Which will you purchase/which do you prefer?
Diablo 3
46.7% (396)
46.7% (396)
Torchlight 2
52.9% (449)
52.9% (449)
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Poll: So... Diablo 3 or Torchlight 2?

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Abandon4093:

The Cool Kid:

An image is either progressive or interlaced; there is no 1080pi.

Actually D3's max output is at 2560x1440. I assumed it was 1920 x 1080. (disregarding eyefinity).

Diablo II was at 640x480 maybe... I dunno I can't remember.

And all that would do is increase detail if the texture resolutions were increased with it.

Kinda the point I was making.

You try to give the impression you understand graphics when it seems the opposite is true.

Well I actually work in Max and Mudbox, so there is that.

Smoothness is fuck all to do with sprites -

Actually it is, the reason Diablo I and II's environments were so squared off is because it randomly generated areas, so it needed set pieces that would slot together easily and give the impression they were designed to do so. Very square shapes lend to that remarkably well in sprite form.

it's to do with how the models have been created.

No shit sherlock.

They have purposely gone down the route of smooth models which I personally don't think fits the Diablo universe, nor does it fit the previous iterations of the game.

See above.

You seem to be getting confused with art direction and the game engine. The art style is fine, but the results when said style is passed through the engine is not similar to D1 or 2.

No that's what everyone else seems to be getting confused with. If you look at the concept art and the overall tone of the game, it fits with the style set by the original two.

"It's a menu screen man". Oh please, don't just try to dismiss a point because it stumps you.

Like fuck it stumps me, menu's change all the time within franchises. That doesn't mean the art style of the game changed, to say it does shows a great lack of knowledge on game design.

As I said, you will spend a lot of time in the inventory, so it is a valid complaint.

So you point is what? You don't like it so the games entire art style has changed? Makes perfect sense skipper.

And Skyrim's inventory is fucking shit. Seriously there is so much horribly wrong with it whoever designed it should be fired. The use of space is appalling and the accessibility is terrible.

---------> *point*

-------[] *your head*

We're not debating whether or not D3 or skyrims menu systems are good, just that because they're nothing like their predecessors menu's doesn't mean their entire games artstyle changed.

Dunno how I could explain that in any simpler terms.

However you are ignoring the point of D3's inventory clearly showing a completely different artistic direction. So, either deal directly with it, or go away.

I did, as I showed you, so does Skyrim. So by your logic Skyrim's art style is completely different from Oblivions despite the consistency in character design and asset creation because the menu systems are nothing alike.

Good logic that. :/

If you can't deal with not being right, then don't bother debating with anyone.

image

Oh just stop talking about graphics as you don't even understand resolution. Whether an image is progressive or interlaced is nothing to do with the resolution. You may "work" in Max and mudbox but I have a feeling "work" equates to "dicking around".

You contradict yourself. You go on about the sprites being to do with the map layout being "squared off", and then confirm that the smoothness is to do with the models. Therefore, if Blizzard wanted to, an alteration to the models would mean that they would not have to be smooth...

Concept art is nothing more then that, a concept. Unless it can be correctly translated into reality, there will be a divide between the concept art and the finished product.
Compare the two screenshots of the inventory I gave you and tell me how the art style is not different. You are simply saying "Hey dude it happens all the time so it doesn't count". That's not how debating works; you can't just dismiss something because it is a common occurrence.

The menu style has changed to become more colourful as well as in game models being made smoother. These are all deliberate changes showing the art direction is different to the last two games. The inventory is a heavily stylised area in D3, so to write it off as "just a menu" is just as piss weak as your idea that "they change all the time so it doesn't matter".

The Cool Kid:

Oh just stop talking about graphics as you don't even understand resolution. Whether an image is progressive or interlaced is nothing to do with the resolution. You may "work" in Max and mudbox but I have a feeling "work" equates to "dicking around".

I was talking about the resolution genius.

You contradict yourself. You go on about the sprites being to do with the map layout being "squared off", and then confirm that the smoothness is to do with the models. Therefore, if Blizzard wanted to, an alteration to the models would mean that they would not have to be smooth...

How do I make this simpler for you?

I don't think I can.

The sprites were squared off because they needed to be, the models don't need to be. You can randomise models without them being square. Think that's about as simple as I could make it.

Concept art is nothing more then that, a concept. Unless it can be correctly translated into reality, there will be a divide between the concept art and the finished product.
Compare the two screenshots and tell me how they are not different. You are simply saying "Hey dude it happens all the time so it doesn't count". That's not how debating works; you can't just dismiss something because it is a common occurrence.

The thing is, it has. Much better than D2 because of the amount of detail they've managed to put in things like characters and assets now.

... what screenshots?

The menu style has changed to become more colourful as well as in game models being made smoother. These are all deliberate changes showing the art direction is different to the last two games. The inventory is a heavily stylised area in D3, so to write it off as "just a menu" is just as piss weak as your idea that "they change all the time so it doesn't matter".

A menu screen =/= entire game. They do have to update things.

And if characters and assets didn't look smoother than D2 I'd want my fucking money back. Low resolution sprites aren't an artstyle.... well I'm sure in some games they are, but that wasn't the art style of D2. They just used low res sprites because they had to.

If you want to play a game with low res sprites, go play D2 again.

Abandon4093:

The Cool Kid:

Oh just stop talking about graphics as you don't even understand resolution. Whether an image is progressive or interlaced is nothing to do with the resolution. You may "work" in Max and mudbox but I have a feeling "work" equates to "dicking around".

I was talking about the resolution genius.

You contradict yourself. You go on about the sprites being to do with the map layout being "squared off", and then confirm that the smoothness is to do with the models. Therefore, if Blizzard wanted to, an alteration to the models would mean that they would not have to be smooth...

How do I make this simpler for you?

I don't think I can.

The sprites were squared off because they needed to be, the models don't need to be. You can randomise models without them being square. Think that's about as simple as I could make it.

Concept art is nothing more then that, a concept. Unless it can be correctly translated into reality, there will be a divide between the concept art and the finished product.
Compare the two screenshots and tell me how they are not different. You are simply saying "Hey dude it happens all the time so it doesn't count". That's not how debating works; you can't just dismiss something because it is a common occurrence.

The thing is, it has. Much better than D2 because of the amount of detail they've managed to put in things like characters and assets now.

... what screenshots?

The menu style has changed to become more colourful as well as in game models being made smoother. These are all deliberate changes showing the art direction is different to the last two games. The inventory is a heavily stylised area in D3, so to write it off as "just a menu" is just as piss weak as your idea that "they change all the time so it doesn't matter".

A menu screen =/= entire game. They do have to update things.

And if characters and assets didn't look smoother than D2 I'd want my fucking money back. Low resolution sprites aren't an artstyle.... well I'm sure in some games they are, but that wasn't the art style of D2. They just used low res sprites because they had to.

If you want to play a game with low res sprites, go play D2 again.

Don't be sarcastic when you're making a fool of yourself:
Progressive Interlaced does not exist, ergo 1080pi or 640pi do not exist

Blizzard have full control over the models, therefore there is no need to make them as smooth as they have done. It's that simple.

The inventory screenshots I used earlier in the thread.

I never claimed the inventory equals the game, but good attempt at a strawman.
I would prefer to play a game where the graphics are sharper. No one is going to say Metro 2033 is a smooth looking game, yet it has leading graphics.

You now sound like you are arguing for the sake of arguing. Looking at your health bar, be very careful how you tread.

The Cool Kid:

Don't be sarcastic when you're making a fool of yourself:
Progressive Interlaced does not exist, ergo 1080pi or 640pi do not exist

What are you talking about?

I said 1080 and I think 550 (couldn't remember the lower res) instead of saying 1920x1080 etc because I was being lazy. I couldn't be bothered to state their full resolutions. I really didn't think it would start a whole new branch of an argument were you were pissing on about interlaced and progressive images. I was talking about the resolution of the game and how that effects how it looks.

Blizzard have full control over the models, therefore there is no need to make them as smooth as they have done. It's that simple.

But why would they make them look blocky when it isn't a requirement anymore? They needed to when they were using sprites, they don't need to now.

The inventory screenshots I used earlier in the thread.

Well I have looked at them, did you look at the screens between oblivion and Skyrim I put up? Because the difference between those two inventory screens is much, much greater. Yet I bet you wouldn't make the argument that Skyrim deviated from Oblivions art style, just because of a menu skin.

That's the point I'm making.

I never claimed the inventory equals the game, but good attempt at a strawman.

Not really a strawman when you've been banging on about how a change in inventory is somehow reflective of a complete change in art style.

I would prefer to play a game where the graphics are sharper. No one is going to say Metro 2033 is a smooth looking game, yet it has leading graphics.

I think I get where you're coming from a little better now, you're more talking about the texture quality than the graphics. I thought you were talking about the actual models. As in that now pillars look like smooth stone cylinders instead of chunky brick columns.

You now sound like you are arguing for the sake of arguing. Looking at your health bar, be very careful how you tread.

I've actually held that healthbar where it is for the last year or so. But thanks for your attempt to influence the argument by bringing up a completely irrelevant point concern.

You know Diablo 2 vs Torchlight 2 aside I find these poll results pretty impressive for Torchlight 2, if you'd of asked me what the % would of been to D3 vs TL2 I'd not not had nearly such a close spread on the percentages. it gives me hope for the gaming community it really does.

synobal:
You know Diablo 2 vs Torchlight 2 aside I find these poll results pretty impressive for Torchlight 2, if you'd of asked me what the % would of been to D3 vs TL2 I'd not not had nearly such a close spread on the percentages. it gives me hope for the gaming community it really does.

I actually kind of expected them to be a bit more in favor of TL2.
The first one was a very nice, very well executed game, that was priced very competetivly and came out comparatively recently.
On the other hand, quite a few people were a bit disappointed with how the Diablo 3 beta turned out and Diablo 2 is too old to evoke strong feelings in most people anymore.

Abandon4093:

The Cool Kid:

Don't be sarcastic when you're making a fool of yourself:
Progressive Interlaced does not exist, ergo 1080pi or 640pi do not exist

What are you talking about?

I said 1080 and I think 550 (couldn't remember the lower res) instead of saying 1920x1080 etc because I was being lazy. I couldn't be bothered to state their full resolutions. I really didn't think it would start a whole new branch of an argument were you were pissing on about interlaced and progressive images. I was talking about the resolution of the game and how that effects how it looks.

Blizzard have full control over the models, therefore there is no need to make them as smooth as they have done. It's that simple.

But why would they make them look blocky when it isn't a requirement anymore? They needed to when they were using sprites, they don't need to now.

The inventory screenshots I used earlier in the thread.

Well I have looked at them, did you look at the screens between oblivion and Skyrim I put up? Because the difference between those two inventory screens is much, much greater. Yet I bet you wouldn't make the argument that Skyrim deviated from Oblivions art style, just because of a menu skin.

That's the point I'm making.

I never claimed the inventory equals the game, but good attempt at a strawman.

Not really a strawman when you've been banging on about how a change in inventory is somehow reflective of a complete change in art style.

I would prefer to play a game where the graphics are sharper. No one is going to say Metro 2033 is a smooth looking game, yet it has leading graphics.

I think I get where you're coming from a little better now, you're more talking about the texture quality than the graphics. I thought you were talking about the actual models. As in that now pillars look like smooth stone cylinders instead of chunky brick columns.

You now sound like you are arguing for the sake of arguing. Looking at your health bar, be very careful how you tread.

I've actually held that healthbar where it is for the last year or so. But thanks for your attempt to influence the argument by bringing up a completely irrelevant point concern.

Please keep up with what you have said or don't bother replying:

Abandon4093:

Never said it was pot luck. But the art style still hasn't changed. The fact that it now renders in 1080pi instead of 350pi changes the way it looks too... is that a change in art style?

See. You said pi. An image is either progressive (p as in 1080p) or interlaced (i as in 1080i). There is no 1080pi.

It's not about looking blocky in a 64 bit way, but doing away with so many soft corners on things. It gives it a child-friendly feel. Again, Metro has fantastic graphics and doesn't look "smooth".

You can't just say "ANOTHER GAEM DID IT SO ITZ LIK DUN MATTER NO MOAR!". That's not how logic works. Skyrim did it, and Skyrim ended up with a shitty misplaced HUD that was hard to use and looked like someone shit Space 1999 into Lord of the Rings. So yes, the HUD did deviate from the Oblivion art style.

"change in inventory is somehow reflective of a complete change in art style."
Quote me where I claimed that, or you just made another strawman.

No, it's not just the textures but also the models. It's more the bricks and wood or looks like it's been smoothed; there are literally no graphical rough edges.

The only influencing of the argument I was trying to do was to stop you from being sarcastic. Mission accomplished?

Aprilgold:
Well lets look at it like this.

Diablo 3: Will encourage theft of items which in turn will be used to be a real-money item shop which will be overpriced. Shitty DRM and overall being just plain old Diablo.

There's no theft in Diablo 3. You can't steal your dead teammates dropped items and the loot is individual.

Anthraxus:
Not that it's my preferred genre or anything, but where's the option for Path of Exile ?

http://www.pathofexile.com/

Dude. Now I have something else to look forward to. This game looks great.

The Cool Kid:

Please keep up with what you have said or don't bother replying:

Abandon4093:

Never said it was pot luck. But the art style still hasn't changed. The fact that it now renders in 1080pi instead of 350pi changes the way it looks too... is that a change in art style?

See. You said pi. An image is either progressive (p as in 1080p) or interlaced (i as in 1080i). There is no 1080pi.

I hadn't even realised I had said 'pi'. It was probably just some retarded typo or I was thinking about 'ppi' (which would still be wrong.)

Point being it wasn't intentional. I was talking about the resolution of the game.

It's not about looking blocky in a 64 bit way, but doing away with so many soft corners on things. It gives it a child-friendly feel. Again, Metro has fantastic graphics and doesn't look "smooth".

Again, why would they keep it looking square when they don't have to anymore? Metro deals with structures built with bricks and modern[ish] architecture. Diablo is influenced by architecture that was built with very smooth stone. It's always been influenced by that kind of architecture. It only used to be squared off because it was easier to slot the sprites together that way.

You can't just say "ANOTHER GAEM DID IT SO ITZ LIK DUN MATTER NO MOAR!". That's not how logic works. Skyrim did it, and Skyrim ended up with a shitty misplaced HUD that was hard to use and looked like someone shit Space 1999 into Lord of the Rings. So yes, the HUD did deviate from the Oblivion art style.

Again.... again againagaingairgnaingisnfgisnifnsign.

We're not discussing the merits of the inventories. I'm asking you whether or not you think Skyrims entire artstyle has been changed because they went with a drastically different inventory skin?

"change in inventory is somehow reflective of a complete change in art style."
Quote me where I claimed that, or you just made another strawman.

Seeing as that point has been a major part of your entire argument... no it's not a strawman.

So far you've said the artstlye is different because of the menu and because it's smoother. So the menu makes up like 50% of your argument?

No, it's not just the textures but also the models. It's more the bricks and wood or looks like it's been smoothed; there are literally no graphical rough edges.

See above.

The only influencing of the argument I was trying to do was to stop you from being sarcastic. Mission accomplished?

Being sarcastic isn't actually against the rules. And you've been downright rude the entire argument, so please don't try and stand on some sort of moral high ground there.

I don't support full-nelson DRM.
Wouldn't matter anyway, I can't play D3 because my Internet hates Bnet 2.0.

Torchlight 2 has LAN, and that I can play.

Abandon4093:

The Cool Kid:

Please keep up with what you have said or don't bother replying:

Abandon4093:

Never said it was pot luck. But the art style still hasn't changed. The fact that it now renders in 1080pi instead of 350pi changes the way it looks too... is that a change in art style?

See. You said pi. An image is either progressive (p as in 1080p) or interlaced (i as in 1080i). There is no 1080pi.

I hadn't even realised I had said 'pi'. It was probably just some retarded typo or I was thinking about 'ppi' (which would still be wrong.)

Point being it wasn't intentional. I was talking about the resolution of the game.

It's not about looking blocky in a 64 bit way, but doing away with so many soft corners on things. It gives it a child-friendly feel. Again, Metro has fantastic graphics and doesn't look "smooth".

Again, why would they keep it looking square when they don't have to anymore? Metro deals with structures built with bricks and modern[ish] architecture. Diablo is influenced by architecture that was built with very smooth stone. It's always been influenced by that kind of architecture. It only used to be squared off because it was easier to slot the sprites together that way.

You can't just say "ANOTHER GAEM DID IT SO ITZ LIK DUN MATTER NO MOAR!". That's not how logic works. Skyrim did it, and Skyrim ended up with a shitty misplaced HUD that was hard to use and looked like someone shit Space 1999 into Lord of the Rings. So yes, the HUD did deviate from the Oblivion art style.

Again.... again againagaingairgnaingisnfgisnifnsign.

We're not discussing the merits of the inventories. I'm asking you whether or not you think Skyrims entire artstyle has been changed because they went with a drastically different inventory skin?

"change in inventory is somehow reflective of a complete change in art style."
Quote me where I claimed that, or you just made another strawman.

Seeing as that point has been a major part of your entire argument... no it's not a strawman.

So far you've said the artstlye is different because of the menu and because it's smoother. So the menu makes up like 50% of your argument?

No, it's not just the textures but also the models. It's more the bricks and wood or looks like it's been smoothed; there are literally no graphical rough edges.

See above.

The only influencing of the argument I was trying to do was to stop you from being sarcastic. Mission accomplished?

Being sarcastic isn't actually against the rules. And you've been downright rude the entire argument, so please don't try and stand on some sort of moral high ground there.

Find me a wooden hut that looks smooth. They don't which is where D3 goes wrong:


The tavern looks far too cartoonish with nice neat stone work and almost caricature slate tiles.

Here's another example:


As you can see in D2 the vegetation was overgrowing, everything looked run down. However in D3 it looks like there is a groundskeeper or two running around keeping everything in check.

Find me where I claimed the entire asthetics of D3 were changed because of the inventory. Quote me. You can't say "that's your argument" if you can't even prove I have said that.

I haven't been rude once. So yes, I will take the moral high ground until you can show me otherwise.

The Cool Kid:

Find me a wooden hut that looks smooth. They don't which is where D3 goes wrong:


The tavern looks far too cartoonish with nice neat stone work and almost caricature slate tiles.

Ah, I was thinking you were on about the ruins that we've seen, like in dungeons etc. Large stone pillars and ruined temples.

Here's another example:


As you can see in D2 the vegetation was overgrowing, everything looked run down. However in D3 it looks like there is a groundskeeper or two running around keeping everything in check.

Yea, I miss the overgrown vines and stuff too, hopefully if there is a jungle like area we'll get to seem some wild vegetation. But other than that, I'd say that building and the area around it is very in keeping with the style of the other picture.

Find me where I claimed the entire asthetics of D3 were changed because of the inventory. Quote me. You can't say "that's your argument" if you can't even prove I have said that.

The Cool Kid:
However you are ignoring the point of D3's inventory clearly showing a completely different artistic direction.

(On a personal note, I think D3's inventory is infinitely better.)

You said that was your biggest gripe with the game. And other than the inventory, the only other point you've made is the game is too smooth, the gear is cartooney and levels are bright.

D2's equipment was also cartooney (just look at the necro) and the game was rather bright when you got out of the first few areas.

So that leaves smooth and the inventory being different. That's hardly an entire style change.

I haven't been rude once. So yes, I will take the moral high ground until you can show me otherwise.

The Cool Kid:

You try to give the impression you understand graphics when it seems the opposite is true.

The Cool Kid:

If you can't deal with not being right, then don't bother debating with anyone.

The Cool Kid:

You may "work" in Max and mudbox but I have a feeling "work" equates to "dicking around".

That was just a quick scan, I'm not going all the way back through this ridiculous argument to find examples of you being rude, you know damnwell you have been. So quit calling me for being sarcastic in retaliation.

Elmoth:

Capitano Segnaposto:

Elmoth:

As I suspected one should never make a list of points against something on a forum since people like you will just ignore it and counter only the weakest point, being the only point they can contest properly, apparantly.

I am so confused by this. Diablo II, many people played online with friends. Some only played that way. When they were not playing "Online" they were still connected to the internet while playing singleplayer.

Now the game requires you to do what you have already done before. Play the game online. Except the only difference now is that it forces you to play online.

Is there some sort of weird tradition people use by unhooking their internet when they play singleplayer? If so then... weird. However if you don't then what is the issue? I can understand if it is like Ubisofts shitty DRM, however being forced to play online, in a day and age where damn near everything is hooked to the internet, shouldn't be a terrible thing.

Could you please clear this up with me?

How is playing singleplayer being connected to the internet? There's been a huge number of times when I was traveling or out of internet and played D2 singleplayer.

That was not what I was talking about. I meant that, even though you were playing singleplayer, most of the time your computer was still hooked to the internet. How often are you normally out of internet? Unless you live in a third world country or have some shitty ISP, I don't see why it is such a big issue if the "DRM" requires you to be online.

nu1mlock:

Aprilgold:
Well lets look at it like this.

Diablo 3: Will encourage theft of items which in turn will be used to be a real-money item shop which will be overpriced. Shitty DRM and overall being just plain old Diablo.

There's no theft in Diablo 3. You can't steal your dead teammates dropped items and the loot is individual.

Well then your going to tell me that the WoW last-hit loot drops still aren't in the game right? I doubt it, if someone is good enough they can easily get the last hit and therefore getting the items the other team mate should have.

Aprilgold:
Well then your going to tell me that the WoW last-hit loot drops still aren't in the game right? I doubt it, if someone is good enough they can easily get the last hit and therefore getting the items the other team mate should have.

Diablo doesn't reward competitive cooperation and loot is rewarded individually to all players and has nothing to do with last-hits. Thankfully.

The more stuff I hear about Grim Dawn and Path of Exile, the less excited I am about Torchlight 2 and Diablo 3.

At the end of the day both. I'm a big fan of the Diablo series, have been since I got my copy of Diablo I for my birthday a long time ago. I've had a lot of fun with Diablo II also, I'm currently playing through it again with each class when other projects aren't keeping me too busy to do so. I have no reason whine about the always on requirement for Diablo III and I trust Blizzard enough to make a great game based on past experience with their other products. I've played everything they've made from WarCraft I up to WarCraft III. WoW wasn't for me and I can't run StarCraft 2 right now or I probably would have played that at some point.

I've also had tons of fun with Torchlight, it has it's own unique flavor that kind of tastes like Diablo but not quite, it's something that I can play for 15-20 minutes or 2-3 hours depending on how much time I have without having to worry about where I am or what I have to do before I can quit without creating more work for myself later. In it's own special way I find Torchlight's way of handing out loot to be slightly more addictive than Diablo's because of the sheer amount of stuff that drops nearly all the time, but I also find Diablo's story to be compelling enough to keep me wanting to know what happens next.

These games come out at least a couple of months apart, I'll either get Torchlight 2 for my birthday this year or wait until it's on sale. I've yet to finish Torchlight 1 and I've got tons of other games to play in the meantime. I'm currently saving loose change and small bills to purchase Diablo III at my earliest convenience even though I know I can't run it now I will be able to hopefully in the near future and I'll have secured my copy already instead of having to scour Amazon and eBay for copies that may or may not work.

nu1mlock:

Aprilgold:
Well lets look at it like this.

Diablo 3: Will encourage theft of items which in turn will be used to be a real-money item shop which will be overpriced. Shitty DRM and overall being just plain old Diablo.

There's no theft in Diablo 3. You can't steal your dead teammates dropped items and the loot is individual.

I think he means that people would hack and steal accounts in WoW, sell off the gear.

A RMAH only encourages this practice.

You know what gets me? The people who are pissed at Blizzard's DRM, but who will still willingly give them their $60.

The complete fucking spinelessness of these people... its just classic.

The Cool Kid:

Here's another example:


As you can see in D2 the vegetation was overgrowing, everything looked run down. However in D3 it looks like there is a groundskeeper or two running around keeping everything in check.

To be fair the Graveyard in D2 has been abandoned for weeks/months or so as the monsters have had time to set up, whereas the Graveyard in D3 has been abandoned fairly recently because the monsters in Act I have only just arrived.

Also a Tavern building with a slate roof is hardly what I'd call a "Wooden Hut"

Capitano Segnaposto:

Elmoth:

Elamdri:

Requiring you to be connected to the internet is draconian?

I've been playing games on computer for about 15 years. I have NEVER encountered a problem with a game and DRM.

As I suspected one should never make a list of points against something on a forum since people like you will just ignore it and counter only the weakest point, being the only point they can contest properly, apparantly.

I am so confused by this. Diablo II, many people played online with friends. Some only played that way. When they were not playing "Online" they were still connected to the internet while playing singleplayer.

Now the game requires you to do what you have already done before. Play the game online. Except the only difference now is that it forces you to play online.

Is there some sort of weird tradition people use by unhooking their internet when they play singleplayer? If so then... weird. However if you don't then what is the issue? I can understand if it is like Ubisofts shitty DRM, however being forced to play online, in a day and age where damn near everything is hooked to the internet, shouldn't be a terrible thing.

Could you please clear this up with me?

My ISP blows nuts. Same goes for all of my friends, because Comcast has a monopoly over everything west of the Rocky Mountains. I AVERAGE a two-bar connection. If I'm lucky, I only have to restart my router every two hours or so. My internet freaks out if I try to do anything more strenuous than watch Yahtzee. I had to stop playing LoL because the lag spikes nearly got me banned.

MOST IMPORTANTLY: They took out a feature that millions of players used for no better reason than a sad attempt at preventing piracy, which only hurts the customer and will stop the pirates for all of a day.

matrix3509:
You know what gets me? The people who are pissed at Blizzard's DRM, but who will still willingly give them their $60.

The complete fucking spinelessness of these people... its just classic.

Standard example of "It won't affect me right now..."

Then these same people will clutter up the gaming discussion in three months whining and crying when all DRM checks your registration code every 15 minutes.

Torchlight 2 for 20 bucks. No online req, no pay to win auction house.
Buy yourself a copy, then buy your friend a copy, then buy a pizza and have a lan party

Or pay $60 for D3

NameIsRobertPaulson:
I think he means that people would hack and steal accounts in WoW, sell off the gear.

A RMAH only encourages this practice.

One could think that's what he meant, but then he went on saying that people who are good at last-hitting will "steal" their teammates loot (like in WoW and most other MMO's), which just isn't the case in Diablo 3 as you don't have to last-hit enemies to get loot. Also, you can't steal teammates dropped loot/items when they die.

Someone hacking your account, however, is a whole other thing. If one would have an insecure password it's their own fault. There are also authenticators you can buy or download free to your smartphone (at least iPhone and Android).

And to use the RMAH you have to setup a cellphone to receive codes to enter when using the RMAH. You also get an SMS for suspicious login attempts, etc. etc.

But sure, there's always a possibility, but then again, there's a possibility that someone will break into your home and steal your stuff too. Probably even a higher chance.

But again, he was talking about last-hitting to get the loot, which just isn't the case in Diablo 3.

I own both so, I don't have to choose thankfully.

Abandon4093:

Actually D3's max output is at 2560x1440. I assumed it was 1920 x 1080. (disregarding eyefinity).

2560x1600
http://www.tomshardware.com/reviews/diablo-iii-performance-benchmark,3195-5.html

Abandon4093:

Diablo II was at 640x480 maybe... I dunno I can't remember.

And 800x600 in LoD.

lol Torchlight 2... because you know. Error 37. HAHAHAHAHA

Give that it was only 15 quid on steam and I got a free game out of it I'm gonna say Torchlight 2.

Dendio:
Torchlight 2 for 20 bucks. No online req, no pay to win auction house.
Buy yourself a copy, then buy your friend a copy, then buy a pizza and have a lan party

Or pay $60 for D3

NameIsRobertPaulson:

Capitano Segnaposto:

Elmoth:

As I suspected one should never make a list of points against something on a forum since people like you will just ignore it and counter only the weakest point, being the only point they can contest properly, apparantly.

I am so confused by this. Diablo II, many people played online with friends. Some only played that way. When they were not playing "Online" they were still connected to the internet while playing singleplayer.

Now the game requires you to do what you have already done before. Play the game online. Except the only difference now is that it forces you to play online.

Is there some sort of weird tradition people use by unhooking their internet when they play singleplayer? If so then... weird. However if you don't then what is the issue? I can understand if it is like Ubisofts shitty DRM, however being forced to play online, in a day and age where damn near everything is hooked to the internet, shouldn't be a terrible thing.

Could you please clear this up with me?

My ISP blows nuts. Same goes for all of my friends, because Comcast has a monopoly over everything west of the Rocky Mountains. I AVERAGE a two-bar connection. If I'm lucky, I only have to restart my router every two hours or so. My internet freaks out if I try to do anything more strenuous than watch Yahtzee. I had to stop playing LoL because the lag spikes nearly got me banned.

MOST IMPORTANTLY: They took out a feature that millions of players used for no better reason than a sad attempt at preventing piracy, which only hurts the customer and will stop the pirates for all of a day.

Ah, yes. I have had many a raid night cancelled do to the supposed horrors of Comcast. Are they the only ISP over on your side of the mountains? I am glad I don't have to deal with them. I have heard horror stories during those... calling people things. I can't even think of the word.

Also what was the feature? LAN? I thought LAN had died out years ago... Now I just have a bunch of my friends log onto the guest WIFI account. Same thing, just an extra two seconds of work.

Dendio:
Torchlight 2 for 20 bucks. No online req, no pay to win auction house.
Buy yourself a copy, then buy your friend a copy, then buy a pizza and have a lan party

Or pay $60 for D3

Or buy both. I am sure in a few weeks time (much like with Valve Games) D3 will go on-sale for a short time at 50 to 40 bucks. Torchlight 2 won't be out for quite some time as well. By the way, are they releasing the sequel on Xbox again?

F4LL3N:
This type of thread is pointless. We all know Diablo 3, despite how awesome the actual game looks is regarded as an abomination from Hell on this site.

If I had a gaming PC, I wouldn't hesitate to buy Diablo 3. I know it'd be a solid, nearly bug-free game that offers hundreds upon hundreds of hours of monster slaying and loot finding. What's not to love? Sure, the DRM is stupid, but I'd compromise knowing that at the very least I'll get my money's worth.

I have a bigger problem with paying for a game to find out it's a total waste of money than I do buying a game with some hassle draconian obsticles that don't really need to be there.

Have you checked the system requirements for diablo 3?
They are not that high.
http://us.battle.net/support/en/article/diablo-iii-system-requirements

Diablo 3. I will not be buying Torchlight 2 because I was bored to tears with the original Torchlight. It had all of the Diablo-esque hallmarks, but it just felt empty. So, I quit playing it and just waited for D3. :)

Abandon4093:

The Cool Kid:

Find me a wooden hut that looks smooth. They don't which is where D3 goes wrong:


The tavern looks far too cartoonish with nice neat stone work and almost caricature slate tiles.

Ah, I was thinking you were on about the ruins that we've seen, like in dungeons etc. Large stone pillars and ruined temples.

Here's another example:


As you can see in D2 the vegetation was overgrowing, everything looked run down. However in D3 it looks like there is a groundskeeper or two running around keeping everything in check.

Yea, I miss the overgrown vines and stuff too, hopefully if there is a jungle like area we'll get to seem some wild vegetation. But other than that, I'd say that building and the area around it is very in keeping with the style of the other picture.

Find me where I claimed the entire asthetics of D3 were changed because of the inventory. Quote me. You can't say "that's your argument" if you can't even prove I have said that.

The Cool Kid:
However you are ignoring the point of D3's inventory clearly showing a completely different artistic direction.

(On a personal note, I think D3's inventory is infinitely better.)

You said that was your biggest gripe with the game. And other than the inventory, the only other point you've made is the game is too smooth, the gear is cartooney and levels are bright.

D2's equipment was also cartooney (just look at the necro) and the game was rather bright when you got out of the first few areas.

So that leaves smooth and the inventory being different. That's hardly an entire style change.

I haven't been rude once. So yes, I will take the moral high ground until you can show me otherwise.

The Cool Kid:

You try to give the impression you understand graphics when it seems the opposite is true.

The Cool Kid:

If you can't deal with not being right, then don't bother debating with anyone.

The Cool Kid:

You may "work" in Max and mudbox but I have a feeling "work" equates to "dicking around".

That was just a quick scan, I'm not going all the way back through this ridiculous argument to find examples of you being rude, you know damnwell you have been. So quit calling me for being sarcastic in retaliation.

The inventory is changed and everything is smoother & cleaner. I feel this was more of a technical decision rather than an artistic one, but still, it does make the game not seem as dark as the other 2.

That's not me being rude, that's me being honest. Are you a professional 3D designer? No, you're not, ergo you are dicking around in mudbox etc. You also made some gross errors on how 3d models are made etc leading me to think you don't know that much about 3d graphics. As for the debate statement, I didn't say just say "You can't..." I said "IF you can't..."

I know in the UK it's the done thing to cry foul at everything comment that is critical, but criticisms and insults are not the same beast.

It looks like you already made up your mind. Personally I'm looking forward to TL2 because I enjoyed the original. Plus because of my current economic state I can't justify the $60 price tag for D3.

I'd rather play the one developed by the people who made Diablo 1 & 2, I can trust them to make a good game..... so Torchlight 2 it is!

Seriously though, I have SO much hate for the real money auction house its ridiculous.

The Cool Kid:

The inventory is changed and everything is smoother & cleaner. I feel this was more of a technical decision rather than an artistic one, but still, it does make the game not seem as dark as the other 2.

I can go with that. I'd say it was a technical choice too.

That's not me being rude, that's me being honest. Are you a professional 3D designer? No, you're not, ergo you are dicking around in mudbox etc.

You know this how? I'm actually on the hunt for a job working in in Mudbox and either max or maya at the minute having just finished uni. I'm also attempting to make a game with a few of my uni mates. We're short a codemonkey at the minute though, so fun fun.

You also made some gross errors on how 3d models are made etc

No I didn't, I know how to make 3D models. I know how to box model, fix and export the UV's. Sculpt the high res, bake the normals and retop onto the base mesh.

I also have very basic knowledge of importing and rendering in Unreal and Unity.

leading me to think you don't know that much about 3d graphics.

You made an assumption about me because of a typo. A typo that had absolutely nothing to do with build methodology.

assume

As for the debate statement, I didn't say just say "You can't..." I said "IF you can't..."

Mmmm, taste that? Tastes like weasely weaselings.

I know in the UK it's the done thing to cry foul at everything comment that is critical, but criticisms and insults are not the same beast.

Actually I didn't cry foul at anything, I looked at you being rude and thought, 'know what? I think this calls for some sarcasm.'

Now I know in the US, you have a real hard time with sarcasm. But that just makes it more effective.

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