritize targeting on the ship that dwarfs all the other ships.
This is even shown in ME1 where the Destiny Ascension is getting its teeth kicked in and is only saved if a full fleet of alliance ships come and save it.
Wouldn't it make more sense to put the Council on a smaller, possibly stealthed ship? Or maybe throw them in a heavily guarded bunker somewhere on the citadel itself? Its sure as hell not a good idea to put them on the most targeted ship in the fleet.
A failure to close to melee range (Except for the ships not equipped for such combat)
In the codex entry on space combat its stated that after a bit of throwing Mass Accelerator slugs at each other, fighting fleets normally get really close to each other so they can start burning each other with GARDIAN lasers and such.
Why did no one do this except the Geth?
Towards the end it becomes obvious the Geth did this, but they did it to the ship that couldn't handle it, the Ascension.
Why didn't council frigates and cruisers, the ships who could handle these "Melee" battles, get sent towards the Geth ships?
Concluding Statements
Obviously this is all nit picking, and honestly the battle was pretty badass to watch, making it more a victim of "Rule of Cool"
None the less I thought I would share my over-thought...thoughts on the battle, and would welcome any rebuttals or discussion on it.
TL;DR
I have way to much time on my hands and decided to nitpick 10 minutes of a cinematic.
I also pay way to much attention to the Mass Effect lore.