LilithSlave teaches you about the one true religion: Touhou

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*angry, disgruntled sigh*

Touhou.

Fucking Touhou.

I just want to punch the series in the face. I have no idea or motive to do such a thing; I've never been insulted by the series and I'm actually partial to bullet hell games. But there's something about the series that makes me want to dropkick it off of a building. Maybe it's just the epidemy of what I don't like in otaku culture.

V8 Ninja:
*angry, disgruntled sigh*
-Snip-

image
Don't worry, you're not alone.....

Lilith, the problem is not that people hate Touhou, or anime, or empowered female characters. The problem is you, and our responses to you.

Like EternalNothingness, past experience with threads you create color people's views of the poster. When I go into an EN thread, I expect to see outlandish questions or downright bizarre arguments.

When I go into one of your threads, I expect to see you on your soapbox ranting about how something you care about is allegedly either being ignored or attacked, and your most common response is to either lash out at other posters, act condescending, or act victimized, as though people who disagree with your opinions are outright assaulting you.

You come off as very hostile in your defenses, and previous experiences leave other posters with a bad impression of you.

With that out of the way, I still have a hard time seeing how this is one of the most popular "indie" titles. Minecraft stopped being "indie" when it sold over a million copies, now twenty times that. If Touhou has "millions of extremely dedicated followers", then I would stop calling that an indie title and more a fully blown fandom.

However, with that said, apart from those sites dedicated to Touhou Project, I wouldn't describe it as the phenomenon that you declare it to be. If you wanted to discuss Touhou on The Escapist, then simply asking if someone else has played it would be enough. The amount of sperging you did in the OP gives the impression that you are a hardcore fan, and there's nothing wrong with that. But to use your self described "hardcoriness" as an excuse to sound condescending, and treat this like you are going to convert us into Touhou fans is rather annoying.

Having a long OP describing the games and fandom is fine, but don't expect a warm welcome or the embrace of the community when you explain the fandom with such an air of smug superiority, as if already being a fan somehow makes you an enlightened prophet spreading the word to the ignorant masses.

Sometimes you just have to accept that people have different opinions, and live with that.

ToxicOranges:
OP, I despise bullet hell shooters, have no interest in your advertising and offensive comments about religion, and I hope this thread gets removed by the mods. Good day sir. Fall in a hole.

Jesus dude, what the hell is your problem?

Doesn't look like something I'd enjoy playing... yeah, not really much beyond that.

anthony87:

ToxicOranges:
OP, I despise bullet hell shooters, have no interest in your advertising and offensive comments about religion, and I hope this thread gets removed by the mods. Good day sir. Fall in a hole.

Jesus dude, what the hell is your problem?

My guess would be a severe case of Jimmies rustled syndrome

Well, I like shooters like Touhou...never been good at them though. But they're fun. Never actually checked out a Touhou game, but I've got plenty of time.

And I hate to be very confrontational, but in the battle of Lilith vs. General Consensus of The Escapist, I think both sides have some work to do with how they handle each other. Hell, a lot of people do treat her badly on the basis that she enjoys a good number of anime-style games. It's probably just better to say it isn't your cup of tea rather than go into a tirade of how Japanese (or bullet hell, whatever, etc.) games suck.

At the same time, Lilith could probably handle some of the criticism a little better. Rather than going after the people who may not like Japanese and anime-style games, I think she would do better to seriously just ignore these people.

However, I'm starting to see why Lilith feels the way she does. The same people will come on every topic she makes to question and belittle what she likes. Kinda hard to ignore someone when they make it a point to show up in every topic you make.

Both sides of the argument DO have problems, and no one's blameless, but I am actually starting to sympathize with Lilith.

Anyways, very informative (if a bit condescending) post on a series I don't know much about. I'll have to look into Touhou and see if I like it.

Ah touhou, while I may not have put many hours into the series and have never seen past stage 2, for me the best part of the series is the music, especially the jazz and folk remixes.

Matthew94:
Why do you complain about media that is male dominated but have no problem playing games like this where there is only one "active humanoid male character in the Touhou series." who "is also one of the few characters who seem to have no fighting ability.".

So the only guy is one who can't fight.

I have no problem with the game but it's funny that you don't either.

WHAT THIS GAME NEEDS IS SOME DUKE

image

I think anything could benefeit from just a little bit of Duke at one point or another.

OT: Wait, was any of that supposed to make me WANT to play any of these games? Yeah, I've heard of them before, and frankly I avoid it like the plague. Not only because the very concept repulses me, but because the fanbase can the stuff of nightmares at times.
Even Metal Gear Solid can be a little bit too anime for me at times, so something like this is pretty much the equivalent of ingesting 30 pounds of broken glass then riding one of those amusement park rides that constantly flies up and down really fast.
Captcha was: hush puppies
image
You. Puppy. Up there. Shut the hell up right this instant.

A ha! I played a Touhou game at a friend's house, without knowing what it was called or where to find it. Thanks to the OP, I now know it was Perfect Cherry Blossom, and I'm going to get me a copy.

Thanks!

ChupathingyX:

And didn't you like Katawa Shoujo?

A game that has you hit on burned victims and crippled people? No, no thanks

Why do the girl look so young but still have boobs?

Lilani:
When people talk about it, they are convinced there is nobody in the world who could dislike it once they've "given it a shot." But that just isn't how people work. There are people out there who could sit through both seasons of MLP and come out totally unimpressed and unconvinced of its greatness. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Err, except that I'm not doing that at all about either fandom. I merely made the topic under the premise that some people would be interested in it and that not everyone would hate it.

I think their taste is terrible if they don't like My Little Pony. But whatever. It's just like I respond in all the My Little Pony topics. We don't have to appease their negative opinions, and they don't really deserve to have their negative opinions treated like they matter, should be respect, or influence anyone. Their opinions are inconsequential and should be treated as such.

Sorry, but that anime look makes my skin crawl. I've seen the TF2 mod stuff and it was equally unsettling. I didn't even know it was a game.

This is like, the epitome of everything I want to go away.

Solaire of Astora:
Well, I like shooters like Touhou...never been good at them though. But they're fun. Never actually checked out a Touhou game, but I've got plenty of time.

And I hate to be very confrontational, but in the battle of Lilith vs. General Consensus of The Escapist, I think both sides have some work to do with how they handle each other. Hell, a lot of people do treat her badly on the basis that she enjoys a good number of anime-style games. It's probably just better to say it isn't your cup of tea rather than go into a tirade of how Japanese (or bullet hell, whatever, etc.) games suck.

At the same time, Lilith could probably handle some of the criticism a little better. Rather than going after the people who may not like Japanese and anime-style games, I think she would do better to seriously just ignore these people.

However, I'm starting to see why Lilith feels the way she does. The same people will come on every topic she makes to question and belittle what she likes. Kinda hard to ignore someone when they make it a point to show up in every topic you make.

Both sides of the argument DO have problems, and no one's blameless, but I am actually starting to sympathize with Lilith.

Anyways, very informative (if a bit condescending) post on a series I don't know much about. I'll have to look into Touhou and see if I like it.

I agree with you in regards to the "Lilith vs. the forum celebrities and friends" deal. I don't think I have ever agreed with anything Lilith has said, but nevertheless I think the escapist needs people with varying opinions to bust up the hive-mind thing it has going. I see whole threads of people posting just to agree with everyone else in the thread, and that's not really a discussion.

IamLEAM1983:
but they *become* sexualized once certain fans get ahold of them.

So what? That isn't the issue of the gaming industry itself. You keep using a word, 38, what the heck is 38? I keep thinking you mean 34, is in the rule 34 of the internet joke. Which explicitly states that if something exists, there is porn of it. You keep using that word, I don't think it means what you think it means.

It really doesn't bother me that some people see characters in a sexual light and are sexually attracted to them. This is pretty much all fictional characters. And this does not make Touhou bad. When most My Little Pony fans are making My Little Pony fanworks, they're not usually thinking "Oh My God YES, this is so female empowering. This totally passes the Bechdel test!", even though it does, pass the Bechdel test, they're thinking, "boy, I sure do love those candy coloured ponies!", and for some of them, it is even in a sexual sense, including people who make Apple Bloom porn.

So what and who cares? It does not make this every fan and it does not make My Little Pony or Touhou degrading.

Chemical Alia:
Sorry, but that anime look makes my skin crawl. I've seen the TF2 mod stuff and it was equally unsettling. I didn't even know it was a game.

To be entirely honest, the original designs of Team Fortress 2 make my skin crawl. It feels like an insult to Norman Rockwell to compare those designs to it.

Chemical Alia:
This is like, the epitome of everything I want to go away.

And Touhou represents everything I love about video games and want to spread.

You know, because you wanted to share how you felt like that. I just thought I'd share my feelings just the same.

Well, I found the OP enlightening.

That said, I rather intensely dislike bullet hell games... I also dislike most 2D fighting games (the one displayed in the third vid of the OP looks halfway playable, if spam-happy)
...which brings us to the aesthetic. Headache-inducing is the first term that comes to mind. I'm not fond of every game trying for haze-filtered photorealism, but neither am I fond of this opposite extreme. Also, the magical girl thing has always seemed silly to me. Kind of on-par with the Care Bears cartoon.

Still, enlightening. Just not for me. As with all religions, I'll pass.

the Mario like one I'd play
the bullet hell shooters, um, no. i like being able to move thanks

I personally am a little disturbed by most Japanese culture it's too stress oriented although I do love me some Yu Yu Hakusho and Gundam Wing. Also I don't like being condescended, you managed to blast me with both in one massive post, no need to write the whole thing like you're everyone's superior it's frustrating to read.

Rouzeki:
Another thing, you went to the memes to quick!

Ah, well, that was kind of the point. I wanted to show the most "noteworthy" things about the franchise instead of obscure songs and characters and things.

Sorry. Hey, I'm glad to find a fellow Touhou fan, though!

lacktheknack:

SmashLovesTitanQuest:
....What in the actual fuck is going on in this thread?

I'm trying to make sense of all this but my brain keeps shutting itself down as a defense mechanism.

This.

I mean, basically, Lilith made a big OP explaining her love of Touhou, and now there's poo everywhere. I think I missed a lot of important things.

It doesn't help that my knowledge of Touhou consists mostly of this.

I'm in the same boat. I have not a single clue what is going on with Lilith and the commmunity. I think perhaps I need to pay more attention as I'm evidently missing out on a lot of good controversy.

LilithSlave:

Lilani:
When people talk about it, they are convinced there is nobody in the world who could dislike it once they've "given it a shot." But that just isn't how people work. There are people out there who could sit through both seasons of MLP and come out totally unimpressed and unconvinced of its greatness. And there is absolutely nothing wrong with that.

Err, except that I'm not doing that at all about either fandom. I merely made the topic under the premise that some people would be interested in it and that not everyone would hate it.

Good.

LilithSlave:

I think their taste is terrible if they don't like My Little Pony. But whatever. It's just like I respond in all the My Little Pony topics. We don't have to appease their negative opinions, and they don't really deserve to have their negative opinions treated like they matter, should be respect, or influence anyone. Their opinions are inconsequential and should be treated as such.

Omg what the fuck just went wrong. It's like you are trying to sabotage your own posts. People who disagree with you do not have inconsequential opinions.

They just don't like things that you do.

Insulting them is bullshit.

Reading this thread all I can think of is trolololololol and its NOT because of Lilith's comments for once. Honestly I'm disgusted by the amount of trolling here on her. (admittedly not everyone is doing such but a fair few posters are some of whom are big names on the forum)

Anyway though I've never actually played any Touhou game myself (due to not speaking a lick of Japanese and the games not being in English) I have heard of it. Hell on a Yugioh forum I used to frequent there were frequent discussions on it and many of its users are big fans. And though Lilith has seemed to inflate the numbers a tad she is right that the games are very popular not just in Japan but in many circles worldwide. They just typically stick to there own forums and Youtube when discussing it.

And though I have never played the games I do love many of the OSTs from the game and like some of the silly fan videos of the characters on Youtube. Also I like the lore what little I've read on it on TvTropes that is.

Helmholtz Watson:

ChupathingyX:

And didn't you like Katawa Shoujo?

A game that has you hit on burned victims and crippled people? No, no thanks

Describing it like that is like saying Lord of the Rings was a hiking story.

LilithSlave:

Elmoth:
Also, Magical Girls are a cheap ploy to abuse the viewer's liking of submissive sexualized females.

In fact, I think I'd rather see ZUN make fanservice characters to himself because he'd rather play as girl happen a lot, than to gaming dominated by dudes. Having an adoration of cuteness or female character or even magical girls is not a bad thing. And "magical girls" are primarily made as a genre for a girl audience. Most magical girl stuff is considered in the "shoujo" genre.

Wait, your saying that this game is geared towards girls and your suprised that some guys don't like it? Really?

LilithSlave:

There's nothing to be berated about Touhou's all female cast. It certainly isn't any worse than Team Fortress 2's all male cast.

Flame persons gender isn't given.

ChupathingyX:

Helmholtz Watson:

ChupathingyX:

And didn't you like Katawa Shoujo?

A game that has you hit on burned victims and crippled people? No, no thanks

Describing it like that is like saying Lord of the Rings was a hiking story.

lol funny you mention that.......

Again, I don't have a desire to hit on handicap girls. I'll be nice to them, but I don't want to make out with them.

Helmholtz Watson:
lol funny you mention that.......
snip

Again, I don't have a desire to hit on handicap girls. I'll be nice to them, but I don't want to make out with them.

Yeah, that's what I was referencing.

And if you're worried about seeing some tit then you can just turn them off in the options.

ChupathingyX:

Helmholtz Watson:
lol funny you mention that.......
snip

Again, I don't have a desire to hit on handicap girls. I'll be nice to them, but I don't want to make out with them.

Yeah, that's what I was referencing.

And if you're worried about seeing some tit then you can just turn them off in the options.

Nudity isn't the issue, the issue is I don't romanticize nor have any intention of having romantic feelings towards said people.

Helmholtz Watson:
Nudity isn't the issue, the issue is I don't romanticize nor have any intention of having romantic feelings towards said people.

I could ask a million and one questions regarding that, but I won't.

To be honest I'm not even sure why you quoted me in the first place, considering that was directed at another person.

ChupathingyX:

I could ask a million and one questions regarding that, but I won't.

What's to ask? It's my opinion. I didn't say that handicap people shouldn't find love, just that I'm not attracted to them.

ChupathingyX:
To be honest I'm not even sure why you quoted me in the first place, considering that was directed at another person.

And?

I spit upon your blasphemous beliefs.

Vault101:
its all..."Anime" like

*shudder* don't like anime....

Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
how could you not like anime? It's like the one true good! Its like fuzzy animals hugging their babies or pictures of pretty sunsets!

NiPah:
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
how could you not like anime? It's like the one true good! Its like fuzzy animals hugging their babies or pictures of pretty sunsets!

are you new to the internet? by any chance?

Vault101:

NiPah:
Nooooooooooooooooooooooooooooo
how could you not like anime? It's like the one true good! Its like fuzzy animals hugging their babies or pictures of pretty sunsets!

are you new to the internet? by any chance?

I don't see how my internet experience plays a part in you disliking the absolute good of anime. From the forums of CSPAN to the dredges of 4chan I've yet to hear of someone disliking anime.
Well I guess there were a few people who disliked anime, but most of those were just people who never saw it, upon seeing it they saw the errors of their way and quickly voiced their love as well.

Evil Smurf:

Dr Pussymagnet:
Wait, you're telling me Touhou's not a hentai?

Damn you! Now I can't help think of Squids! D:

My I recommend a soft drink to you goes by the name tentacle grape.

Touhou sort of died down after Undefined Fantastic Object. It sure did hit a spark in 2009: The year of Touhou.

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