Do not waste your money on Dawnguard.

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Look, I'm buckling up for a massive backlash here, but I feel this is something that needs to be said.

Much like the game it is designed for, Dawnguard is alright. The story is pretty interesting, (even though it is totally making it up as it goes along), the High Vampire powers are pretty damn cool, and I appreciate the Werewolf overhaul to make it worth a damn. However, we have to bring up the elephant in the room.

The price.

Dawnguard is clearly doing it's absolute best in the marketing to look like a Shivering Isles-esque expansion, with loads of new places to explore, buckets of new loot, and everything else that made Shivering Isles so damn good. However, do not believe this. Dawnguard has about as much content in it as one of Fallout 3's downloadable content pieces.

The biggest dissapointment is that a huge amount of the added content of Dawnguard does not, in fact, take place in a new location, like Big MT or The Divide in Fallout New Vegas. No, most of Dawnguards content comes from dungeons inserted into the main map of Skyrim, most of them built from very similar assets to the base game.

Translation: A signifigant chunk of Skyrim's content is spent in the same cookie-cutter dungeons you were bored of months ago.

Before you angrily type in your rebuttal, there are new locations in Dawnguard. Fort Dawnguard and Castle Ican'trememberthename serve as the hub for the Human and Vampire questlines respectively, plus, you do get to go do different locations during the main quest. However, you don't get to stay there very long, only one is particularly interesting and different enough from the main Skyrim landscape to be worthy of a mention, and the game does nothing with them, basically using them as locations for fetch quests.

However, the thing that kills my enjoyment of Dawnguard is the choice. Much has been made of the player's ability to side with either the Vampires or the Vampire Hunters. However, this choice is very poorly handled. In a game with this choice done well, like the aforementioned Fallout: New Vegas, Vampire: The Masquerade Bloodlines, or, hell, even the Civil War choice in Skyrim proper, the player is given ample time and oppurtunnity to learn of the factions available to them. This cannot be said of Dawnguard. You are forced to make the choice knowing very little of the Dawnguard, and fuck all about the Vampires, so it is literally impossible to make an informed decision on your first run-through.

Couple that with the Crossbow being underwhelming as an addition (it's basically an inferior version of the bow), Dawnguard is a merely average piece of DLC, but for just how bloody expensive is, twice the price of any of Fallout:NV's infintely better DLC pieces, it's not worth the money. If it ever goes down in price, yeah, why not, it isn't bad per se, but right now, this is something only hardcore Skyrim fans should consider, and even then, they should probably think pretty hard about it.

It's true, bang for buck isn't up to TES standards so if you have any sense at all wait for a discount, the are just cashing in on the early hype at the moment.

I actually thought it was worth it.

I like the new additions, especially the crossbow.

Crossbows stagger enemies like a boss :D

Daystar Clarion:
I actually thought it was worth it.

I like the new additions, especially the crossbow.

Crossbows stagger enemies like a boss :D

I guess it's just my personal experience of the game. I already had about 50,000 weapons that could, as you say, stagger enemies like a boss so I didn't really find any use for it.

I was happily waiting for the PS3 version to come out until I saw the price their charging for it on Steam, if they charge that much on PS3(I can't see why they won't be) I won't be buying Dawnguard. There just isn't enough content in the dlc to justify that price tag, the amount of content added is less than some of the Fallout 3/New Vegas dlc packs which cost half as much. Not to mention the dickish way Bethesda have been going about with this dlc, first saying they have 'no plans' to bring it out on PC and PS3 and now saying they have but(as usual) their having problems with the PS3 version.

Steam informed that "Dawnguard [is] now available" so like the sucker I am I went to Skyrims store page and prepared to whip out my credit card... Then I see it: 19.99 euro for Dawnguard? They want me to pay five euros more for a fairly short DLC then I did for Orcs Must Die 2? They want me to pay the price of 2 meaty New Vegas DLC for that?

Gethsemani made a stand, said "No way!" and booted up Orcs Must Die 2 instead, because she wants value for her money.

I'll do as I damn well please with my money.

I don't get why people make these kinds of threads, you may think you're trying to help people, but you just come across as annoying telling people not to buy something.

imahobbit4062:
I'll do as I damn well please with my money.

I don't get why people make these kinds of threads, you may think you're trying to help people, but you just come across as annoying telling people not to buy something.

I'll do as I damn well please with my threads.

I don't get why people make these kinds of replies, you may think you're acting smart, but you just come across as a raging fanboy getting angry when people express their opinions.

woodaba:

imahobbit4062:
I'll do as I damn well please with my money.

I don't get why people make these kinds of threads, you may think you're trying to help people, but you just come across as annoying telling people not to buy something.

I'll do as I damn well please with my threads.

I don't get why people make these kinds of replies, you may think you're acting smart, but you just come across as a raging fanboy getting angry when people express their opinions.

I don't think I'm acting smart, I think I'm telling someone what I can and can't do with my money and that he, nor anyone else should tell other people what they can and can't spend their money on.

Want to express your opinion? Try making the thread title sound more like an expression than a statement. "I don't think you should spend your money on Dawnguard" or "Why I feel ripped off from Dawnguard" not "Do not waste your money on Dawnguard". It sounds more inviting if you don't come across stating your opinion as fact.

Meh, I thought it was worth the price tag for fans of the franchise.

imahobbit4062:

woodaba:

imahobbit4062:
I'll do as I damn well please with my money.

I don't get why people make these kinds of threads, you may think you're trying to help people, but you just come across as annoying telling people not to buy something.

I'll do as I damn well please with my threads.

I don't get why people make these kinds of replies, you may think you're acting smart, but you just come across as a raging fanboy getting angry when people express their opinions.

I don't think I'm acting smart, I think I'm telling someone what I can and can't do with my money and that he, nor anyone else should tell other people what they can and can't spend their money on.

Want to express your opinion? Try making the thread title sound more like an expression than a statement. "I don't think you should spend your money on Dawnguard" or "Why I feel ripped off from Dawnguard" not "Do not waste your money on Dawnguard". It sounds more inviting if you don't come across stating your opinion as fact.

I have repeatedly made it very, very clear that I have an intense dislike for the Internet's recent demand to put "IMO" at the end of everything. I would think that people realize that what I am saying is nothing more than an opinion. If you are unintelligent or inexperienced enough that you are unable to understand as opinion when you see one without me spelling it out for you, then that's not my problem.

imahobbit4062:
I'll do as I damn well please with my money.

I don't get why people make these kinds of threads, you may think you're trying to help people, but you just come across as annoying telling people not to buy something.

Kinda have to agree here, these threads become a right pain in the arse.

OT: Honestly, 20 bucks isn't that much, its like a 10th of one pay check for one week, I can handle that and I want my motherfucking crossbows, as soon as I get paid I'm buying the damn thing.

woodaba:

imahobbit4062:

woodaba:

I'll do as I damn well please with my threads.

I don't get why people make these kinds of replies, you may think you're acting smart, but you just come across as a raging fanboy getting angry when people express their opinions.

I don't think I'm acting smart, I think I'm telling someone what I can and can't do with my money and that he, nor anyone else should tell other people what they can and can't spend their money on.

Want to express your opinion? Try making the thread title sound more like an expression than a statement. "I don't think you should spend your money on Dawnguard" or "Why I feel ripped off from Dawnguard" not "Do not waste your money on Dawnguard". It sounds more inviting if you don't come across stating your opinion as fact.

I have repeatedly made it very, very clear that I have an intense dislike for the Internet's recent demand to put "IMO" at the end of everything. I would think that people realize that what I am saying is nothing more than an opinion. If you are unintelligent or inexperienced enough that you are unable to understand as opinion when you see one without me spelling it out for you, then that's not my problem.

As you can see, I joined this site long before you did, inexperience or lack of intellect. You can easily tell someone your personal faults without having to put IMO at the start of every sentence, you just come across as dickish about the entire thing and dickish in general.

imahobbit4062:

woodaba:

imahobbit4062:
I don't think I'm acting smart, I think I'm telling someone what I can and can't do with my money and that he, nor anyone else should tell other people what they can and can't spend their money on.

Want to express your opinion? Try making the thread title sound more like an expression than a statement. "I don't think you should spend your money on Dawnguard" or "Why I feel ripped off from Dawnguard" not "Do not waste your money on Dawnguard". It sounds more inviting if you don't come across stating your opinion as fact.

I have repeatedly made it very, very clear that I have an intense dislike for the Internet's recent demand to put "IMO" at the end of everything. I would think that people realize that what I am saying is nothing more than an opinion. If you are unintelligent or inexperienced enough that you are unable to understand as opinion when you see one without me spelling it out for you, then that's not my problem.

As you can see, I joined this site long before you did, inexperience or lack of intellect. You can easily tell someone your personal faults without having to put IMO at the start of every sentence, you just come across as dickish about the entire thing and dickish in general.

Please quote where, in the OP, I sound "dickish" to you. I did not mean to come across that way, I merely wished to ward people away from what I thought was a lackluster piece of DLC, considering the price. At no stage did I attempt to act like a dick.

What does joining the site before me have anything to do with anything?

This is starting to sound like less of a genuine greivance with the perceived presentation of my opinion as fact, and more a Skyrim fanboy desperately trying to discredit an opinion that is less than positive towards it. I by no means think you are this person, 'm just letting you know that it's how you are coming across.

woodaba:

imahobbit4062:

woodaba:

I have repeatedly made it very, very clear that I have an intense dislike for the Internet's recent demand to put "IMO" at the end of everything. I would think that people realize that what I am saying is nothing more than an opinion. If you are unintelligent or inexperienced enough that you are unable to understand as opinion when you see one without me spelling it out for you, then that's not my problem.

As you can see, I joined this site long before you did, inexperience or lack of intellect. You can easily tell someone your personal faults without having to put IMO at the start of every sentence, you just come across as dickish about the entire thing and dickish in general.

Please quote where, in the OP, I sound "dickish" to you. I did not mean to come across that way, I merely wished to ward people away from what I thought was a lackluster piece of DLC, considering the price. At no stage did I attempt to act like a dick.

What does joining the site before me have anything to do with anything?

This is starting to sound like less of a genuine greivance with the perceived presentation of my opinion as fact, and more a Skyrim fanboy desperately trying to discredit an opinion that is less than positive towards it. I by no means think you are this person, 'm just letting you know that it's how you are coming across.

I can't be arsed sifting through a quoting specific examples, you in general just come across as dickish.

Joining before you means it is not a lack if experience, which I seemed to of not typed, my apologies there.

I don't care that you don't like Dawnguard, as I stated with my original post. It's that you don't have the right to tell people what they can or cannot buy with their money. I would of said the same thing if you made a thread about a game I don't like, the fact that it's Skyrim has nothing to do with it.

Meh, I liked it and felt it was worth the price.

Easily.

imahobbit4062:

woodaba:

imahobbit4062:
As you can see, I joined this site long before you did, inexperience or lack of intellect. You can easily tell someone your personal faults without having to put IMO at the start of every sentence, you just come across as dickish about the entire thing and dickish in general.

Please quote where, in the OP, I sound "dickish" to you. I did not mean to come across that way, I merely wished to ward people away from what I thought was a lackluster piece of DLC, considering the price. At no stage did I attempt to act like a dick.

What does joining the site before me have anything to do with anything?

This is starting to sound like less of a genuine greivance with the perceived presentation of my opinion as fact, and more a Skyrim fanboy desperately trying to discredit an opinion that is less than positive towards it. I by no means think you are this person, 'm just letting you know that it's how you are coming across.

I can't be arsed sifting through a quoting specific examples, you in general just come across as dickish.

Joining before you means it is not a lack if experience, which I seemed to of not typed, my apologies there.

I don't care that you don't like Dawnguard, as I stated with my original post. It's that you don't have the right to tell people what they can or cannot buy with their money. I would of said the same thing if you made a thread about a game I don't like, the fact that it's Skyrim has nothing to do with it.

How convenient. When you show me evidence of my supposed dickery, then your point is valid. Until then, it is a strawman argument.

Oh, dear lord. Look, I'm not saying "YOU MUST NOT BUY THIS DLC, OR SUFFER THE CONSEQUENCES". If you actually read my OP, then you would realize that I basically said that hardcore fans of Skyrim should consider picking it up. I'm not telling you what to do with your money, i'm offering my opinion on a piece of Downloadable Content. But then, you would know that, if you hadn't just looked at the title and went on a "righteous crusade" against someone who is "telling you how to spend your money". You may or may not have done that, but that is how it is coming across.

Is the price for Dawnguard higher on PC than Xbox 360?

The price for Skyrim's DLC is the same as any of the Fallouts' there.

And I'm going to compare Dawnguard to Knights of the Nine, not Shivering Isles thank you very much.

When i saw it today on steam i just thought " Are you kidding me? 'We are not planning on bringing this game to pc' and a few days later it's finished and on steam."

I will most likely buy it at the steam winter sale, if ever.

Aerosteam 1908:
Is the price for Dawnguard higher on PC than Xbox 360?

The price for Skyrim's DLC is the same as any of the Fallouts' there.

And I'm going to compare Dawnguard to Knights of the Nine, not Shivering Isles thank you very much.

1) Depends on your region. It's more expensive in Europe, very slightly less expensive here in the UK, and I can't really vouch for any other territory.

2) You are wrong. Blatantly, indisputably, wrong.

Here, let me prove it to you:

Fallout DLC: http://store.steampowered.com/app/72730/

Skyrim DLC: http://store.steampowered.com/app/211720/

Notice a difference?

3) You do that. However, even then, it still comes up short. Knights of the Nine has a very similar level of content, for half the price. The marketing for Dawnguard is clearly comparing it to the Shivering Isles, which I mentioned in my OP.

The price seemed alright to me, it adds a decent amount of content and pretty fun.

woodaba:

Couple that with the Crossbow being underwhelming as an addition (it's basically an inferior version of the bow)

You say what!?!?!?!?? I love the crossbow, I like it much better than the bows and am really glad they added it back in. As Daystar said, all of dat swagger.....I mean stagger.

I wouldn't say it's on the same level as shivering isles but it still seems like a good piece of DLC, more like knights of the nine. Im going to wait on them releasing a huge piece of DLC that adds a whole new area like Shivering isles did.

It's not a crappy should have been in the game DLC cash grab like 80% of what is usaully released as DLC for games I like so im pretty happy with it. I will admit the price was a bit high but I got it on Xbox so the price will of course suck because ****ing Microsoft, therefore I don't really blame Bethesda that much. Also in regards to not knowing much about either faction, you can actully make more than one character and you can actully just make a backup save to load up if you didn't like your faction. It's what I did, first joined the Dawnguard but then I wanted to try the vampires so I loaded my mage character up and ended up shooting through the whole campaign.

I still have yet to do the Dawnguard questline though.

A. No

B. Already Bought it

C. It was worth every cent.

Dandark:
The price seemed alright to me, it adds a decent amount of content and pretty fun.

woodaba:

Couple that with the Crossbow being underwhelming as an addition (it's basically an inferior version of the bow)

You say what!?!?!?!?? I love the crossbow, I like it much better than the bows and am really glad they added it back in. As Daystar said, all of dat swagger.....I mean stagger.

I wouldn't say it's on the same level as shivering isles but it still seems like a good piece of DLC, more like knights of the nine. Im going to wait on them releasing a huge piece of DLC that adds a whole new area like Shivering isles did.

It's not a crappy should have been in the game DLC cash grab like 80% of what is usaully released as DLC for games I like so im pretty happy with it. I will admit the price was a bit high but I got it on Xbox so the price will of course suck because ****ing Microsoft, therefore I don't really blame Bethesda that much. Also in regards to not knowing much about either faction, you can actully make more than one character and you can actully just make a backup save to load up if you didn't like your faction. It's what I did, first joined the Dawnguard but then I wanted to try the vampires so I loaded my mage character up and ended up shooting through the whole campaign.

I still have yet to do the Dawnguard questline though.

I don't know...I just never found a use for the Crossbow. Maybe it gets better if you do those really repetitive quests for the woman in Fort Dawnguard, but I burned out on those after I got the fire bolts. "What's that? You want me to go get an identical schematic from an Identical dungeon? For the 4th time in a row? Fuck off."

You can't really blame Microsoft for the price. Bethesda chose that price point themselves, as evidenced by the similar price on Steam. I know Bethesda has an incredibly loyal following, and they generally do alright by gamers (except when they aren't selling us Horse Armor), but this one is entirely on them.

Yes, you can make a new character, but it's a really poorly designed choice when you literally have to break the constraints of the game to find out what you are choosing. Yes, you can change your character. Doesn't make up for the fact that the choice is poorly designed.

woodaba:

Aerosteam 1908:
The price for Skyrim's DLC is the same as any of the Fallouts' there.

You are wrong. Blatantly, indisputably, wrong.

Well I only saw the price for Dawnguard once before and forgot it.

>.>

<.<

Aerosteam 1908:

woodaba:

Aerosteam 1908:
The price for Skyrim's DLC is the same as any of the Fallouts' there.

You are wrong. Blatantly, indisputably, wrong.

Well I only saw the price for Dawnguard once before and forgot it.

>.>

<.<

It is rather hard to believe when you first see it...

Gethsemani:
Steam informed that "Dawnguard [is] now available" so like the sucker I am I went to Skyrims store page and prepared to whip out my credit card... Then I see it: 19.99 euro for Dawnguard? They want me to pay five euros more for a fairly short DLC then I did for Orcs Must Die 2? They want me to pay the price of 2 meaty New Vegas DLC for that?

Gethsemani made a stand, said "No way!" and booted up Orcs Must Die 2 instead, because she wants value for her money.

Yeah, this is the sticking point for me. It really lowers the standard for DLC in these games. Shivering Isles has almost enough content on its own to keep me happy as a standalone game, and quality content at that (definitely still my favorite Elder Scrolls content). The New Vegas DLC had generally between 5-10 hours of content (with Honest Hearts having the least and Old World Blues having the most). And again, those were high quality: New areas, new story, new characters, new weapons.

Dawnguard sounds rather miniscule in comparison, and yet it costs more. I was never going to buy it anyway because I couldn't care less about vampires (and no, that's not a reaction to Twilight. I pretty much always felt like that). The crossbows sound cool, but I'm not paying $20 for them.

woodaba:
However, the thing that kills my enjoyment of Dawnguard is the choice. Much has been made of the player's ability to side with either the Vampires or the Vampire Hunters. However, this choice is very poorly handled.

OT: Out of curiosity... what happens if you are already a vampire in the original game, before playing Dawnguard? I didn't know they were going to make an expansion with humans vs vampires. It seems your choices might be even more limited then. Or is it going to be a 'wolf amongst sheep' kinda thing. Anyone knows?

O well disposable income is disposable.
I'm a fan of the series, I'm liking it so far but the price tag was a little hexxy.

Waiting for a price cut myself. Don't let me down steam.

I don't think an expansion like that is worth 20 Euro's either personally. As fun as it looks.

I don't have that kind of spare cash. And before people call me out on my WoW-habits.
I still enjoy WoW, It's a guaranteed enjoyment. For a month. For less than half that price.

Dawnguard I bet will barely fill a week.

fgs browser [mis post/ ignore]

I knew it wouldn't be as awesome as Shivering Isles. The day of awesome expansion packs is over. I'll wait for the price to drop.

woodaba:
snip

And thus why I usually wait for the GotY. I want to get Skyrim for my PC, but I dont want to missout on the DLC packs, even if they're lackluster...

imahobbit4062:
I'll do as I damn well please with my money.

I don't get why people make these kinds of threads, you may think you're trying to help people, but you just come across as annoying telling people not to buy something.

You come across as annoying. OP was expressing an opinion. Since when was that not allowed?

woodaba:

imahobbit4062:
I'll do as I damn well please with my money.

I don't get why people make these kinds of threads, you may think you're trying to help people, but you just come across as annoying telling people not to buy something.

I'll do as I damn well please with my threads.

I don't get why people make these kinds of replies, you may think you're acting smart, but you just come across as a raging fanboy getting angry when people express their opinions.

Couldn't agree more. Woodaba is the one that comes across as annoying.

Fair Warning: Bethesda Fan(boy)

Couple things I've noticed.

First DLC:
Fallout 3: Operation Anchorage - imo the absolute weakest of the dlc for the game. One redeeming factor is the gear for your normal Lone Wanderer (Chinese Armor/ Rail gun). Story stinks, atmosphere, while different, is unappealing and has tons of magical 'you can not cross this line' areas. Complete throwaway characters, has nearly 0 bearing on your actual Fallout 3 character.

Fallout NV: Dead Money - again, the worst dlc offering (omitting razzledazzle crap like weapon packs). Area sucks, arbitrary time consuming tasks (fog, speakers), unappealing characters (maybe Domino though..) and this one doesn't even have any noteworthy weapons to bring back with you.

Case in point, the first DLC has been the weakest for both Fallout games.

I also argue that in contrast to Bioware RPGs, I feel like I'm getting a helluva lot for my $10 in Fallout. I would gladly pay 20.

The only 2 things that upset me about Dawnguard are:
A. It took so damn long (including the marketting crap with MS) especially for something with, as mentioned...
B. Seemingly a lot of recycled content. I don't demand to be on another planet, but the bar is rather high with DLC like the Shivering Isles, The Pitt, Mothership Zeta, Point Lookout, Old World Blues, Honest Hearts, and even the aforementioned Dead Money and Operation Anchorage. All these areas looked completely different from the stock game world.

Bottom line, I'm buying Dawnguard. Even if it's the worst piece of drivel ever, it'll just go on the stack of other stellar DLC Bethesda's put out. Now if the next few bits are in the same boat, then I may revise my views, but for now they have too much good cred with me.

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