Sportsmanship in Games

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Now as the title suggests I would like to talk a little about the sportsmanship in games, or lack thereof. I am going to try not to use sweeping generalizations that "all games are unsportsmanlike". I know that I am going to use them so sorry about that.

What I am going to try is to have a little information about the topic, have a nice discussion about it, and have a little story(or more) to go with it. All good?

Good!

Don't worry here's a TL;DR :

Gaming seems to have a lack of sportsmanship, online and offline. Why do you think that is true? Why do you think that it is untrue? How do you think that it can change?
And if you have any experiences tell them! :D

And here's the "long version that I will type out because I can" one:

As online gaming or just regular LAN gaming takes off in popularity, on thing that I noticed is some professional players not really demonstrating good sportsmanship to one another. From the team trash talking the other team, to calling the other team a joke and partying the day before the game because you knew you were going to beat them, and finally to just general disrespect for your opponent. This has been shown many different times in online gaming also.

Want an example of this? The phrase GG has been transformed over time from a term meaning "hey that was a great game, good job!" to "games over, you lost" or worse (GG scrub. GG noob, etc.). Or terms like "GG no re" or "GG ez game" that show a complete disrespect of the game played. In some games after killing a person once or winning one round of many, some players After having one big play in a game that may have no effect over winning does not warrant a GG or that the game is over.

Again, not everyone who uses GG means the harshest one. I know many people that usually mean it when they say it.(I just type good game or great game) Maybe it is just because of the games that I play (*cough* Dota has the worst community *cough*) but it seems as though that it is just excepted that this is what happens. Being a complete jerk to someone over winning a game is not "expected" of the players.

Since playing Tribes: Ascend I come across the odd dick, whether it's some high ranker getting frustrated at his team for losing (luck of the draw, sometimes all the good players go for Blood Eagle) or sore winners, who insist on rubbing it in your face. But for the most part there's lost of compliments when someone takes an enemy out in a sweet way, usually by said deceased enemy!

I understand that games with a broader audience (trying not to specifically say 'Call of Duty' here) are more likely to have a bigger percentage of assholes and sore losers/winners ratio.

I would hope that it seems more prevalent in games just because of a higher numbers of people. What really gets to me is the cycle that also often happens because of the disrespect of the people playing the game.

We can use the example of Dota or any other Moba game. They all seem to have terrible communities with no sportsmanship, and newer people that join into them either leave or say to themselves "well this is what everyone else is doing, I might as well do it also!" And the non-sportmanship (new word!) taht is also perpetuated by the way that the professional players of those games act during their games.

depends on the game, in games with large community's, especially ones were bad players are catered for like MW3 people are assholes, and although in small community's like RTW its still a problem although its not as prevalent, people know that if you are a straight up asshole you will be community blocked and if you find a player on your skill level they will happily play re-matches with you and allot of the time people will chat with you about the game and strategy and how you couldve done this better or that better. Most of the behavior is toned down, for example when someone is a sore loser they will normally just rage quit or say "GG i would've won but (insert bullshit excuse here)"

on FPS games i get this
derp: "FUCK U, U CAMPING DOUCHE BAG 1V1 U HAVE NO SKILL, NO LIFE U SUCK"
me: (troll mode engage) ok 1v1
after afew minutes if me humiliating derp
derp: FUCK U, U STILL SUCK COCK FAGGOT 1V1 DONT PROVE SHIT I WILL MEET YOU IRL AND FUCK U UP U NIGGA PRICK JEW FAG"
me: /blocked

Yeah. I play alot of League of legends, and team mates, and the opponents will sooner crucify you for an error, rather than discuss it. Trash talking is a part of gaming, to a degree. I mean, getting under an adversaries skin can be a part of a strategy, but alot of people are just dicks. Id love to see a more polite gaming community, but with a still competitive attitude, especially for games such as LoL.

I think you will find there is plenty of sportsmanship in games however there are two accumulating effects that will always lead you to believe otherwise:
- people are generally 10x more dickish when anonymous
- you notice dicks 100x more then anyone else

Last game I played was World of Tanks and that community is 98% of extremely pleasant and helpful people, but the comments that always stick with me are the 2% of childish hate spewing.
Same goes for LAN parties, there are so many friendly people who want nothing more then a good time, but then there is always that one guy that inspires hate in everyone.

But I'll give you that gaming has one of the worst communities, it's competitive, anonymous, and because gaming is still considered childish such behavior is generally accepted and worse yet passed on to the younger players.

Not that I disagree - I don't - and not that I don't wish it were otherwise - I do - but the simple truth is that sportsmanlike behaviour requires something remotely resembling a sport. When you're out there playing in the muck, busting your ass off, and you can see that the other team is trying just as hard, it's a lot easier to feel like these are human beings who deserve your respect. If not respect, at least they don't deserve your hate.

Playing in complete isolation reduces people to their interaction with you. When that interaction brings you frustration, it's easy enough to imagine them as being complete douchebags who get off on ruining your day. And most of the time that's just not true... but by then you've already cussed them out, or they've cussed you out, and the time for civility is long gone.

If you want to play a game that's different, check out SC2. If you want to talk about how we can change gaming to make it a less hostile environment, I don't have any suggestions, but I'll eagerly listen.

P.S. I play without a mic/headset. In all my years with MF2 and BF3, I think I've been on the receiving end of verbal abuse... two times? Three? Maybe XBL is a different environment, maybe Halo brings out the 12 year olds more, but I find that staying out of trouble keeps trouble from finding me.

I've noticed a trend...

There's two different type of shooters... Thoughtful shooters, and twitch shooters.

Twitchy shooters have become DoDS, CSS, APB:R, CoD(fish), and Battlefield. Roughly 90% of games that have regenerative health, because the object of a regenerative health shooter is not to whittle and defeat your opponent, it is purely to "catch your opponent with his pants down"

Thoughtful shooters are games which require you to have a little more than dick-lock reflexes. Sure, reflexes will help you in Killing Floor, Left4Dead, Sanctum, Team Fortress, Natural Selection... But these games are about team-work, not kills. About working together.

Now... After downing 6 or 7 Monster energy drinks, how much better do you think you are at a Thoughtful shooter? What about a twitchy shooter?

These non-sportsmanlike wanks are this way because they truly believe that they are the shit. Quite frankly, because they see over and over, "Your doing great!" for doing so little as a snap-click. And for some vindictive reason which is billions of miles beyond me, they have absolutely no respect for "the lesser" players under them. But there's a catch, because if you give these people any other task than "twitch click," their skills are utterly worthless. It pisses them off, so these people gotta take it out on someone.

Either that, or these people are 6 years old and haven't learned how to communicate with others yet.

I dunno, that was ranty. It just blows my mind that people act this way, online, and offline. IMO, it's just a few steps below splashing someone on the side of the road. Back in my day, GG actually fucking meant "You guys did good." It used to be you got that in random games, now you don't even get it in clan vs clan matches. And this is primarily why I'm not in a clan anymore.

Has to do with the GIFT. In sports there is accountability because the other player is across the field/table/whatever from you. So, in theory, they can smack you in the puss. Across the series of tubes that is the internet? Not so much. No accountability = no rules.

From my experience, sportsmanship in games with an online component depends almost entirely on the type of community that each game draws. Certain shooters that we all know about and shall remain unnamed are hyper competitive and thus demand a certain mindset of its community (win or you suck). A lot of MMO's require that you be adequately prepared for whatever an encounter may throw at you in an area, and what is considered "adequate" is often determined by the community of that MMO, be the encounter PvP or PvE.

A great example I've found of sportsmanship in games is from the community in Dark Souls. For those unfamiliar with the game, if you're currently human (as opposed to being Hollow) you can summon other players into your world if they've placed down a summon symbol in their world. These players gain humanity (a valuable resource) and souls (XP+Currency) if they help you defeat the area boss. The downside to this is while you're human you can also be invaded. To be invaded is to have a player force their way into your world from theirs so that they can attempt to murder your sorry ass. If they succeed they get humanity and souls.

The thing about invaders is that the vast majority of them understand that what they're doing is inherently dickish. Now, certain circumstances aside, it's not a matter of them being strictly out to ruin your day, but rather they just want some PvP or they feel like PvP is the best way to obtain humanity and souls for whatever they need. This is why that whenever I've been invaded, I've found that the person invading will actually stop upon seeing me and bow before attacking. Kind of like saying "sorry, nothing personal, but I need your shit".

Jodah:
Has to do with the GIFT. In sports there is accountability because the other player is across the field/table/whatever from you. So, in theory, they can smack you in the puss. Across the series of tubes that is the internet? Not so much. No accountability = no rules.

So much this!
Sportsmanship is present because if someone does the wrong thing, they can be accountable. If you bad mouth someone an official can be told and punishment can be given, there is no system big enough to punish every foul mouthed twat on the internet. The internet gives people the chance to be someone else, some abuse the privilege by being a dick to others

bad sportsmanship offline? was it wrong of me to call that Banshee in ME3 motherfucker? did I hurt her feelings?

I find that SC2 is pretty good in terms of sportsmanship. Terms like GG and GLHF are standard

I rmember on Realm of the Mad God the online community was actually fairly nice, and a lot of people will just give you free good stuff if their class doesn't use it, I remeber one time a guy traded me an uber powerful set of priest gear and all he asked for in return was a potion. So I believe that good sportsmanship in games does exist, but is more prevalent in PvE thn in PvP.

Yup it good sportsmanship does exist, in fact I am a part of a small facebook group to prove it. (I will plop a link below)

Though admittedly there are still a lot of trolls on the net, which means there are a lot of trolls playing games online. Honestly I blame 2 things for this:

1. The I am the best, lone wolf mentality. Team games can be hard if you are not looking out for your team. And if no one is looking out for the team then everyone is a lone wolf. Which means your team screws you over, without even realising it. Which then means people begin to develop the mentality of "I don't respect my team-mates, why should I respect my opponent"

2. The fact that more and more gamers have their roots in the anonymity of the online scene. I am not particularly old but even I remember going to arcades and you waiting my turn. Then shaking the hand of the guy/girl who I was up against (win or lose), say "Good Game" then, in time honoured tradition the winner stays on (F.Y.I I remember doing this at the age of about 5/6). To top that off the first non-arcade multiplayer experience I had was with good old split screen. Playing with friends for fun, not so I can prestige for the nth time.

Link to the group if anyone is interested:
http://www.facebook.com/groups/142299935840615/

I play LoL a lot, both with a pre-made team of friends and in solo-queue. The community is pretty terrible but there are still decent people there. I usaully try to be friendly and set a nice attitude for the game.

I'll pretty much always say Gl Hf(Good luck Have Fun) as each match starts and I usaully say GG and mean it as the game ends. If a teamate does pretty good then I will say Good job or Nice one, just something to congratulate them. I also try to avoid talking down to people that do badly, we all have bad games and if they are being cool and saying sorry for making these mistakes then i'll say "Don't worry about it, we all have bad games".
I've even been known to congratulate the enemy team if they get a good kill. Although I usaully try to ignore dicks I will ask them to be more friendly if they don't seem too bad, LoL can be an enraging game so most people who may not normally be complete dicks will perhaps be assholes without even realizing it.

The best part is that I have found this works. I usaully get decent games where at the very least there will be less flaming than usaul on our team. I have had games where it starts off just like normal with someone messing up and getting annoyed then maybe a teamate will say something that pisses them off but it's all been good and they calmed down then we enjoy the game win or lose, prefrably win but a loss doesn't cause massive amounts of rage like usaul.

Perhaps the worst thing for starting community rage and bile spewing are the people who think a teamate made a mistake then go in /all chat to complain with "This team...." or "This (Champion name)....". All this does is create a negative attitude for yor team and will likely result in insults being thrown.

Tl;DR
Attitude is important. Keep it friendly and people won't be dicks as much, be a dick and people will be dicks back.

Because I find it hard to cooperate with people when generally they're idiots.

The thing with sportsmanship in...SPORTS...is cos you build a sense of reliability and comradeship among players who are usually there for several years, usually. If I played Call of Duty with a specific set of players (usually called...what...a clan?) then most definitely I would have a better time with it working with a team. This goes for games that actually promote a sense of teamwork. Like when I play Horde with 3 of my mates or something.

I sometimes complement opponents if they landed a tricky shot on me or killed me while they were on low health. it,s a game and it doesn't really matter if somebody is red or blue we are playing it to have a fun time.

Mr.K.:
I think you will find there is plenty of sportsmanship in games however there are two accumulating effects that will always lead you to believe otherwise:
- people are generally 10x more dickish when anonymous
- you notice dicks 100x more then anyone else

Last game I played was World of Tanks and that community is 98% of extremely pleasant and helpful people, but the comments that always stick with me are the 2% of childish hate spewing.
Same goes for LAN parties, there are so many friendly people who want nothing more then a good time, but then there is always that one guy that inspires hate in everyone.

But I'll give you that gaming has one of the worst communities, it's competitive, anonymous, and because gaming is still considered childish such behavior is generally accepted and worse yet passed on to the younger players.

yeah world of tanks is where i experience it.. worst i get towards the opposition is being kille dby an arty an saying "i hate you arty, good shot by the way"

BeerTent:
I've noticed a trend...

There's two different type of shooters... Thoughtful shooters, and twitch shooters.

I can confirm this. Jedi Academy and its predecessors had a very impressive online community, with customs that underlined sportsmanship. Even in deathmatches, players wielding lightsabers would meet, deactivate their lightsaber, bow and only then attack each other. They would compliment each other on the quality of their fighting style and actually talk about their fights.
JA was a game that took its time and required a lot of patience and tactical thinking. It was not a quick-trigger experience like Call of Duty, the newer Battlefields and even DotA-clones.

Even within a game, this may vary: players in a Warcraft 3 roleplaying or tower defense map are usually more patient than DotA players and more positive about mistakes (yes, even in TD where it is easy to screw up if you are new).

So, yeah, I think the type of game and whether it encourages patience or punishes it has a lot to do with it. In the end, the game conditions its players to behave a certain way - and that affects the behaviour of the community.

Edit: Another VERY positive recent example I have found is Mount and Blade, especially the Napoleonic mods and expansion. I have seen games where only a single player of a team remained in hiding, and eventually declared that they surrendered. They would come out of hiding, drop their weapon and be then executed by firing squad in what was effectively a ceremonial recognition of their performance in the game.

Possibly a subject that I have no right commenting on as my sum total online experience is year or so of WoW, but I am going to work on the assumption (right or wrong) that that is a gauge for the average online community mindset.
In my experience you have two types of people who played online games: One is the person who enjoyes the genre (FPS, RPG), enjoys the escapism that a well crafted experience offers and wants to share that experience with other like minded people. Some will be there purely for the challenge, some for the experience and some for both, but they will be looking to share that with others; the good and the bad.
The other type is the insecure person who uses gaming achievement to compensate for percieved real world inadequecies. These people don't really enjoy the games they play because they play them for the wrong reasons. If one of these beats you they feel they are a superior person for it but if you beat them they feel you have diminished or insulted them, their reaction will be appropriately similar to someone who feels they have been publically slandered.

TL:DR

Some people are decent, some people are insecure fuck-weasels; that's the way it's always been and the way it always will be.

Not being within arms reach makes bad people do bad things
If you are a dick on the internet your a dick everywhere it's just you hide it when they are in a position to do anything about it
Being a dick can actually help you win while playing online cause people raging don't play as well as they would otherwise

Being a person with a right to live however I use two rules
Don't be a dick
There's no requirement to shake their hands just don't be a dick to them and everybody gets to have fun
If you can't win, don't play
Unless you're one of those people that genuinely doesn't care this saves you from a lot of grief if you just quit whilst your ahead

I think this simply comes down to a lack of maturity. Games that have a larger player base, and games that have a higher percentage of younger players (due to marketing, or simply because a larger player base is more all-encompassing), tend to hold a larger number of immature players. When I was younger I would trash talk my opponents and such, but as I got older I realized that I'm not bringing anything to the game, I'm just detracting from someone else's experience - and since we were all there to have fun, what's the point?
But I think OP is correct, there needs to be more sportsmanship in games, and the example set by the professionals is not always good. If professional regular sports players behaved in such a nonchalant towards their opponents then fans and other professionals would have something to say about it, I don't see why gaming and e-sports should be any different.
It all comes down to my previous point that we all game to have fun, and we have no right to prevent someone else from doing that, as you can have fun gaming without behaving like an ass.

You all have very interesting points here, and I agree that a larger a community gets that more of the dicks do seem to show through. Another idea that was pointed out was that the people that are jerk/have poor sportsmanship are the small minority but are either vocal or the ones that you remember. To be honest in my experience, I can remember the times that I had a fun time with people that were not being jerks. The number or jerks that I have seemed to face just seemed to be the norm. (Coming from me playing Dota, LoL, HoN......)

(Ok I failed at the quote thing because I am sleepy, so I will be doing this!)

"I find that SC2 is pretty good in terms of sportsmanship. Terms like GG and GLHF are standard"

Right and they could be. You can easily type those things out and not really mean them. Some/most people (I hope) but I have seen numerous times where GG was just used to say that the game was over. Plus from what I have seen the times that I do not get GLHF outnumber the times that I do. (From my time playing Starcraft)

"bad sportsmanship offline? was it wrong of me to call that Banshee in ME3 motherfucker? did I hurt her feelings?"

(Yes you should feel bad, that Banshee was trying just as hard as you were!)

"...but the simple truth is that sportsmanlike behavior requires something remotely resembling a sport."

These both also brings me to another point that was made in the original post, of the bad sportsmanship that many teams seem to have in Lan tournaments also. Some (not all!) of the people playing in those games are usually rude and trash talk to the other player/players. I would consider the team work that is done in these kind of games to be "sport"-like.

TL;DR If you were playing chess, and where the person took your king he smacked it off the board and yelled GG, would that make you fell that he is unsportsmanlike? (Unfair analogy I know, but its kind of funny to think about. :D)

Epidemiix:
partying the day before the game

i often play games after a night of partying in fact what a better time to play when your hungover and lying around all day anyway. this is the reason your arguement is flawed gaming is not and will never be a sport therefore SPORTSmanship need not apply.

however it does annoy me when you get abuse online from people but just remember they are hiding being the shield of being anonymous. also what annoys me is people who accuse you of cheating for using a weapon/class that the game lets you use, honestly one man army and grenade launcher on MW2 is not cheating its ''artillery support''. all i can say is dont hate the player hate the game

In Dark Souls it's considered the norm to use the bow animation before a duel. Kinda like a "I'm ready, good luck to you."

On the GG point i'm reminded of the one TotalBiscuit StarCraft 2 game on his stream where the guy was spamming only invisible aircraft (i don't know shit about SC XP) and TB was absolutely raging over how it was stupid that he was losing to such random bullshit.

He GG'd then left. So in SC2 at least GG is code for "fuck it, i'm surrendering" not actually good game.

At least in LoL people say BG, it's funny when one guy says BG because he died a few times while every single other person just GGs. Like "well you can be a douchebag, we're going to be nice!"

LoL isn't that bad really, you just get the one dick who yells "4V1!!!!!" when he gets ganked, sorry, it's a team game. Did you forget? And the guy who blames his team for not saving him when he runs into the whole enemy team on his own.

Oh and let's not forget the guys who have winning stratagems like 3 top 1 mid 1 bot. Save that stuff for ranked/full team stuff guys. Inflicting stratagies we couldn't possibly know on randoms is just dumb.

Yeah my Katarina vs their Morgana at mid... Fuckin' genius man.

And then there's UMVC3 and fighting games in general. Fuck taunt buttons man. One of the main reasons I like Skullgirls so much is that the characters take up a win pose as soon as the game ends and there is no taunt button, thank god.

Yes, taunting at the end when you come back from a guy who taunted at you when you were losing is hilariously salt inducing. He underestimated Vergil XD But overall the amount of people who just hit the taunt button after every single win is just annoying.

Still, looks like the higher level people grow out of that stuff pretty quickly.

Lethos:
In Dark Souls it's considered the norm to use the bow animation before a duel. Kinda like a "I'm reading, good luck to you."

When did you last play Dark Souls? I'm sure most of the people I was invading just 3v1'd my ass then did than infuriating "COME AT ME BRO!" gesture. Yeah people still bow occasionally but it's not quite the norm now... /sadface

I still like to wave... Wave at the New Game Plus guy invading my level 5, start gear character in Undead Parish then quit to Dashboard. Fuck you sir!

You want a good look at a really unsportmanshippy group fo players? Play a few games of League of Legends, seriously! I love the game and play it but the fucking people, might be that I always have ba dluck but I always go with gg after a game, and always small letters, doesn't matter if I win or lose. I play for fun!

i often play games after a night of partying in fact what a better time to play when your hungover and lying around all day anyway. this is the reason your arguement is flawed gaming is not and will never be a sport therefore SPORTSmanship need not apply.

Point 1: I wasn't talking about just normally "partying" than playing a few games, that wasn't what I was talking about. (sorry if it seemed that way I will be clearer next time!) I was using that as an example of unsportsmanlike or rude conduct that was shown by a team in a Lan tournament. To use the example that I am thinking of is in the Dota 2 international last year with the 1,000,000 dollar prize pool. The team that won it said that they saw all the other teams play, knew that they were better, trolled around during all of their games, and then on the night before the final game to win the prize, party because "they already knew that they had won it". To me, that kind of conduct just sickens me.

Point 2: I don't think that sportsmanship should just involve sports even if it has the name in it. This can say it better than I ever could: "Sportsmanship is an aspiration or ethos that a sport or activity will be enjoyed for its own sake, with proper consideration for fairness, ethics, respect, and a sense of fellowship with one's competitors." It doesn't need to be a sport in order for a person to at least show a little respect towards other players.

Point 3: I consider chess a sport somehow) why not video games? They involve teamwork, communication, and a set skill. Video games fall under that!

The Wykydtron:

Lethos:
In Dark Souls it's considered the norm to use the bow animation before a duel. Kinda like a "I'm reading, good luck to you."

When did you last play Dark Souls? I'm sure most of the people I was invading just 3v1'd my ass then did than infuriating "COME AT ME BRO!" gesture. Yeah people still bow occasionally but it's not quite the norm now... /sadface

I still like to wave... Wave at the New Game Plus guy invading my level 5, start gear character in Undead Parish then quit to Dashboard. Fuck you sir!

Oh yeah red invaders never do it. Go to the forest though, it's a safe haven for polite dueling.

Guffe:
You want a good look at a really unsportmanshippy group fo players? Play a few games of League of Legends, seriously! I love the game and play it but the fucking people, might be that I always have ba dluck but I always go with gg after a game, and always small letters, doesn't matter if I win or lose. I play for fun!

League of Leagues always being one of the examples that I can say that I have seen the jerks outnumber the people that are not. Moba games in general have more jerks than anything... (yay! more generalizations!)

Well see the problem with gamers online is we do have people that genuinely want to have fun and do learn some neat tricks that do not entirely abuse the system like jumps in CoD. Then we get people who abuse the system eg quickscoping on CoD on a console or getting outside map on a zombie server on CoD 2. Now I know so far the examples have been CoD centric but you'll have to excuse that.

Then you have people willing to abuse bullshit weapons and or skills because they weren't balance properly. I'm sorry just because it was in the game at that time because the devs did not foresee this skill combo does not make it any less of a cunty set up. Two examples of this are the Toucher build R/N which has since been nerfed and a SoJ Sin build from Guild Wars as well as the Searing Flames Elite before balance. If someone wants I could explain why these builds were OP but it might not have the same effect in text.

Then you get plain dicks who camp someone else's spawn in a FPS game and those people are the bane of fun online play and if you do it on CoD 2 or 4 I will spec nade. Not a single fuck will be given that day about your whines.

Even with all that at about mid tiered to high tiered play a lot of people seem to cop the fuck on and stop all this shit. It would help if they all did but you can only do so much.

Lethos:

The Wykydtron:

Lethos:
In Dark Souls it's considered the norm to use the bow animation before a duel. Kinda like a "I'm reading, good luck to you."

When did you last play Dark Souls? I'm sure most of the people I was invading just 3v1'd my ass then did than infuriating "COME AT ME BRO!" gesture. Yeah people still bow occasionally but it's not quite the norm now... /sadface

I still like to wave... Wave at the New Game Plus guy invading my level 5, start gear character in Undead Parish then quit to Dashboard. Fuck you sir!

Oh yeah red invaders never do it. Go to the forest though, it's a safe haven for polite dueling.

Dark Souls PvP had a decent standard of etiquette for those that chose to abide by it, and I had a pretty positive experience with sportsmanlike conduct in that game. I think it did a lot in the way of a more fun and fair experience too. Honorable duels definitely had the effect of making me a more gracious loser. COD and Halo on the other hand...wayyyyy less favorable jerk:decent-human-being ratio. I tend to play XBL, but only have my mic in when I'm playing in a party with friends exactly for that reason. Still really confused about how all those screeching kids found out my ethnicity(ies) and why they think my mother is coquettish.

kTrmnatr:

Lethos:

The Wykydtron:

When did you last play Dark Souls? I'm sure most of the people I was invading just 3v1'd my ass then did than infuriating "COME AT ME BRO!" gesture. Yeah people still bow occasionally but it's not quite the norm now... /sadface

I still like to wave... Wave at the New Game Plus guy invading my level 5, start gear character in Undead Parish then quit to Dashboard. Fuck you sir!

Oh yeah red invaders never do it. Go to the forest though, it's a safe haven for polite dueling.

Dark Souls PvP had a decent standard of etiquette for those that chose to abide by it, and I had a pretty positive experience with sportsmanlike conduct in that game. I think it did a lot in the way of a more fun and fair experience too. Honorable duels definitely had the effect of making me a more gracious loser. COD and Halo on the other hand...wayyyyy less favorable jerk:decent-human-being ratio. I tend to play XBL, but only have my mic in when I'm playing in a party with friends exactly for that reason. Still really confused about how all those screeching kids found out my ethnicity(ies) and why they think my mother is coquettish.

Perhaps this is considered unsportsmanlike like but when I'm just trying to get through my game and some person invades me so that they can benefit from inconveniencing me I just DC them. All I want to do is finish the game and move on, I hardly call the duels fair when my best chance of winning is them somehow falling off something. How am I supposed to compete with fully upgraded weapons before Ive even got past level 20. Being unable to escape any other way but quitting to the dashboard is kind of a dick move in a game that's hard enough already. Under those circumstances I think being polite whilst a nice touch is completely unnecessary considering that I won't think any better of them after they are cheering on my corpse and I have to backtrack to where I was to get my souls back and lost my humanity.

This is normally the point I get called a casual despite being a bigger gamer than they are.
It's like the difference of sitting down to a game and just having fun and metaphorically fighting the game to death for the fun and in this case just trying to figure out what the hell is supposed to be happening.

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