Who is your favourite under appreciated Protagonist?

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Mine would have to be Zack from Final Fantasy Crisis Core, he has his flaws like being unable to get his point across without flailing around, but I guess he is a Jrpg hero. His dialogue is always cheesy. He also happens to be well... dead. But he is definitely my favourite FF character because he is less emo than most of them e.g Cloud, and despite his constant blathering about wanting to be a hero.
He is funny, stoic, lovable and really quite powerful when you think about it. His death really moved me, when he asks "did I become a hero?" I just wanted to ruffle that little hair style he stole off Sonic the Hedgehog and say "yes.. yes you did".

The reason he is under appreciated is that his adventure is only on the psp, come to think of it Crisis Core is the only reason I don't regret my psp purchase. He is also only briefly mentioned in 7 and he sort of pops up at the end of the film.

So Escapists who is your favourite under appreciated Protagonist?

1: I'll be the first dick to point out that someone being under appreciated is rather dependent upon who's doing the judging.

2: If you want non-emo FF characters, might I suggest playing FFs 1-6.

3: Just for a true odd-ball response to the question at hand, I'll say Jacob from ME 2. By all accounts he is the single most forgettable character in the entire ME universe. But you know what? He had some decent abilities. If you were playing as a Biotic in ME 2, he was a good set-up guy for a pull-warp combo. Other than having the personality of a brick (which is surprisingly more than James Vega >.>), he really wasn't half bad of a squadmate.

That said I never used the guy once outside of his loyalty mission and the beginning of the game when you have no other options...

But still, when you really look at it he wasn't too bad.

RJ 17:
1: I'll be the first dick to point out that someone being under appreciated is rather dependent upon who's doing the judging.

2: If you want non-emo FF characters, might I suggest playing FFs 1-6.

3: Just for a true odd-ball response to the question at hand, I'll say Jacob from ME 2. By all accounts he is the single most forgettable character in the entire ME universe. But you know what? He had some decent abilities. If you were playing as a Biotic in ME 2, he was a good set-up guy for a pull-warp combo. Other than having the personality of a brick (which is surprisingly more than James Vega >.>), he really wasn't half bad of a squadmate.

That said I never used the guy once outside of his loyalty mission and the beginning of the game when you have no other options...

But still, when you really look at it he wasn't too bad.

1. Oh don't be hard on yourself you aren't really a dick if you are willing to admit you can be one.

2. SERIOUSLY MAN? think about Cecil from FF4 he is the definition of Emo, oh and you know FF1 none of them speak ever, so I consider them the most emo. Guy from FF2 was a little bit Emo. The guy from FF3 wasn't. Cant speak for 5 or 6 not played them.

3.Jacob isn't really a protagonist is he. But yeah he was ok in a fight but damn I have seen slugs more interesting than Jacob, he was really just so dull. His only interesting feature is he is one of the very few boring Bioware characters.

verdant monkai:

RJ 17:
1: I'll be the first dick to point out that someone being under appreciated is rather dependent upon who's doing the judging.

2: If you want non-emo FF characters, might I suggest playing FFs 1-6.

3: Just for a true odd-ball response to the question at hand, I'll say Jacob from ME 2. By all accounts he is the single most forgettable character in the entire ME universe. But you know what? He had some decent abilities. If you were playing as a Biotic in ME 2, he was a good set-up guy for a pull-warp combo. Other than having the personality of a brick (which is surprisingly more than James Vega >.>), he really wasn't half bad of a squadmate.

That said I never used the guy once outside of his loyalty mission and the beginning of the game when you have no other options...

But still, when you really look at it he wasn't too bad.

1. Oh don't be hard on yourself you aren't really a dick if you are willing to admit you can be one.

2. SERIOUSLY MAN? think about Cecil from FF4 he is the definition of Emo, oh and you know FF1 none of them speak ever, so I consider them the most emo. Guy from FF2 was a little bit Emo. The guy from FF3 wasn't. Cant speak for 5 or 6 not played them.

3.Jacob isn't really a protagonist is he. But yeah he was ok in a fight but damn I have seen slugs more interesting than Jacob, he was really just so dull. His only interesting feature is he is one of the very few boring Bioware characters.

Ok, so you named a couple examples, I never said that NONE of the old FFs were completely emo-free. And you can't count the cast of the original FF, they're neutral on the emo scale. They might not talk, but they sure as hell don't whine. :P

All I'm saying is that for all FF's 6 and under, the number of emos to be found is a lot smaller than it is in all the FF's 7 and up.

:3 and just for some fun since we've both apparently already derailed your topic...who would you say is the most emo FF character out there? Wanna see if you agree with me on this one. :P

RJ 17:
:3 and just for some fun since we've both apparently already derailed your topic...who would you say is the most emo FF character out there? Wanna see if you agree with me on this one. :P

For most socially awkward/inept, the answer is Disc 1 Squall. That guy is a pain in everyone's ass. For the most actually depressed, the answer is probably Garnet/Dagger from FF9 (gets so out of it at one point she can't even fight properly) or Hope from FFXIII (life just dumps on him over and over and over again. Plus he's a little whiny, which doesn't help things).

Ordinaryundone:

RJ 17:
:3 and just for some fun since we've both apparently already derailed your topic...who would you say is the most emo FF character out there? Wanna see if you agree with me on this one. :P

For most socially awkward/inept, the answer is Disc 1 Squall. That guy is a pain in everyone's ass. For the most actually depressed, the answer is probably Garnet/Dagger from FF9 (gets so out of it at one point she can't even fight properly) or Hope from FFXIII (life just dumps on him over and over and over again. Plus he's a little whiny, which doesn't help things).

xD Yup, Squall was who I was thinking of. One scene I will always remember as it shows just how unbelievably emo he is is the part when they make it to Galbadia Garden (think that's the one, probably misspelled it, it's the place where you get the Cerberus GF). The gang is all in some kind of waiting room, all having their own private thoughts, then Squall's pops in and he starts thinking about dead people, then his own death, then about how after you die everyone starts talking about you in the past tense. He works himself up into a frenzy before shattering the silence by screaming out loud "NO ONE'S GOING TO TALK ABOUT ME IN THE PAST TENSE!!!" and he storms out the door leaving everyone in the room standing there in shock like "What....the fuck....was that?"

I'd say Tidus from FFX. He did suffer a lot from some spectacularly bad voice acting and generally awkward scenes, but in the end he had a great story and development. I really loved how his story panned out and how his interaction was with the people of Spira. In the end, Tidus made me enjoy the game most.

Raiden, in Metal Gear Solid 2.
Everyone rails on him for being so whiny. But think about the SITUATION he's in! He's sent off to some suspicious clean-up plant, told nothing but lies, and then the truth gets to him and tons of crazy shit happens and he has no idea WHAT to think. Lest we forget, he doesn't even remember who he was when he was young, and his girlfriend is acting rather crazy. Let's Destroy Metal Gear Again shows this rather well (and is also hilarious :P).
Raiden actually shows a more sensible emotional response to all this stuff, as opposed to Solid Snake who would just call his support team, go "GIVE ME ANSWERS," and his support team would either tell him they don't know anything or tell him the truth(rarely), to which he simply wouldn't seem to care that much.

Desmond from the Assassin's Creed series, yes he's not as interesting as Altiar or Ezio, but at the end of the day without him we wouldn't have access to those stories. It's a slow burn is Desmond's story, but I think (and hope) this october will see him surprise us all.

RJ 17:

verdant monkai:

RJ 17:
1: I'll be the first dick to point out that someone being under appreciated is rather dependent upon who's doing the judging.

2: If you want non-emo FF characters, might I suggest playing FFs 1-6.

3: Just for a true odd-ball response to the question at hand, I'll say Jacob from ME 2. By all accounts he is the single most forgettable character in the entire ME universe. But you know what? He had some decent abilities. If you were playing as a Biotic in ME 2, he was a good set-up guy for a pull-warp combo. Other than having the personality of a brick (which is surprisingly more than James Vega >.>), he really wasn't half bad of a squadmate.

That said I never used the guy once outside of his loyalty mission and the beginning of the game when you have no other options...

But still, when you really look at it he wasn't too bad.

1. Oh don't be hard on yourself you aren't really a dick if you are willing to admit you can be one.

2. SERIOUSLY MAN? think about Cecil from FF4 he is the definition of Emo, oh and you know FF1 none of them speak ever, so I consider them the most emo. Guy from FF2 was a little bit Emo. The guy from FF3 wasn't. Cant speak for 5 or 6 not played them.

3.Jacob isn't really a protagonist is he. But yeah he was ok in a fight but damn I have seen slugs more interesting than Jacob, he was really just so dull. His only interesting feature is he is one of the very few boring Bioware characters.

Ok, so you named a couple examples, I never said that NONE of the old FFs were completely emo-free. And you can't count the cast of the original FF, they're neutral on the emo scale. They might not talk, but they sure as hell don't whine. :P

All I'm saying is that for all FF's 6 and under, the number of emos to be found is a lot smaller than it is in all the FF's 7 and up.

:3 and just for some fun since we've both apparently already derailed your topic...who would you say is the most emo FF character out there? Wanna see if you agree with me on this one. :P

ARGH my beautiful topic you KILLED IT, it was supposed to be about Protagonists btw, yeah there are some pre ff7 characters that are happy but the protagonists are usually pretty glum.

Anyway having not played all of the final fantasy games, I have to go with Cecil he never shows any emotion, apart from that one time he gets a tiny bit irritated that Golbez has captured Rosa. Cloud never seems that happy either.
But form what you guys are saying I would say Squall is probably the worst.

verdant monkai:

RJ 17:

verdant monkai:

1. Oh don't be hard on yourself you aren't really a dick if you are willing to admit you can be one.

2. SERIOUSLY MAN? think about Cecil from FF4 he is the definition of Emo, oh and you know FF1 none of them speak ever, so I consider them the most emo. Guy from FF2 was a little bit Emo. The guy from FF3 wasn't. Cant speak for 5 or 6 not played them.

3.Jacob isn't really a protagonist is he. But yeah he was ok in a fight but damn I have seen slugs more interesting than Jacob, he was really just so dull. His only interesting feature is he is one of the very few boring Bioware characters.

Ok, so you named a couple examples, I never said that NONE of the old FFs were completely emo-free. And you can't count the cast of the original FF, they're neutral on the emo scale. They might not talk, but they sure as hell don't whine. :P

All I'm saying is that for all FF's 6 and under, the number of emos to be found is a lot smaller than it is in all the FF's 7 and up.

:3 and just for some fun since we've both apparently already derailed your topic...who would you say is the most emo FF character out there? Wanna see if you agree with me on this one. :P

ARGH my beautiful topic you KILLED IT, it was supposed to be about Protagonists btw, yeah there are some pre ff7 characters that are happy but the protagonists are usually pretty glum.

Anyway having not played all of the final fantasy games, I have to go with Cecil he never shows any emotion, apart from that one time he gets a tiny bit irritated that Golbez has captured Rosa. Cloud never seems that happy either.
But form what you guys are saying I would say Squall is probably the worst.

I'd argue, then, that you misphrased your question. "Protagonist" doesn't necessarily mean "Main Character". I'd argue that Rosa, Rydia, Edge, Yang, Tellah, Kain, and Edward are all "protagonists". And while I'll give you Cecil, Kain, and Edward as being emo, Rosa, Rydia, Edge, Yang, and Tellah certainly aren't.

Case in point: Who would you say is the main character of FFVI? There's some that are obviously not in contention (Relm, Strago, Shadow, Gogo, etc). But who's the "main" character of FFVI? Is it Locke? Is it Celes? Is it Terra? That's why I classify them all as "protagonists".

And for the record, I believe that Cyan is the only real emo character from FFVI, you can't count Shadow because he's a ninja, and as such is "aloof" rather than emo. :P

Abobo from Abobo's Big Adventure!

Big, bad oafish musclehead from the old school that fights his way through various levels of various 8-bit video games.

Can I squeeze the Protag from Persona 4 in here? I fucking love that guy! You seen his walk animation? He has the most amazing swagger! *ahem* oh yeah and his character is actually really interesting and shit... DAT SWAG

The damn Persona 3 Protag gets all the glory, the dick.

Seriously, I hate that guy XP

I suppose the entire Investigation Team could count as protagonists couldn't they? Damn. Any chance I can fit a complete breakdown of why each character is so fucking awesome and well rounded in here? No? Ah ok...

I'd say Yosuke is probably the most underappreciated guy on the team, he can be a bit of a dick... But his homophobia is an actual character flaw, not just a "we want this guy to have some tension with Kanji" button.

You can tell he can't help it, he just lashes out in irrational fear. He gets over it mostly by the 3/4 point.

And I couldn't forget Yukiko... Shadow's got you down? Yukiko! Flame them to death kthx! Shadow's got you down to near death? Yukiko! Heal meh! Actually hit zero HP? NOPE! Yukiko steps in and takes the fucking hit for you like a boss and her character developm- ok stop, stop you're hyperventilating again... This is why I don't go into Persona 4. Essays get written without my realising it XD

God! I need a PS2 stat!

Oh and Raiden in MGS2 wasn't really that bad he just questioned everything anyone said, usually for no good reason and he'd never get anything out of it he'd just make himself look plain inept and whiny.

And i can't mention MGS2 without saying fuck Rose. Just get out.

Squall. Everyone dumps on him for being "whiny" and "emo". Yeah? Let me throw the weight of the world at you with you having no say and lets see how you take it! He's not emo, he's a fucking teenager! They're all like that under stress! Cloud, I can give you as getting rather emo, but for fucks sake, Squall at least has the balls to yell at the old guy at his school that he doesn't want the responsibility! He's reeling against being put into a position he doesn't want to be in. And then he nearly dies, and people make fun of him not handling it well? The fuck is wrong with people?!

Femshep

I mean at least now she gets some recognition...but before? the boxart, the trailers....hell even in ME1 its not even clear that being female is an option

Balthier. Because no amount of appreciation would be enough for that incarnation of pure badass.

Nier comes immediately to mind.

wintercoat:
Squall. Everyone dumps on him for being "whiny" and "emo". Yeah? Let me throw the weight of the world at you with you having no say and lets see how you take it! He's not emo, he's a fucking teenager! They're all like that under stress! Cloud, I can give you as getting rather emo, but for fucks sake, Squall at least has the balls to yell at the old guy at his school that he doesn't want the responsibility! He's reeling against being put into a position he doesn't want to be in. And then he nearly dies, and people make fun of him not handling it well? The fuck is wrong with people?!

I think the problem is that people seem to use the word emo for "Emotionally tormented but still willing to do something." (i.e, cecil, terra, celes) and "Complains about his/her problems rather than doing anything about them."

Would Luigi count? If so, him. He's also the only one I can think of right now.

Viewtiful Joe. Nuanced, relatable, funny, unusual, and tragic in a kind of reflective way. I just never hear about him anymore.

Amaterasu!

Poor girl isn't even thanked for the stuff she does in her own game.

She only appears as a white wolf to mortals (without the markings, weapons etc), so at best, people just notice that good things seem to happen when the 'white wolf' is around.

Atrus from the Myst series.

Come on, the man WRITES WORLDS and underwent some absolutely horrifying situations, and finally

The best I've heard people say about him? "Rand Miller is a pretty OK actor."

Gah.

Ulala from Space Channel 5.

Anyone who can dance there way to saving the universe is awesome in my opinion.

Gorion :P foster father of the baalspawn

The main cast of Wild Arms 3.

All four protagonists were believable and actually dressed sensibly.

xD Yup, Squall was who I was thinking of. One scene I will always remember as it shows just how unbelievably emo he is is the part when they make it to Galbadia Garden (think that's the one, probably misspelled it, it's the place where you get the Cerberus GF). The gang is all in some kind of waiting room, all having their own private thoughts, then Squall's pops in and he starts thinking about dead people, then his own death, then about how after you die everyone starts talking about you in the past tense. He works himself up into a frenzy before shattering the silence by screaming out loud "NO ONE'S GOING TO TALK ABOUT ME IN THE PAST TENSE!!!" and he storms out the door leaving everyone in the room standing there in shock like "What....the fuck....was that?"

I am struggling to find an instance were one could talk about a dead person in a tense other than past. I guess they could use the imperfect (past continuous) case, but that seems like a stretch.

Probably Kaim from Lost Odyssey. He easily has one of the most depressing backstories in the game industry, having lived a thousand years, meaning a thousand years of losing people he cares about and seeing horrible things etc etc, and he's been moreorless left an emotionless wreck because of it (Until a short while into the game. Not too long at all. He's friendly really.)
Seriously, if you can read the sadder Thousand Years of Dreams sequences that tell the stories of his past and be in a good mood afterwards, you are not human.

Vault101:
Femshep

I mean at least now she gets some recognition...but before? the boxart, the trailers....hell even in ME1 its not even clear that being female is an option

Yeah Me3 did wonders for her though, she didn't have much of a look before, she was sort of just a regular woman with brown hair which was fine. But 3 turned her into a bit of uh hot Badass, which was cool and I did my renegade playhtrough with her.

RJ 17:

verdant monkai:

RJ 17:
Ok, so you named a couple examples, I never said that NONE of the old FFs were completely emo-free. And you can't count the cast of the original FF, they're neutral on the emo scale. They might not talk, but they sure as hell don't whine. :P

All I'm saying is that for all FF's 6 and under, the number of emos to be found is a lot smaller than it is in all the FF's 7 and up.

:3 and just for some fun since we've both apparently already derailed your topic...who would you say is the most emo FF character out there? Wanna see if you agree with me on this one. :P

ARGH my beautiful topic you KILLED IT, it was supposed to be about Protagonists btw, yeah there are some pre ff7 characters that are happy but the protagonists are usually pretty glum.

Anyway having not played all of the final fantasy games, I have to go with Cecil he never shows any emotion, apart from that one time he gets a tiny bit irritated that Golbez has captured Rosa. Cloud never seems that happy either.
But form what you guys are saying I would say Squall is probably the worst.

I'd argue, then, that you misphrased your question. "Protagonist" doesn't necessarily mean "Main Character". I'd argue that Rosa, Rydia, Edge, Yang, Tellah, Kain, and Edward are all "protagonists". And while I'll give you Cecil, Kain, and Edward as being emo, Rosa, Rydia, Edge, Yang, and Tellah certainly aren't.

Case in point: Who would you say is the main character of FFVI? There's some that are obviously not in contention (Relm, Strago, Shadow, Gogo, etc). But who's the "main" character of FFVI? Is it Locke? Is it Celes? Is it Terra? That's why I classify them all as "protagonists".

And for the record, I believe that Cyan is the only real emo character from FFVI, you can't count Shadow because he's a ninja, and as such is "aloof" rather than emo. :P

Protagonist sort of does mean main character dude, google the definition of protagonist
Noun:
The leading character or a major character in a drama, movie, novel, or other fictional text.
The main figure or one of the most prominent figures in a real situation.

But enough of me being a gramma Nazi, I am sorry but as I said I haven't played ff6. But I am going to correct that soon, by getting a hot pink ps2 and FF 1-12 to play on it. (wish me luck buying all those games)

verdant monkai:
Snip

:P My friend, look at the 2nd half of both of those definitions:
"The leading character or a major character in a drama, etc etc"
"The main figure or one of the most prominent figures in a real situation"

:P the 2nd half of both those definitions is what I described, it's the more broader description of "protagonist" than saying "The main good guy".

Kane in Kane & Lynch. One of the few cases where the protagonists aren't perfect, well-shaped, genius mastermind warriors.
On the other end, at least favorite who everyone else love to praise, would be Commander Shepard. I hate him no matter what he does, whether it's punch news reporters, have sex with blue alien reptiles with drawn eyebrows, shoot some aliens, throw people off buildings, it's just all so horrible. I never heard even a single complaint about how horribly cheesy and badly voiced his conversations are.

RJ 17:

verdant monkai:
Snip

:P My friend, look at the 2nd half of both of those definitions:
"The leading character or a major character in a drama, etc etc"
"The main figure or one of the most prominent figures in a real situation"

:P the 2nd half of both those definitions is what I described, it's the more broader description of "protagonist" than saying "The main good guy".

Ok yeah, but just in the future when I or other people say protagonist they generally mean "the main character". I will take your word for it that the ones you stated could be considered "protagonists", cos I haven't played their games. :)

verdant monkai:

RJ 17:

verdant monkai:
Snip

:P My friend, look at the 2nd half of both of those definitions:
"The leading character or a major character in a drama, etc etc"
"The main figure or one of the most prominent figures in a real situation"

:P the 2nd half of both those definitions is what I described, it's the more broader description of "protagonist" than saying "The main good guy".

Ok yeah, but just in the future when I or other people say protagonist they generally mean "the main character". I will take your word for it that the ones you stated could be considered "protagonists", cos I haven't played their games. :)

:P I'm an English major who has done plenty of work in theater as well, and trust me, it's a very common misconception that you had. I'm not saying you were wrong at all, all "main characters" are protagonists, but not all protagonists have to be the main character.

As I said, you'll get a great example of this when you get to FF6.

And that reminds me, if I were you I'd go no further than the original Final Fantasy Tactics. At least in my opinion, FF8 is where things start sliding downhill for the whole franchise.

Apollo Justice. Yeah, a lot of people pick on him for not being as awesome as Phoenix Wright, but he was still an interesting character and certainly was well within the ballpark of what made Phoenix such a good character.

He's still head and shoulders above what a lot of people tend to commonly complain about when it comes to modern protagonists (whether from western or eastern games)

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And that reminds me, if I were you I'd go no further than the original Final Fantasy Tactics. At least in my opinion, FF8 is where things start sliding downhill for the whole franchise.

I disagree there just because IX is my personal favorite, and I enjoyed that they tried to create a cast and world more akin to the classic games.

Tactics is my favorite non-numbered FF game though.

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