Jodah:
I think the real problem, which is partially related to yours, is that those who do not use game forums really do not know the potential of a game.

To explain this further let me begin by saying that knowing the potential of a game does not necessarily mean you know how to program one. All I mean is that a large percentage of the people that use forums such as these have seen better games. These games are generally sleepers and, for whatever reason, never take off.

What I am attempting to say throughout my inane rambling is that most people who claim to hate Halo (and other mass market games) do not actually "hate" them. Most of them just hate the mass publicity these games receive, while truly revolutionary or good games are swept under the rug. This leads to companies simply trying to leach any scraps from the bloated carcass that is left after the initial rush of these games rather than trying to make their own games.

This is what I believe most people are complaining about. They simply say Halo is to blame.

I think you are 100 percent correct.

Most of the people who praise Halo as some kind of second coming haven't played other, less recognized, games that are better.

In essence, I guess I'm saying that they're not stupid, just ignorant.

UPS Express:
Most of the people who praise Halo as some kind of second coming haven't played other, less recognized, games that are better.

In essence, I guess I'm saying that they're not stupid, just ignorant.

See, there you go, you've got the whole "Halo iz 4 noobs" thing cropping up again followed by the unsupported (maybe unsupportable?) assertion that they'd prefer "other" games if they tried them. I see too much of this floating around in general game forums; it's just another variant of saying that heathens and heretics would convert if only they could see the Light of the True Faith, instead of the cloud of lies by the Infidel.

I've got no problem with people prefering other games; tastes differ, and some will pay for what others will pay to avoid. My problem is with the pervasive idea that those with different tastes are somehow inferior because of those tastes. It's not a very mature world-view; us gamers should be better than that.

-- Steve

Anton P. Nym:

See, there you go, you've got the whole "Halo iz 4 noobs" thing cropping up again followed by the unsupported (maybe unsupportable?) assertion that they'd prefer "other" games if they tried them. I see too much of this floating around in general game forums; it's just another variant of saying that heathens and heretics would convert if only they could see the Light of the True Faith, instead of the cloud of lies by the Infidel.

I've got no problem with people prefering other games; tastes differ, and some will pay for what others will pay to avoid. My problem is with the pervasive idea that those with different tastes are somehow inferior because of those tastes. It's not a very mature world-view; us gamers should be better than that.

-- Steve

If someone championed Two Worlds over every other title, even I think I would have a hard time swallowing that pill (even though I some how like Two Worlds, lol). Your point rings true most games, but I think it's the idea that the people who say that honestly think the game is completely broken/utter trash, which then brings up the idea that the people chastising are the ones that need to open their eyes more and see what a real garbage FPS or other game is before they call Halo a pile.

Jumplion:

Me for example, I played the multiplayer and I thought it was average. It was a standard deathmatch, first one to melee wins, dual weild everything, first one to grav hammer wins, ect... I didn't think it was horrible, but I didn't think it was bad either. It was average and that's what most people say halo 3 is when they've played it.

That's my theory anyway.

What you say about multiplayer might apply if you only play with people new to the game.. The race to melee first only apples with the assault rifle, and possibly with the BR, and even then, meleeing first doesn't guarantee a win, it doesn't really raise your chances even. Dual wielding is a tad overpowered, but the lack of grenades and melee makes up for it. The gravity hammer works only if everyone rushes the hammer-wielder with shotguns/swords/fists... stand more than five feet away and he's going to die.

It bugs me when people pass their judgment after playing for about ten minutes.

EDIT: Sorry. On topic now.

I feel that there is an under current of people who have decided that HALO IS BAD because THEY DON'T LIKE IT. At the end of the day though, you can't look at the number of people who play Halo on a daily basis and say they're fanboys, so they don't count. I also find it hard to believe that the people who enjoy it and the people who hate it have such opposite opinions. Like a 'Halo hater' will say something in particular sucks in multiplayer, but a fan will say they absolutely adore it.

Now it could just be that one person is wrong, or maybe (just maybe) Halo is like a lot of other things; some people like it, some don't. It's just because it's so popular, everythng about it gets blown to a massive scale, with two distinct sides vieing for control.

ATTENTION!!!

PLEASE STOP POSTING ABOUT WHAT YOU LIKE AND DISLIKE ABOUT HALO! READ THE TOPIC AGAIN

Thanks Ultrajoe and Firedaemon, you said exactly what i was thinking whilst wading through all the other irrelevant posts.

While I am an Xbox360 user, with a Gold subscription to Live I do admit happily to having Halo 3 in my library. I finished the Campaign on Legendary in a few days and am currently just doing the meta game for the achievements. I am a bit of an achievement Whore, but only for games like Mass Effect and Halo 3 which reward you in some way for getting those achievements.

While the Campaign is too easy, nothing special and does remind me that Halo 3 is a bog standard FPS, i still play it because I do think the online section of it is really good. I have only met one or two idiots on it and I have made some very good friends on it, who i play regulary with. One example was a guy I met today n Lone Wolves.

He asked if anyone needed any achievements on it. I mentioned i needed Overkill, Two for One and Maybe Next Time Buddy. Now i didn't know what he needed but because one player did not co-operate things went to hell, but half way through the game i saw him standing there out of the way on a Mongoose, so i ran up and jacked him, then stayed still and allowed him to jack me, not knowing if he had the achievement already, then I jacked him back to earn it myself. Next thing I knew was he sent me a voice message saying thank you very much for helping him, and he promised to add me as a friend and prefer me. I said thanks also.

So my point is this; while the main campaign is predictable, run of the mill and nothing special. The online aspect and community of Halo 3 is amazing. Compared to the CoD4 campaign, which i really enjoyed, and while has some ncie online games it's not as good as Halo 3 and the community is not as friendly.

Although I also add I managed to pick up Halo 3 and Mass Effect for £2.50 in Game, thanks to £2.50 on my reward card and trading in Alone in the Dark for £18

People love to hate on popular things, its just the way people are. Think about any incredibly popular thing and there will be some douche saying "That Sucks." just for the sake of being different.

Considering the percentage of people that own 360's and have actually played Halo 3, its probably easier for the rest of them to take this route than to actually play the game.

Personally I think Halo does epitomize the media massacre, and is terrible, and has very little substance to it, but it is fun, so it doesn't get my "Sucks" award because of that fact.

People love to hate on popular things because alot of popular things have no substance or relevance beyond the extent of their ravenous, brainwashed fan bases. Fact.

Not necessarily saying Halo 3 is one of them, I haven't played it yet. The other two were pretty decent but certainly not the bloody second coming of Christ.

Burnliff:

Jumplion:

Me for example, I played the multiplayer and I thought it was average. It was a standard deathmatch, first one to melee wins, dual weild everything, first one to grav hammer wins, ect... I didn't think it was horrible, but I didn't think it was bad either. It was average and that's what most people say halo 3 is when they've played it.

That's my theory anyway.

What you say about multiplayer might apply if you only play with people new to the game.. The race to melee first only apples with the assault rifle, and possibly with the BR, and even then, meleeing first doesn't guarantee a win, it doesn't really raise your chances even. Dual wielding is a tad overpowered, but the lack of grenades and melee makes up for it. The gravity hammer works only if everyone rushes the hammer-wielder with shotguns/swords/fists... stand more than five feet away and he's going to die.

It bugs me when people pass their judgment after playing for about ten minutes.

I would have much rather played the single player but my friend bought the game solely for multiplayer. Hell, he hasn't even started the campaign.

And everytime we play Halo 3 online, we get bored VERY quickly as nothing interesting ever happens. ever. It's so slow paced that it's boreing and we tend to play CoD4 way more than Halo 3. When ever we did play, it was just first one to melee wins as everyone shot at each other but always went in closer to hopefully melee the oponent first.

And it doesn't help that I could only get half the screen, we did the same type of gameplay (though we did play infection a couple of times), the maps were so huge that it took forever to actually get to a decent firefight, and when there was a firefight it was just between 2 or maybe 3 people. It wasn't as fast paced as CoD4 was with the feeling of a real battle.

Take notice, though, that everything I've just said happend every time I went to my friends house, which wasn't very frequent.

Gaming is a lot like high school in the sense that it has a sort of hierarchy, Halo players are generally the jocks, and Half-Life players are the geeks.

Geeks > Jocks.

I love Halo 3. And I regular all these sites, it's easily my favourite game.

I think the reason it's important is because it propels game development on consoles. It proved how succesful shooters could be on consoles, it showed how video games could have media blitzes to rival all other popular media, it showed how console games COULD have detailed map and video editors.

Few of the things it does are as refined as what the PC audience can do with their user created content, but what matters is that it brings these things to the masses, which is good for the industry anyway. I haven't played matchmaking in months, I have more fun picking random players and joining a custom with them on an origional map.

I think it's more than fair that a lot of people dislike it for whatever reasons they have, such as the plot or design. But I don't think you can really deny that it's an important game, nonetheless.

Halo 3 is ok, but not that good. The SP is too short. But Forge is amazing. If it gets the ability to add AI, then it maybe be a 7.5/10 game in my eyes. And your theory could have a fair bit of truth to it.

Saying that people hate Halo 3 just because it's "cool to hate it" is an utter cop out only intended to marginlize the perspective of those that hate it.

Is Halo 3 enjoyable? YES
Does Halo 3 have one of the most robust online multiplayer modes? YES
Do I hate Halo 3? YES

But the reasons I hate Halo 3 are simply due to bad art design and functional yet bland level design. For me, these things matter. That being said, my criticicisms do not marginalize the good aspects of the game. T

he most common mistake that the opposition makes is that because I hate a few aspects of the game that for some reason I even hate the positives.

(I also hate Metal Gear due to long cut scenes.)

I'll agree "most" Halo fans are frat boys casual style (Go Eagles!).

The last conversation i had with a real life Halo fan....

HIM: So you're a gamer?

ME: *shrug* I play games.

HIM: Do you have Halo?

ME: No, I actually can't stand the game.

HIM: Awww, wha-? Man, then you're not a gamer. I fucking love that game.

ME: Okay.

Halo 3 has its good points and its bad points. For me the main bad point is the character of the master cheif himself, I honestly absolutely despise the master cheif. My hatred stems almost entirely from his stupid punchlines (honestly what is supposed to be so awe inspiring about "I need a weapon") I find everything he says to be so damn corny. I want to find the guy who wrote his dialoge and... well I haven't decided what exactly it is I'll do to him yet. but it will be painful.
On a less hateful note I do think that the multiplayer is pretty decent. The weapons are varied enough to have interesting combinations instead of the same gun used by everyone over and over and the vehicles are fun to use (though I do have issues regarding the fairness of the hornet and scorpion). Ignoring the tendency for the average xbox live gamer to be a right prick (which you'll get on most live games on xbox to some degree anyway), its generaly a fun game to play.
However there are better games out there

Edit: But Forge and Theatre were also both great ideas

Stubee:

Call me optimistic but I dont think thats true.

Then your easy to deceive

I don't post in forums very much (note my post count :D), but this thread is very interesting.

As far as single player goes, Halo 3 is standard. Where it shines is in multiplayer. I'm probably a little biased because I've done a lot of reading on how much work bungie put into playtesting everything. It's true, Halo 3 multiplayer is probably played mostly by 14 year olds and college frat boys, but if you can get past that it's a lot of fun.

Plus, the stat tracking, replays, and forge are really neat features. If you want to tune you ability to play and FPS, Bungie.net is a really good place to go.

Anyways, my real point is this:

Perhaps the reason forumers don't like Halo is that they aren't playing the multiplayer with friends. I can play for hours and hours if I've got the right group of 4 to 8 buddies together. What sorts of setting do we all play in?

Halo is like Final Fantasy for shooters. It was the first game of it's kind for some people so it gets treated as the quintissential FPS. For those of us who played other games first or have encountered other games Halo does not rise to that level.

I think youve got a very good idea of why its got such high ratings yet its so un loved by the masses. Ive got some what of an idea myself of why this has happend. Basically im speaking for myself HALO 1 was a great game and by far in my top ten games of all time but it lacked a online MP aspect to it. So then came along HALO 2 which was very similar to HALO but added some pretty dumb shit like dual weapons and such. but HALO 2 it self was a bit of a let down BUT it was a large sucsess beacause it had a online MP aspect which gave it an edge. Then came HALO 3 the most highly intisipated game to ever come out for the 360 HALO fans were jumping up and down for it, Then the day came where all shit rained down from the heavns HALO 3 had arrived. honestly it was a very big let down and A large peice of a micrsofts crap filled money pie. BUT it got huge ratings one of xbox 360s top rated games this is beacuase the halo fans are to fucking scared to admit that there so called fav game is just a pile of steaming crap. sorry for saying such a long thing to exsplain something so simple but i honestly hate halo 3 with passion. ( i rented for like 1 hour then went back to rogers and said my xbox was broken so i got a free rental. which i used to rent halo 1 )

Jezuz X:
I think youve got a very good idea of why its got such high ratings yet its so un loved by the masses. Ive got some what of an idea myself of why this has happend. Basically im speaking for myself HALO 1 was a great game and by far in my top ten games of all time but it lacked a online MP aspect to it. So then came along HALO 2 which was very similar to HALO but added some pretty dumb shit like dual weapons and such. but HALO 2 it self was a bit of a let down BUT it was a large sucsess beacause it had a online MP aspect which gave it an edge. Then came HALO 3 the most highly intisipated game to ever come out for the 360 HALO fans were jumping up and down for it, Then the day came where all shit rained down from the heavns HALO 3 had arrived. honestly it was a very big let down and A large peice of a micrsofts crap filled money pie. BUT it got huge ratings one of xbox 360s top rated games this is beacuase the halo fans are to fucking scared to admit that there so called fav game is just a pile of steaming crap. sorry for saying such a long thing to exsplain something so simple but i honestly hate halo 3 with passion. ( i rented for like 1 hour then went back to rogers and said my xbox was broken so i got a free rental. which i used to rent halo 1 )

[shields eyes] Attack of the bad grammar monster!

shadow skill:
Halo is like Final Fantasy for shooters. It was the first game of it's kind for some people so it gets treated as the quintissential FPS. For those of us who played other games first or have encountered other games Halo does not rise to that level.

QFT. Admittedly it did have some good ideas int the genre as a whole. I'm totally on board with the whole "not having to swap weapons to throw grenades" and "threshold-based health vs hitpoints" things. Halo is a solid game and I really cannot fault it for much other than not really aspiring to be anything more than that. It has good ideas and I respect that because I like good ideas in video games. Is it the best FPS series ever made? No.

6 words:
Fan boys
Casual gamers
10 year olds

the monopoly guy:
6 words:
Fan boys
Casual gamers
10 year olds

That is seven words not counting "6 words.":)

shadow skill:

the monopoly guy:
6 words:
Fan boys
Casual gamers
10 year olds

That is seven words not counting "6 words.":)

Not to mention it makes no sense on its own

Right, Halo.

I do hate Halo 3. I've never bought it. I've never PLAYED it, but I have played Halo 2 on multiplayer (online and offline), I've played a bit of Halo 2's single player, I've played Halo 1 offline on multiplayer as well. All I've done with Halo 3 is watch.

I don't actually own an X-Box or a 360 either, so those of you who DON'T play Halo will be intelligent enough to realise that I must have played on someone else's console.

Which is correct. My friend has a 360. If I'm over at his house, we play Halo 2 and Gears of War. If he's over at mine, we throw on MOH:Rising Sun, Dredd vs Death or Perfect Dark (I am still a firm believer that any FPS multiplayer without Bots isn't worth pissing on). If I'm not playing multiplayer over at my friends, he might be playing while I'm doing something else, like nicking his laptop to play Total Annihilation.

I hate Halo. I hate it for so many reasons. Namely:
> Bugs. The Halo series (Halo 2 in particular) is so fucking buggy that it has become an online sport to abuse the glitches in the game.
> X-Box Live. I don't think I ever took part in two consecutive games twat-free.
> The storyline is going down hill. Watching Halo 1 being played I considered it a passable shooter, one that if it came out on the PS2 I would probably own, play through over a weekend and then leave in my mountain of other games sandwiched between Firewarrior and Dredd vs Death. I would also feel justified in labelling anyone who preached this game as revolutionary a total cunt.
> Halo spawned Halo Fanboys.
> Dying to energy swords from halfway across THE FUCKING MAP!
> Watching people on Halo 3 spamming rockets / Spartan Laser.

I can understand why people buy the Halo games; most are passable, and even quite bad games (Viking) can be very fun if all you want is shallow violence and the ability to skip cutscenes, but you really do have to be a retarted shithead to think Halo 3 is anything special. You're probably a fanboy if you think it's above-average.

So, why is it popular? Well, because the people who buy it are retarded. There are still a lot of people out there who can actually read a gaming magazine with a straight face, and will actually believe whatever bullshit X-Box Monthly spoon-feeds them. I have already said that shallow gaming is fine, and if you honestly believe that an over-hyped game will be judged impartially by people who get fired if they slander the console's must-be-a-success title then your gaming probably wants the same depth as a pavement puddle.

Halo 3 was made for gamers with double-digit IQs, Fanboys and for people who buy the Hype. THAT is why it sells despite being such a piss-poor game.

shadow skill:
Halo is like Final Fantasy for shooters. It was the first game of it's kind for some people so it gets treated as the quintissential FPS. For those of us who played other games first or have encountered other games Halo does not rise to that level.

The hell? How is Halo the FF of shooters? DOOM is the FF of shooters! Christ, just about every FPS between Doom and Goldeneye was called a "Doom Clone", that's how bloody amazing Doom was!

Final Fantasy 7 was a really great game. The whole series are great games. I've played all manner of RPGs, including the "Phantasy Star" series, which is supposedly SEGA's answer to Final Fantasy. It's not. Final Fantasy blows all opposition out of the water... or, at least, it did prior to 11 and 12, when it became a WoW clone.

The world would have been a better place if Halo and Duke Nukem switched places - all we'd get from Halo Fanboys is "Halo 2: Master Chief Forever is going to ROCK when it comes out... some day..."

I think one of the big factors is that forum-dwellers are more likely to have computer FPS experience, and computers have developed FPS games... better than consoles have.

I play Halo 3 quite a lot. Never by myself. I have friends that all play it regularly; it's a social point for us. These friends aren't really hardcore gamers. It's also the main reason I bought Soul Calibur 4.

Wargamer:
Right, Halo.

remainder of blithering, frankly insulting, drivel elided

Thank you for proving my point.

-- Steve

Wargamer:
Right, Halo.

I do hate Halo 3. I've never bought it. I've never PLAYED it, but I have played Halo 2 on multiplayer (online and offline), I've played a bit of Halo 2's single player, I've played Halo 1 offline on multiplayer as well. All I've done with Halo 3 is watch.

I don't actually own an X-Box or a 360 either, so those of you who DON'T play Halo will be intelligent enough to realise that I must have played on someone else's console.

Which is correct. My friend has a 360. If I'm over at his house, we play Halo 2 and Gears of War. If he's over at mine, we throw on MOH:Rising Sun, Dredd vs Death or Perfect Dark (I am still a firm believer that any FPS multiplayer without Bots isn't worth pissing on). If I'm not playing multiplayer over at my friends, he might be playing while I'm doing something else, like nicking his laptop to play Total Annihilation.

I hate Halo. I hate it for so many reasons. Namely:
> Bugs. The Halo series (Halo 2 in particular) is so fucking buggy that it has become an online sport to abuse the glitches in the game.
> X-Box Live. I don't think I ever took part in two consecutive games twat-free.
> The storyline is going down hill. Watching Halo 1 being played I considered it a passable shooter, one that if it came out on the PS2 I would probably own, play through over a weekend and then leave in my mountain of other games sandwiched between Firewarrior and Dredd vs Death. I would also feel justified in labelling anyone who preached this game as revolutionary a total cunt.
> Halo spawned Halo Fanboys.
> Dying to energy swords from halfway across THE FUCKING MAP!
> Watching people on Halo 3 spamming rockets / Spartan Laser.

I can understand why people buy the Halo games; most are passable, and even quite bad games (Viking) can be very fun if all you want is shallow violence and the ability to skip cutscenes, but you really do have to be a retarted shithead to think Halo 3 is anything special. You're probably a fanboy if you think it's above-average.

So, why is it popular? Well, because the people who buy it are retarded. There are still a lot of people out there who can actually read a gaming magazine with a straight face, and will actually believe whatever bullshit X-Box Monthly spoon-feeds them. I have already said that shallow gaming is fine, and if you honestly believe that an over-hyped game will be judged impartially by people who get fired if they slander the console's must-be-a-success title then your gaming probably wants the same depth as a pavement puddle.

Halo 3 was made for gamers with double-digit IQs, Fanboys and for people who buy the Hype. THAT is why it sells despite being such a piss-poor game.

Someone lost a nutjob? We've got a seething angry nutjob going spare here. Anyone?

The majority of people who play Halo 3 are casual gamers that could give a dam about internet forums or reviews, they just play it pecause its a fun game thats easy to just pick up and play

Wargamer:
Right, Halo.

I do hate Halo 3. I've never bought it. I've never PLAYED it, but I have played Halo 2 on multiplayer (online and offline), I've played a bit of Halo 2's single player, I've played Halo 1 offline on multiplayer as well. All I've done with Halo 3 is watch.

I don't actually own an X-Box or a 360 either, so those of you who DON'T play Halo will be intelligent enough to realise that I must have played on someone else's console.

Which is correct. My friend has a 360. If I'm over at his house, we play Halo 2 and Gears of War. If he's over at mine, we throw on MOH:Rising Sun, Dredd vs Death or Perfect Dark (I am still a firm believer that any FPS multiplayer without Bots isn't worth pissing on). If I'm not playing multiplayer over at my friends, he might be playing while I'm doing something else, like nicking his laptop to play Total Annihilation.

I hate Halo. I hate it for so many reasons. Namely:
> Bugs. The Halo series (Halo 2 in particular) is so fucking buggy that it has become an online sport to abuse the glitches in the game.
> X-Box Live. I don't think I ever took part in two consecutive games twat-free.
> The storyline is going down hill. Watching Halo 1 being played I considered it a passable shooter, one that if it came out on the PS2 I would probably own, play through over a weekend and then leave in my mountain of other games sandwiched between Firewarrior and Dredd vs Death. I would also feel justified in labelling anyone who preached this game as revolutionary a total cunt.
> Halo spawned Halo Fanboys.
> Dying to energy swords from halfway across THE FUCKING MAP!
> Watching people on Halo 3 spamming rockets / Spartan Laser.

I can understand why people buy the Halo games; most are passable, and even quite bad games (Viking) can be very fun if all you want is shallow violence and the ability to skip cutscenes, but you really do have to be a retarted shithead to think Halo 3 is anything special. You're probably a fanboy if you think it's above-average.

So, why is it popular? Well, because the people who buy it are retarded. There are still a lot of people out there who can actually read a gaming magazine with a straight face, and will actually believe whatever bullshit X-Box Monthly spoon-feeds them. I have already said that shallow gaming is fine, and if you honestly believe that an over-hyped game will be judged impartially by people who get fired if they slander the console's must-be-a-success title then your gaming probably wants the same depth as a pavement puddle.

Halo 3 was made for gamers with double-digit IQs, Fanboys and for people who buy the Hype. THAT is why it sells despite being such a piss-poor game.

you have fun clinging to your false sense of superiority

Anton P. Nym:

Wargamer:
Right, Halo.

remainder of blithering, frankly insulting, drivel elided

Thank you for proving my point.

-- Steve

It's been a long time I have seen such a condensed amount of Fail in one area. This could be at toxic levels, not safe for those around. I think we will have to evacuate this thread and have it gassed. It should be off limits until further notice.

PS: One reason why I hate Halo. It created inept Halo Haters.

by the sounds of it you wern't playing online and that's what all the hype is about most people agree that the campaign in 3 is crappy but all they obsess about is the online is why people make it out to be like the greatest game ever, i honesty think that its not that good its just takes almost no challenge and its not that fun its almost alwase who ever gets the ''whore'' weapons first will win a match or if its a game with all ARs and BRs nothing on the map that can be kinda fun unless your playing with someone who has perfect aim because they have been playing since it came out and kill you almost instantly as they see you with the BR. hell now im just ranting. all and all i think that halo is a good game but online its only fun if u get a good game or if your are split screning with friends or system linking