I'm still waiting for the day they re-introduce the Bloody Mess perk from Fallout; combine it with the new killcams and you could suplex people till their heads explode RE4 style
SajuukKhar: As glad as I am that they are adding new weapon types I never understood peoples hardons for crossbows, spears, and halberds.
they were like the three shittiest weapon types in Morrowind.
that is why they were removed... because they sucked, and almost no one used them.
Agreed, They'd all be very impractical weapons for the kind of combat you're in anyway. I'm all for variety but the amount of crap Bethesda got for not including them was ridiculous. But if they add them now, fine by my, I just won't be using them. However I really hope they will never introduce Shuriken and darts again. I mean c'mon. Personally I'm no fan of the katana either, but they have become the signature weapon of the Blades. So, nothing we can do about it.
StraightToHeck: I'm still waiting for the day they re-introduce the Bloody Mess perk from Fallout; combine it with the new killcams and you could suplex people till their heads explode RE4 style
That's not how TES perks work, Oh why did they have to call them perks? Could have avoided all the confusion by calling them abilities or whatever.
WHY ARE (most of you from what I see) YOU GETTING SO HAPPY!?!?!?
I just... I don't even....
Every last one of you should replay morrowind. (or just, play it, if you haven't).
There was every weapon you could possibly imagine short of guns and siege equipment of course. Tons of amazing, variety of spells. Personalities in the characters, memories made, choices to make. And they're going to make you pay an extra 10 dollars probably to use a crossbow!? And I hear cheering!?
Besides that, morrowind was the last of the real rpgs in the series... skyrim and oblivion are mostly just hack and slashes with some rpg elements.
hell, they butchered skyrim. Where is our attributes guys????? All they did was add the skill system from fallout, which even that had attributes.
No offense but a large percentage of morrowind's weapons and spells were overly redundant, they existed solely for the sake of existing rather then proving new gameplay elements. . . Furthermore I replayed Morrowind not 3 months ago, for about the 20th time, and I can safely say I am glad Skyrim isn't like it. the god awful leveling system, the shittastic combat system, the incredibly useless map and NPC directions.
Lets also not forget how unbalanced the armor system was. Magic cloths + magic armor + magic robe + rings + amulets it was a nightmare of unbalance. . . Also attributes are still in Skyrim, it has been shown time and time again that the so called "removal of attributes" in BS. All functions attributes servered, with the exception of luck, are in skyrim in other means.
SajuukKhar: No offense but a large percentage of morrowind's weapons and spells were overly redundant, they existed solely for the sake of existing rather then proving new gameplay elements.
Right... That's why you could make your own spells with these effects. And it really wasn't fun for you at all? To have all these awesome spells? Come on! Skyrim is so freaking straightforward with the spells it's boring!!!!!!!
Furthermore I replayed Morrowind not 3 months ago and I can safely say I am glad Skyrim isn't like it. the god awful leveling system, the shittastic combat system, the incredibly useless map and NPC directions.
Levelling system was fine, only the messed up attribute/skill levelling was a bit messy about it.
The combat system was fine too, I don't understand.
Incredibly useless map and npc directions? Oh, I'm sure they all had a handheld GPS back then, besides all the directions were more or less accurate and the map helped you worm your way through well enough.
Lets also not forget how unbalanced the armor system was. Magic cloths + magic armor + magic robe + rings + amulets it was a nightmare of unbalance.
How all this stuff makes it unbalanced? Nonsense.
Furthermore attributes are still in Skyrim is have been shown time and time again that the so called "removal of attributes" in BS. all functions attriubtes servers, with the exception of luck, are in skyrim in other means.
I don't believe that shit. All we get are health magicka and stamina. These are what you mean by attributes? If so, I'm sorry... but that's a sad... sad excuse. Otherwise, show me these if you don't mind. I don't understand.
if there is one thing to complain about morrowind, it's the terrain to player character issues.
The only thing people used spellmaking for was to making absurdly overpowered spells that cost nearly nothing. While I do wish it was back, I can understand what it was removed. . . Na the leveling system was broken, especially how the skill trainers interacted with it. Unlimited skill trainers per level? god so broken.
Also if you dont see what the problem is with being able to look directly at something, have a 100 blade skill, hit the attack button, and miss because a random unseeable diceroll said you did then..... well there is no hope.
The map was useless because you didn't mark 99% of places when you found them, furthermore NPCs directions usually consisted of "the cave you are looking for is west of X and north or Y", when in reality is was more like "3 times as far west of X then it is north of Y". It was a common complaint at how nearly unfindable things were. . . How does having 20 pieces of magic gear make the game unbalanced? how does opening up the console and giving yourself 100% resistance to everything, make the game unbalanced?
If you had even formerly good enchantments on your armor+clothes+robes you became untouchable. . . Oblivion: Agility: Affects your total Fatigue, damage dealt by ranged weapons, and your steadiness in combat. Skyrim: fatigue is raised via level ups, ranged weapon damage is affected by the bow skill/perks, steadiness in combat is affected by perks
Oblivion: Endurance: Affects your total Fatigue, as well as your starting health and your health gain upon leveling up. Skyrim: as mentioned before fatigue is raised via leveling up, as is health. the only part of fatigue is missing is the very slight increase in health gain you get
Oblivion: Intelligence: Affects your total Magicka. Skyrim: magicka is raised by leveling up
Oblivion: Personality: Affects your ability to gain information and better prices from NPCs. Skyrim: ability to gain information, and price of objects is raised by speech skill and speech perks, furthermore doing quests for NPCs raises disposition
Oblivion: Speed: Affects how fast you move. Skyrim: Race and gender affect how fast you move
Oblivion: Strength :Affects your total encumbrance, your total Fatigue and the damage done by melee attacks. Skyrim: encumbrance is affected by fatigue, fatigue is raised via leveling up, melee weapon damage is raised by the skill itself and perks
Oblivion: Willpower: Affects the rate at which Magicka regenerates, as well as your total Fatigue. Skyrim: magicka regen rate is affected by total magicka, fatigue is raised by leveling up
The only attribute not to make it from Oblivion into Skyrim is luck. All other attributes had their functions merged with other, more reasonable, tings.
My problem with the snow elves/falmer is that your only interaction with them begins and ends with slaughter in dark caves. Sure, they have a pretty nifty backstory, but it never comes to anything in the game. All the cool parts of their history is mentioned in a few books. If you actually talked with some falmer, I'd be able to have some sort of sympathy for them.
SajuukKhar: No offense but a large percentage of morrowind's weapons and spells were overly redundant, they existed solely for the sake of existing rather then proving new gameplay elements. . . Furthermore I replayed Morrowind not 3 months ago, for about the 20th time, and I can safely say I am glad Skyrim isn't like it. the god awful leveling system, the shittastic combat system, the incredibly useless map and NPC directions.
Lets also not forget how unbalanced the armor system was. Magic cloths + magic armor + magic robe + rings + amulets it was a nightmare of unbalance. . . Also attributes are still in Skyrim, it has been shown time and time again that the so called "removal of attributes" in BS. All functions attributes servered, with the exception of luck, are in skyrim in other means.
Hey now, I loved those directions, I never got lost using them(Well, there was this one time when I had to google a place but it turned out it was right over the hill... Yeah. The satisfaction of finding locations on your own using NPC directions was great and I preferred it immensely over "follow the arrow"
And before you go: "Just turn off the quest markers, derp!" I can't because the NPC's don't give directions!
Edit: Also, Skyrim doesn't have speed in any way shape or form, I wish we still had attributes. I also miss a great deal of skills.
Dude your only excuse is that every cheated for unlimited gold and items??? Seriously? Not everyone plays like that. The console was necessary to fix yourself out of some buggy situations, it was not intentionally designed to just cheat. Plus there's the console versions.
Also if you dont see what the problem is with being able to look directly at something, have a 100 blade skill, hit the attack button, and miss because a random unseeable diceroll said you did then..... well there is no hope.
From you're logic a master swordsman or rifleman or bowman never misses his target. Which is entirely not true, world works like this. You don't 100% chance to succeed in everything dude. The whole thing was an attempt to simulate dodging attacks. In skyrim you don't dodge, you just block or take the fucking punch depending on if it was a melee attack or not, which is totally idiotic.
The map was useless because you didn't mark 99% of places when you found them, furthermore NPCs directions usually consisted of "the cave you are looking for is west of X and north or Y", when in reality is was more like "3 times as far west of X then it is north of Y". It was a common complaint at how nearly unfindable things were.
You didn't mark 99% of the places when you found them....? Dude, there is a secondary map type to see all these "99%" of places when you're in the vicinity.
How does having 20 pieces of magic gear make the game unbalanced? how does opening up the console and giving yourself 100% resistance to everything, make the game unbalanced?
AGAIN, you're just going on about people cheating. And you couldn't wear 20 items, you could wear 2 rings, 1 amulet, 6 bodily armor/clothing. That's 9.
If you had even formerly good enchantments on your armor+clothes+robes you became untouchable
Yes, go put on some "formerly good enchantments" and fight dagoth ur without the main quest items.
-snip-
So fatigue is everything. an orc can't be as fast as a khajit cus he's an orc? It's called conditioning and training. Depends on how you move your feet and how well conditioned you are to run for periods of times.
Honestly, it doesn't even have good RPG elements, it's like they made a singleplayer MMO.
Jynthor: Hey now, I loved those directions, I never got lost using them(Well, there was this one time when I had to google a place but it turned out it was right over the hill... Yeah. The satisfaction of finding locations on your own using NPC directions was great and I preferred it immensely over "follow the arrow"
And before you go: "Just turn off the quest markers, derp!" I can't because the NPC's don't give directions!
Edit: Also, Skyrim doesn't have speed in any way shape or form, I wish we still had attributes. I also miss a great deal of skills.
Speed is affected by your characters race/gender. . . Also when given a quest turn off your arrows, open up your map, and remember what direction it is in.
The reason they removed directions is because NPCs are assumed to have marked it down on your map for you . . I wont comment on how lost you did or didnet get, but poor direction was a common complaint about Morrowind.
Tanis: How about the ability to actually MAKE arrows?
One of the great things about being on PC: mods for fletching, re-balancing, streamlining and re-adding cut content. OT: I'm excited. Hope they keep their word and it'll be more on the Shivering Isles scale of TES DLC.
Hey now, I loved those directions, I never got lost using them(Well, there was this one time when I had to google a place but it turned out it was right over the hill... Yeah. The satisfaction of finding locations on your own using NPC directions was great and I preferred it immensely over "follow the arrow"
And before you go: "Just turn off the quest markers, derp!" I can't because the NPC's don't give directions!
Edit: Also, Skyrim doesn't have speed in any way shape or form, I wish we still had attributes. I also miss a great deal of skills.
Speed is affected by your characters race/gender. . . Also when given a quest turn off your arrows, open up your map, and remember what direction it is in.
The reason they removed directions is because NPCs are assumed to have marked it down on your map for you
Speed reflected your character's conditioning and stuff like that, you could train it if you wanted to and that's why attributes were awesome, they could change, a static stat that never changed except with the help of some items just isn't the same thing.
Tanis: How about the ability to actually MAKE arrows?
One of the great things about being on PC: mods for fletching, re-balancing, streamlining and re-adding cut content. OT: I'm excited. Hope they keep their word and it'll be more on the Shivering Isles scale of TES DLC.
DLC will be more along the lines of Fallout. Sorry to disappoint.
Jynthor: Speed reflected your character's conditioning and stuff like that, you could train it if you wanted to and that's why attributes were awesome, they could change, a static stat that never changed except with the help of some items just isn't the same thing.
How many people actually got speed to a high level? how many had the patience to not exploit the game to raise athletics and the like to get speed at a high level? Few... very few... speed was one of the worst implemented attributes in the entire game.
Jynthor: DLC will be more along the lines of Fallout. Sorry to disappoint.
Actually they said it would be closer to shivering Isles then Fallout 3.
they made it clear several times that the DLC will feel more like expansions then Fallout 3's DLC.
Tanis: How about the ability to actually MAKE arrows?
One of the great things about being on PC: mods for fletching, re-balancing, streamlining and re-adding cut content. OT: I'm excited. Hope they keep their word and it'll be more on the Shivering Isles scale of TES DLC.
DLC will be more along the lines of Fallout. Sorry to disappoint.
Which is still closer to the Shivering Isles end of the spectrum. Note: I didn't say "as big as Shivering Isles," the implication was that it wouldn't be on the Horse Armor side of the spectrum in the way that it would add nothing.
Jynthor: Speed reflected your character's conditioning and stuff like that, you could train it if you wanted to and that's why attributes were awesome, they could change, a static stat that never changed except with the help of some items just isn't the same thing.
How many people actually got speed to a high level? how many had the patience to not exploit the game to raise athletics and the like to get speed at a high level? Few... very few... speed was one of the worst implemented attributes in the entire game.
Jynthor: DLC will be more along the lines of Fallout. Sorry to disappoint.
Actually they said it would be closer to shivering Isles then Fallout 3.
they made it clear several ties the DLc will feel more like expansions then Fallout 3's DLC.
You are basing your opinion of what was broken and should have been fixed. But it was instead removed. Would you not have preferred it if we still had an awesome and complex levelling system without the meta gaming?Yes the levelling system had flaws, but removing it was just lazy.
And I'm pretty sure Todd said on multiple occasions the DLC would be more like Fallout than Oblivion. Oh well.
You are basing your opinion of what was broken and should have been fixed. But it was instead removed. Would you not have preferred it if we still had an awesome and complex levelling system without the meta gaming?Yes the levelling system had flaws, but removing it was just lazy.
And I'm pretty sure Todd said on multiple occasions the DLC would be more like Fallout than Oblivion. Oh well.
Considering that attribute systems cause game characters to start of unique but end up the same, while skill based systems cause players to start off the same and end up unique, I would rather have Skyrim's skill system over the old attribute system.
The problem with attribute systems is that regardless of what you pick at the beginning, warrior, mage, thief, etc. etc., so long as you played the game even remotely smart, you always ended up the same.
A warrior with 100 in all attributes is equal to a mage with 100 in all attributes in every way, it makes the picking of classes, and races totally pointless becuase no matter what you do you end up exactly the same in the end.
With Skyrim's system everyone starts off the same but a mage with 100 in all skills and a warrior with 100 in all skills WONT end up the same because of perk choices.
Skyrim's skill/perk system offers far more character diversity in the long run then the attribute system ever did.
I would rather perfer the system that makes my characters unique.
You are basing your opinion of what was broken and should have been fixed. But it was instead removed. Would you not have preferred it if we still had an awesome and complex levelling system without the meta gaming?Yes the levelling system had flaws, but removing it was just lazy.
And I'm pretty sure Todd said on multiple occasions the DLC would be more like Fallout than Oblivion. Oh well.
Considering that attribute systems cause game characters to start of unique but end up the same, while skill based systems cause players to start off the same and end up unique, I would rather have Skyrim's skill system over the old attribute system.
The problem with attribute systems is that regardless of what you pick at the beginning, warrior, mage, thief, etc. etc., so long as you played the game even remotely smart, you always ended up the same.
A warrior with 100 in all attributes is equal to a mage with 100 in all attributes in every way, it makes the picking of classes, and races totally pointless.
With Skyrim's system everyone starts off the same but a mage with 100 in all skills and a warrior with 100 in all skills WONT end up the same because of perk choices.
Skyrim's skill/perk system offers far more character diversity in the long run then the attribute system ever did.
I would rather perfer the system that makes my characters unique.
I don't think I ever said the attribute system should replace the perks. They'd work well together. Hell, even Oblivion had perks, you just didn't get to choose them. But I do agree to an extent, there should be limitations and consequences if you choose a certain path. Thankfully those are easy enough to implement through roleplaying. And on a similar note, joining some factions should cancel others out, and skill requirements wouldn't be bad either.
I don't think I ever said the attribute system should replace the perks. They'd work well together. Hell, even Oblivion had perks, you just didn't get to choose them. But I do agree to an extent, there should be limitations and consequences if you choose a certain path. Thankfully those are easy enough to implement through roleplaying. And on a similar note, joining some factions should cancel others out, and skill requirements wouldn't be bad either.
how exactly would an attribute system, which makes skills meaningless, and a perk system, which is based around how good your skills are go together?
What factions would know or care that you joined another faction?
What is the point of skill checks if anyone can just get past them?
Most of what you are suggesting it just putting up roadblocks to have roadblocks.
I don't think I ever said the attribute system should replace the perks. They'd work well together. Hell, even Oblivion had perks, you just didn't get to choose them. But I do agree to an extent, there should be limitations and consequences if you choose a certain path. Thankfully those are easy enough to implement through roleplaying. And on a similar note, joining some factions should cancel others out, and skill requirements wouldn't be bad either.
how exactly would an attribute system, which makes skills meaningless, and a perk system, which is based around how good your skills are go together?
What factions would know or care that you joined another faction?
What is the point of skill checks if anyone can just get past them?
Most of what you are suggesting it just putting up roadblocks to have roadblocks.
Simple, have attributes boost skills and do things skills don't do. It worked in TES games before so I don't see why you're not seeing it.
That's not really what I meant, if some factions should conflict then the faction you didn't join should be cancelled out unless you change your allegiance in a quest. Obviously not really the case in Skyrim, although a limit to the amount of guild you can join would be nice. Being the Dragonborn, Arch Mage, Harbinger, Guild master of the Thieves Guild and Listener of the Dark brotherhood all at the same time is incredibly stupid. I limit myself to one faction and it's pretty do able, however it would be nice to actually see my choices reflected in the game.
As for skill checks. If you are a warrior who never touched a single spell you won't pass the skill check because... Your skill isn't high enough. I think you misunderstood me as I'm sure you'd figure that out.
But yeah, I guess I do sort of want roadblocks for the sake of having roadblocks. I can't deny that.
Simple, have attributes boost skills and do things skills don't do. It worked in TES games before so I don't see why you're not seeing it.
That's not really what I meant, if some factions should conflict then the faction you didn't join should be cancelled out unless you change your allegiance in a quest. Obviously not really the case in Skyrim, although a limit to the amount of guild you can join would be nice. Being the Dragonborn, Arch Mage, Harbinger, Guild master of the Thieves Guild and Listener of the Dark brotherhood all at the same time is incredibly stupid. I limit myself to one faction and it's pretty do able, however it would be nice to actually see my choices reflected in the game.
As for skill checks. If you are a warrior who never touched a single spell you won't pass the skill check because... Your skill isn't high enough. I think you misunderstood me as I'm sure you'd figure that out.
But yeah, I guess I do sort of want roadblocks for the sake of having roadblocks. I can't deny that.
The thing is skills in previous TES games DID NOTHING. Skills only existed to get you points to level up. Attribute systems work because they turn skills into meaningless numbers that only let you level up.
I dont see how being master of all the guilds is stupid, there's no reason why you shouldn't be able to, and no one makes you do them all.
The thing is skills in previous TES games DID NOTHING. Skills only existed to get you points to level up. Attribute systems work because they turn skills into meaningless numbers that only let you level up.
I dont see how being master of all the guilds is stupid, there's no reason why you shouldn't be able to, and no one makes you do them all.
Skills definitely helped, we must have played different games.
And you see nothing wrong with being master of all guilds? I don't even know how to explain how stupid it is, so let's just agree to disagree.
And I realize by now it must seem I must hate Skyrim, but that's not true, I only complain because I want TES to be the perfect game. Of course, everyone's vision of a perfect game is different.
Jynthor: Skills definitely helped, we must have played different games.
And you see nothing wrong with being master of all guilds? I don't even know how to explain how stupid it is, so let's just agree to disagree.
In morrowind the only thing skills did was slightly increase the chance of your hitting.
All damage, and most attack chance was governed by attributes.
That explains it, I played Oblivion way more than Morrowind. Actually I only finished it once, but it was a great experience.(It all started with Oblivion for me, that's why I like it so much, I guess.)
That explains it, I played Oblivion way more than Morrowind. Actually I only finished it once, but it was a great experience.(It all started with Oblivion for me, that's why I like it so much, I guess.)
That explains it, I played Oblivion way more than Morrowind. Actually I only finished it once, but it was a great experience.(It all started with Oblivion for me, that's why I like it so much, I guess.)
Oblivion was sltighly better
Still most of your damage was attribute based.
It made you do more damage and it gave you perks, so it did something. Anyway we probably should get back on topic. I hope we get to see more of Black Reach.
I wouldn't be surprised if you had to go there to start the DLC, Blackreach was supposedly where the falmer and dwemer fought, makes sense it would lead to their homebase.
PrinceOfShapeir: You do realize that the Thalmor are genocidal, tyrannical monsters, right?
You do realize that the person the are fighting against, Lorkhan, tricked countless spirits into making the mortal world, resulting in the death of untold numbers of beings, the systematic spiritual degradation of countless others into mortal forms, and then has sent numerous Avatars to the mortal realm to murder elven kind to keep them trapped to force them to try to find CHIM, something they never wanted?
The Thalmor may be genocidal but Lorkhan/Talos/Shor/Sithis is no better.
The Thalmor aren't fighting Lorkhan, they're fighting Mankind, persecuting them for following their religion and waging a war of conquest across Tamriel. They're fucking Nazis. It's not even subtle, they even dress up like they're S.S.
The Thalmor aren't fighting Lorkhan, they're fighting Mankind, persecuting them for following their religion and waging a war of conquest across Tamriel. They're fucking Nazis. It's not even subtle, they even dress up like they're S.S.
Mankind are the children of Lorkhan, the only way to take him/Talos out is to take humans out
To kill Man is to reach Heaven, from where we came before the Doom Drum's iniquity. When we accomplish this, we can escape the mockery and long shame of the Material Prison.
To achieve this goal, we must:
1) Erase the Upstart Talos from the mythic. His presence fortifies the Wheel of the Convention, and binds our souls to this plane.
2) Remove Man not just from the world, but from the Pattern of Possibility, so that the very idea of them can be forgotten and thereby never again repeated.
3) With Talos and the Sons of Talos removed, the Dragon will become ours to unbind. The world of mortals will be over. The Dragon will uncoil his hold on the stagnancy of linear time and move as Free Serpent again, moving through the Aether without measure or burden, spilling time along the innumerable roads we once travelled. And with that we will regain the mantle of the imperishable spirit.
Kakulukia: I get the feeling Snow Elves won't be Falmer... I don't think the words "Snow elves" were ever mentioned at all in vanilla Skyrim. Why would they switch terms for the DLC if it's actually the same race?
I hope I'm right, because I was giddy for Snow Elves/Falmer before the game was released and was crushed when I realized the Falmer were actually twisted monsters and not the adorable blue people from Morrowind.
And crossbows? Yay, I guess. I'd personally have spears, especially if you could use them as both melee and ranged weapons.
Snow Elves were always the Falmer. :s The Snow Elves were driven underground when the Nords took Skyrim from them. The Dwemer betrayed them, as well. After living underground for so long, the Falmer were turned blind due to not even using their eyes anyway, and their other senses were made stronger. I pitched my Skyrim long ago so I don't know where, but somewhere in the game they tell you about how the Falmer became what they are.
The DLC sounds like it could be interesting. But I can't really play my Skyrim as I traded it in long ago to pay off a pre-order for Kingdoms of Amalur. The whole thing with the Snow Elves would be the only thing that interests me about it, though. I couldn't really care less about crossbows.
But the Falmer were awesome. =< Annoying at times, but the whole "betrayed by the Dwemer and left to rot underground" thing made me feel quite sorry for them. Even if they were trying to slice me open. A lot.
I agree. I felt so sorry for the Falmer, after I learned what happened to them. Skyrim belongs to them.
I swear this game, really needs some 'elven revenge' DLC, I'm sick of being made to care for,and 'save' those unwashed, ignorant Nords.
I want DLC that let's me help the Thalmore win. >_>
We know, you post that in every damn fantasy related thread you come across. Help the Thalmor, pfft. The voices in my head make more sense than that...
Agreed, I want DLC that has me kick the Thalmor's butt out of Skyrim. I won that Civil War for the Empire, not the Dominion so gtfo you bunch of racist elves.
Joking aside (but not really. I kill every Thalmor I come across in Skyrim); I'm interested in this DLC. I know Falmer and Snow Elf are basically interchangeable as a word but I'd like to see an actual Snow Elf. Not all blind and corrupted and stuff, just a Snow Elf.
The backstory to their race is interesting and I'd like to see how they would interact with what has happened to the rest of their race.
As glad as I am that they are adding new weapon types I never understood peoples hardons for crossbows, spears, and halberds.
they were like the three shittiest weapon types in Morrowind.
that is why they were removed... because they sucked, and almost no one used them.