This is a response to Richard Groovy Pants. I must disagree that leveling isn't a reward in RPG's. Why would there even be one if you didn't? I liked to just go exploring yes, but because it was furthering that little bar in the bottom right corner, so I could get more Small Guns skill points, and another neat Perk. I wanted to raise the level cap so I could get more of them sweet sweet Perks. Being the biggest strongest badass in the entirety of the Wasteland is the best.
I just explore for the sake of exploring myself. Levelling up is actually something I care very little about when wandering the wasteland. To each his own of course :)
spazzattack: This is a response to Richard Groovy Pants. I must disagree that leveling isn't a reward in RPG's.
I never said it wasn't. I said it isn't the best reward you can get specifically from Fallout 3 :).
Why would there even be one if you didn't? I liked to just go exploring yes, but because it was furthering that little bar in the bottom right corner, so I could get more Small Guns skill points, and another neat Perk. I wanted to raise the level cap so I could get more of them sweet sweet Perks. Being the biggest strongest badass in the entirety of the Wasteland is the best.
Good, good, and you're entitled to enjoy it like you want to, what I was saying though is that in Fallout 3 you shouldn't put goals like getting XP in your mind otherwise you won't enjoy the game to the fullest, in my opinion.
Anton P. Nym: I find Dogmeat's "Find" feature useful, if only because in the mad frenzy of combat I sometimes lose track of where all the bodies have fallen. Tall grass is my bane...
Yeah--it happens in a lot of games with great graphics, and ESPECIALLY in F3: it's like everyone that dies first covers themselves up with one of those Elven Cloaks from Lord of the Rings, and when I go looking for dead bodies I feel like those guys right outside the Black Gate when Frodo and Sam are beneath the cloak that makes them look like a big rock.
I guess it also doesn't help that the um, 'profile' of the human being may be a bit...'camouflaged'...when you've got someone's leg facing the wrong way and sitting next to their shoulder...
Not that it isn't awesome to see that--my best 'F3 gore' story so far is shooting a raider's head off during a fight on the really high overpass near Vault 101, and getting to see the head drop down a couple dozen feet through the air before it returned me to the game.
Either that or blowing off a deathclaw's head, and being able to distinguish the spinal cord and the esophagus.
DeathQuaker: Anton P. Nym is right--there are a lot of ways to enjoy Fallout--that's the kind of game it is that different people will get different things out if it.
...
Because yes, the leveling aspect IS weak in the game. It's just not what the game is for.
...
I don't really care much about the XP, I just like turning over every rock and seeing what's there--because usually, there is something interesting to me, even if it's not something I can add to my inventory.
Yeah, if there's one thing I wish, it's that the Perks made the game play differently. For the most part they don't, and a lot of the economic ones come too late to be useful.
The only issue I have with the level cap is that it makes me want to start over rather than play a maxed-out character. Which...isn't necessarily a bad thing! I kinda like that the game says 'hey--this is the maximum level you'll need to finish the game, so, if you want to finish it and start over and play a different character, here's a good time to do that'
In fact, I'm trying not to discover anymore of the game, to save as much new stuff as possible for a replay. Sometimes, the game almost feels like a road trip--you get all your weapons repaired, buy some supplies, and step outside Megaton, set your maker for a patch of unexplored territory, and GO!
In fact, one of the best parts of the game so far is finding the next part of the main quest while just exploring--made the game feel very organic and natural.
Also, anyone find the Ripper to be rather unsatisfying, I really figured it would be much better, but it really kinda sucks.
Yeah--not satisfying at all. Feels more like when your hedge clipper bites on a thick branch and you have to rock it back and forth to get it unstuck as opposed to the motorized carving knife of death I was expecting.
Cheeze_Pavilion: Yeah--it happens in a lot of games with great graphics, and ESPECIALLY in F3: it's like everyone that dies first covers themselves up with one of those Elven Cloaks from Lord of the Rings, and when I go looking for dead bodies I feel like those guys right outside the Black Gate when Frodo and Sam are beneath the cloak that makes them look like a big rock.
If you're on the PC, you can use the console command "tg" to turn grass on or off in an instant. Works well if you can't find bodies (though a bit more useful in Oblivion, if only because there's more grass).
It just occurred to me how much of the game I still haven't seen, despite spending so much time; I haven't seen one Regulator, I haven't been to Dunwich, I haven't been back to Canterbury since cleaning up the town so I bet I haven't seen a lot of the caravaners... if there are any working FEV vats, I haven't found them yet either. (Where are all those Supermutants coming from? They can't all be from Vault 87, can they?)
spazzattack: This is a response to Richard Groovy Pants. I must disagree that leveling isn't a reward in RPG's.
I never said it wasn't. I said it isn't the best reward you can get specifically from Fallout 3 :).
Why would there even be one if you didn't? I liked to just go exploring yes, but because it was furthering that little bar in the bottom right corner, so I could get more Small Guns skill points, and another neat Perk. I wanted to raise the level cap so I could get more of them sweet sweet Perks. Being the biggest strongest badass in the entirety of the Wasteland is the best.
Good, good, and you're entitled to enjoy it like you want to, what I was saying though is that in Fallout 3 you shouldn't put goals like getting XP in your mind otherwise you won't enjoy the game to the fullest, in my opinion.
I kind of see what he means. I use leveling up as a way of getting to the skills I need to get through an are easier. For example, I can not complete the stealing independence quest with all those damn sentry bots around, especially since I have killed practally every single person(nix quest givers) in the game and can no longer buy stimpacks. So I am right now grinding like crazy to reach the 20th level so I can get the 67 science skill I need to pass that one door in the secure wing. I'm just sad the cap is so low, I really do want more of the perks they offer and I just cant get them now. Its like dangling multiple carrots in front of my face, I can get some, but the other delicious treats are forever gone. It does niccely emphasize choice, however.
spazzattack: This is a response to Richard Groovy Pants. I must disagree that leveling isn't a reward in RPG's.
I never said it wasn't. I said it isn't the best reward you can get specifically from Fallout 3 :).
Why would there even be one if you didn't? I liked to just go exploring yes, but because it was furthering that little bar in the bottom right corner, so I could get more Small Guns skill points, and another neat Perk. I wanted to raise the level cap so I could get more of them sweet sweet Perks. Being the biggest strongest badass in the entirety of the Wasteland is the best.
Good, good, and you're entitled to enjoy it like you want to, what I was saying though is that in Fallout 3 you shouldn't put goals like getting XP in your mind otherwise you won't enjoy the game to the fullest, in my opinion.
I kind of see what he means. I use leveling up as a way of getting to the skills I need to get through an are easier. For example, I can not complete the stealing independence quest with all those damn sentry bots around, especially since I have killed practally every single person(nix quest givers) in the game and can no longer buy stimpacks. So I am right now grinding like crazy to reach the 20th level so I can get the 67 science skill I need to pass that one door in the secure wing. I'm just sad the cap is so low, I really do want more of the perks they offer and I just cant get them now. Its like dangling multiple carrots in front of my face, I can get some, but the other delicious treats are forever gone. It does niccely emphasize choice, however.
It's called balance, if you had access to all the perks you'd be overpowered (if you aren't already with all the stimpacks and ammo at your disposal). Just play on easy for a while.
jamesc: So I am right now grinding like crazy to reach the 20th level so I can get the 67 science skill I need to pass that one door in the secure wing.
Don't forget about bobbleheads, science books, and labcoats (especially Lesko's).
Richard Groovy Pants: It's called balance, if you had access to all the perks you'd be overpowered (if you aren't already with all the stimpacks and ammo at your disposal). Just play on easy for a while.
This is a single player game so why the hell should we be concerned with the character being overpowered? There's one protaganist (with a couple of crap-tacular NPC's if you're lucky) verus a ridiculous number of enemies who felt overpowered, allowing ourselves to become the equivilant of a one man leigon is hardly a problem.
I'll agree that there was an abundance of ammo in the game but stimpacks might as well come with a certificate of authentication given how hard they are to come by.
Richard Groovy Pants: It's called balance, if you had access to all the perks you'd be overpowered (if you aren't already with all the stimpacks and ammo at your disposal). Just play on easy for a while.
This is a single player game so why the hell should we be concerned with the character being overpowered? There's one protaganist (with a couple of crap-tacular NPC's if you're lucky) verus a ridiculous number of enemies who felt overpowered, allowing ourselves to become the equivilant of a one man leigon is hardly a problem.
I'll agree that there was an abundance of ammo in the game but stimpacks might as well come with a certificate of authentication given how hard they are to come by.
Because of something called challenge. And what enemies were overpowered? The running forward dumb AI Deathclaw, the 1-shot pulse grenade sentry robot or the I-Always-Get-Stuck-On-A-Rock Behemoth? Also I ended the main quest with 97 stimpacks, on Very Hard.
Richard Groovy Pants: It's called balance, if you had access to all the perks you'd be overpowered (if you aren't already with all the stimpacks and ammo at your disposal). Just play on easy for a while.
This is a single player game so why the hell should we be concerned with the character being overpowered? There's one protaganist (with a couple of crap-tacular NPC's if you're lucky) verus a ridiculous number of enemies who felt overpowered, allowing ourselves to become the equivilant of a one man leigon is hardly a problem.
I'll agree that there was an abundance of ammo in the game but stimpacks might as well come with a certificate of authentication given how hard they are to come by.
Because of something called challenge. And what enemies were overpowered? The running forward dumb AI Deathclaw, the 1-shot pulse grenade sentry robot or the I-Always-Get-Stuck-On-A-Rock Behemoth? Also I ended the main quest with 97 stimpacks, on Very Hard.
The Stimpack situation in the game is one of some controversy, as if you have enough Stimpacks and can hit the Tab button fast enough, you're invincible. With some medium/moderate/heavy scavenging you can easily get +100 by the time you're running down to Rivet City (on Very Hard I might add). Some mods have added weight to them, some make you spend AP to use them, but in all honesty....I think it'll probably be best to take away the SUDDEN PAUSE that the PipBoy gives to the player.
MAKE people use your weapon quickslots in combat and to fumble around when they remember that handy grenade they picked up earlier... DON'T let people mysteriously change their entire clothing instantaneously just before a Deathclaw starts chomping down. DON'T make Stimpacks magical items that instantly heal the player the second the needle touches their skin. DON'T suddenly pause the game in a huge gunfight, simply because the player wants to check his map and see if they accidentally went North instead of South. DON'T suddenly pause the effects of radiation while standing in green sludge, simply because the player wants to count how many Rads they have. ESPECIALLY DON'T let the player repair weapons while a Raider is standing 20cm away swinging towards the player with a Power Fist.
I relatively despised it in Oblivion, and I sure as hell despise it in Fallout 3. For VATS its understandable, as the only action you can take in VATS is to choose your targets. You can't suddenly put on armor in VATS or check the map, so here is a good example of where it's reasonable.
Instant pause while still taking tactile in-game actions however, is not good. Not good at all...
Richard Groovy Pants: It's called balance, if you had access to all the perks you'd be overpowered (if you aren't already with all the stimpacks and ammo at your disposal). Just play on easy for a while.
This is a single player game so why the hell should we be concerned with the character being overpowered? There's one protaganist (with a couple of crap-tacular NPC's if you're lucky) verus a ridiculous number of enemies who felt overpowered, allowing ourselves to become the equivilant of a one man leigon is hardly a problem.
I'll agree that there was an abundance of ammo in the game but stimpacks might as well come with a certificate of authentication given how hard they are to come by.
Because of something called challenge. And what enemies were overpowered? The running forward dumb AI Deathclaw, the 1-shot pulse grenade sentry robot or the I-Always-Get-Stuck-On-A-Rock Behemoth? Also I ended the main quest with 97 stimpacks, on Very Hard.
Yeah I was never short of stimpacks either. Possibly because I never ignore any opportunity to steal or buy them.
And they were overpowered. until you got to say lvl 10 or so. before that I had to avoid most fights. After that? with a combat shotgun? forget about it.
And they were overpowered. until you got to say lvl 10 or so. before that I had to avoid most fights. After that? with a combat shotgun? forget about it.
Yeah, I agree--the difficulty has a cliff, in that once you get past a certain point you can basically just buy/repair your way through the rest of the game. I think I have like, 20 Assault Rifles sitting back at my place. The game was a little more...fun when trying to head out to a discover a new location, I'd meet up with some Raiders and I'd have to head back to town to sell their stuff to replace the Stimpacks and Ammo I'd used up fighting them.
Not that the game isn't still incredibly fun, just, at this point I'm basically a juggernaut. Maybe they should just make Stimpacks incredibly rare in the world so you'll only use them in combat and you'd really think about heading back to a Clinic/Bed for healing outside of combat, or making everything in the game count as encumbrance so you'd have to make a choice about how much about ammo and aid to bring along.
Still though, heck of a lot of fun. Especially figuring out how to fight the different enemies, like the Deathclaw--I like how there are all different tactics that it's up to you to discover for each enemy.
Anyone fought a Nukalurk yet? Glowing Crabs FTW! There's also a really beautiful and odd sight, it's a flooded shipping plant, but instead of being flooded with water, it's flooded with Nuka Cola Quantum.
My life in the Wasteland (using several realism mods): As soon as I made it out of Vault 101, I noticed my map marker was pointing to the south-east. So I went to the north-west, the EXACT opposite direction of where the main quest wanted me to go. Soon, I found a small white trailer in a gulley which became my 'base of operations'. Soon, I'm going to move, although I don't know where to...
Bah! The Terrible Shotgun, plus level 80 Small Guns, Sniper perk and Commando perk, makes any shot from VATS an Insta-kill. I only need a dozen shots to down a friggin' behemoth for christ's sake. But that might be because Clover and Charon (shotgun tag team!) ate its face off first.
We are an incredible shotgun team. Charon snipes at the enemy, while I back him up in the middle, before Clover wades into them with a Sawed-Off. Loverly!
fish food carl: Bah! The Terrible Shotgun, plus level 80 Small Guns, Sniper perk and Commando perk, makes any shot from VATS an Insta-kill. I only need a dozen shots to down a friggin' behemoth for christ's sake. But that might be because Clover and Charon (shotgun tag team!) ate its face off first.
We are an incredible shotgun team. Charon snipes at the enemy, while I back him up in the middle, before Clover wades into them with a Sawed-Off. Loverly!
I love the Terrible Shotgun. BOOM - exploding head gibs - glorious...
Awhile ago I found a harmonica in some random place. I like to think that my character has taught himself how to play it. So the next time you're wandering in the Wasteland and you hear a mournful tune on the wind, you'll know who it is ;D
Aro2220: this game would have been better if it was multiplayer. even with 3 other players...that would have been so amazing.
I'm not sure how great that would've been, it's an RPG and unless they expanded the world, it wouldn't be that much fun.
Also, anyone think Bethesda should stop making the Elder Scrolls MMO and start making a Fallout MMO? It could be set across the entire united states! EDIT: Damn, Probation! Whatever, I wasn't eligible for the Morpheus Badge anyway, and at least it's not a ban!
Spartan Bannana: Anyone fought a Nukalurk yet? Glowing Crabs FTW! There's also a really beautiful and odd sight, it's a flooded shipping plant, but instead of being flooded with water, it's flooded with Nuka Cola Quantum.
Please, don't make me relive memories of the Nukalurks. I had no Stimpaks left, my Combat Shotgun was nearly broken, my left leg was crippled, and I was in the middle of the Nuka-Cola Factory... I survived by drinking from leaking water and had to use a 10mm pistol to fend off their stabby claw attacks.
Aro2220: this game would have been better if it was multiplayer. even with 3 other players...that would have been so amazing.
I'm not sure how great that would've been, it's an RPG and unless they expanded the world, it wouldn't be that much fun.
Also, anyone think Bethesda should stop making the Elder Scrolls MMO and start making a Fallout MMO? It could be set across the entire united states! EDIT: Damn, Probation! Whatever, I wasn't eligible for the Morpheus Badge anyway, and at least it's not a ban!
I don't think I am getting the same experience as other people in this game, I play the game through on Very Hard and of course I level very quickly though I still slaughter everything in my wake. Fallout 3 loses the feel of retreating that the originals had.
Dommyboy: I don't think I am getting the same experience as other people in this game, I play the game through on Very Hard and of course I level very quickly though I still slaughter everything in my wake. Fallout 3 loses the feel of retreating that the originals had.
Hey the game can pre really hard if everybody you need to talk to in megaton keeps falling from the sky onto the bomb!
No really half the town is dead and its not funny anymore, I play on 360 so I can't bring back the dead.
Oh and the best balance between geting high XP and having a chalange is "hard" but if you're any good with games it doesn't help much.
spazzattack: This is a response to Richard Groovy Pants. I must disagree that leveling isn't a reward in RPG's.
I never said it wasn't. I said it isn't the best reward you can get specifically from Fallout 3 :).
Why would there even be one if you didn't? I liked to just go exploring yes, but because it was furthering that little bar in the bottom right corner, so I could get more Small Guns skill points, and another neat Perk. I wanted to raise the level cap so I could get more of them sweet sweet Perks. Being the biggest strongest badass in the entirety of the Wasteland is the best.
Good, good, and you're entitled to enjoy it like you want to, what I was saying though is that in Fallout 3 you shouldn't put goals like getting XP in your mind otherwise you won't enjoy the game to the fullest, in my opinion.
I think a mix of both is good. I liked exploring, but when a rad scorpian or raiders showed up, I was all "yay! more XP!" I just wish it didn't stop at 20!
Richard Groovy Pants: Wow, you're the first person to say something like that. This isn't a mmorpg, leveling isn't the 'reward' it's exploring. Be honest have you found every location yet? Have you done every side quest after finishing the main quest? I'm pretty sure you haven't because you missed the point of Fallout 3 and the TES series, was Oblivion 'reward' the leveling system?
Not every area is created equal. For some players, levels and loot compensate for the boring ones: when you're going through something samey and tedious like yet another Metro tunnel or yet another factory sparsely populated with weak-ass Protectrons, the game's other rewards make you feel like you're accomplishing something even when the area you're in right now is on the lame side.
I usually don't care for levels and all that jazz (in most cases, I actively hate them) but I noticed that, once I gaining abilities and new gear became irrelevant, I was significantly more sensitive to how novel or samey a particular area of Fallout 3 happened to be. Right now I've fallen into a pattern of playing for an hour or two until I get to a location that I don't find to be particularly interesting, at which point I set aside the game for tomorrow.
I would like the level capped jumped to 50 like in Oblivion-(yes I am aware of the prison cheat)and some harder enemies to go with it, I'm thinking of Talon missile crews.
corporate_gamer: could anyone else get stopped from fixing the robots at big town. I had to kill those super-mutants, and the idiot children got all gunned down. was well annoying.
Yeah, that's quite a common bug.
I just whipped up a minefield on the road they come in on and stood on the end of the bridge with a minigun. Makes short work of them.
I saved Big Town, then, (being the psycho mofo that I am), I massacred and looted the town. After enslaving Red, of course.
My evil guy is actually just how I wanted to play the game, and I love it! I slaughtered the occupants of tenpenny, and looted a good 6000 caps worth of loot. Remember saying I was always poor? Not anymore. I'm sitting on 12,000 caps. Perhaps because I pick up everything, and I only use two weapons.
Richard Groovy Pants: It's called balance, if you had access to all the perks you'd be overpowered (if you aren't already with all the stimpacks and ammo at your disposal). Just play on easy for a while.
This is a single player game so why the hell should we be concerned with the character being overpowered? There's one protaganist (with a couple of crap-tacular NPC's if you're lucky) verus a ridiculous number of enemies who felt overpowered, allowing ourselves to become the equivilant of a one man leigon is hardly a problem.
I'll agree that there was an abundance of ammo in the game but stimpacks might as well come with a certificate of authentication given how hard they are to come by.
Because of something called challenge. And what enemies were overpowered? The running forward dumb AI Deathclaw, the 1-shot pulse grenade sentry robot or the I-Always-Get-Stuck-On-A-Rock Behemoth? Also I ended the main quest with 97 stimpacks, on Very Hard.
The Stimpack situation in the game is one of some controversy, as if you have enough Stimpacks and can hit the Tab button fast enough, you're invincible. With some medium/moderate/heavy scavenging you can easily get +100 by the time you're running down to Rivet City (on Very Hard I might add). Some mods have added weight to them, some make you spend AP to use them, but in all honesty....I think it'll probably be best to take away the SUDDEN PAUSE that the PipBoy gives to the player.
MAKE people use your weapon quickslots in combat and to fumble around when they remember that handy grenade they picked up earlier... DON'T let people mysteriously change their entire clothing instantaneously just before a Deathclaw starts chomping down. DON'T make Stimpacks magical items that instantly heal the player the second the needle touches their skin. DON'T suddenly pause the game in a huge gunfight, simply because the player wants to check his map and see if they accidentally went North instead of South. DON'T suddenly pause the effects of radiation while standing in green sludge, simply because the player wants to count how many Rads they have. ESPECIALLY DON'T let the player repair weapons while a Raider is standing 20cm away swinging towards the player with a Power Fist.
I relatively despised it in Oblivion, and I sure as hell despise it in Fallout 3. For VATS its understandable, as the only action you can take in VATS is to choose your targets. You can't suddenly put on armor in VATS or check the map, so here is a good example of where it's reasonable.
Instant pause while still taking tactile in-game actions however, is not good. Not good at all...
are you kidding? the PIP-BOY is supposed to do exactly that, by which I mean give a pause to collect yourself. plus, if it was real time, you'd die a lot more, because the game is crawling with enemies? plus the only time you ever REALLY NEED to use the thing is when you just got shot in the face and need a breather and a stimpak. It's been like that in pretty much every RPG ever, and it hasn't been taken out yet, so it must serve some sort of useful purpose. plus, if you really want to do that, just don't let yourself use the PIP-BOY in combat. I suppose i just like having it there to save my sorry ass.
are you kidding? the PIP-BOY is supposed to do exactly that, by which I mean give a pause to collect yourself. plus, if it was real time, you'd die a lot more, because the game is crawling with enemies? plus the only time you ever REALLY NEED to use the thing is when you just got shot in the face and need a breather and a stimpak. It's been like that in pretty much every RPG ever, and it hasn't been taken out yet, so it must serve some sort of useful purpose. plus, if you really want to do that, just don't let yourself use the PIP-BOY in combat. I suppose i just like having it there to save my sorry ass.
I wasn't kidding I'm afraid. It just feels as if it is a rather 'easy' mechanic in the game. If you need to use the Pip-Boy, why aren't there any consequences to it? It gives arise to the whole 'Enough Stimpacks = Invincibility-Mode' problem that has been discussed before.
Yes people could just chose not to use it...but what if I WANT to change weapons to a frag-grenade (that hasn't been given a shortcut) in combat? Just open it, close it and then sit there a few seconds to simulate it? (I know that 'I WANT' from anyone doesn't mean it should be implemented into a game. Hell, sometimes it's best to constrict things that'll make it too complex. Doesn't mean we can't dislike it however)
The Baldur's Gate saga did something that works well. You can pause the game to issue commands, tell them to use this quick-slot item, etcetc, but when you go into your inventory...BAM, the Pause is off. They also limited changing armour while in combat. Putting on a suit of Full Plate, or messing around with those fiddly little clips for your Power Armour should take some time, along with rummaging around in a backpack.
Sure have it as a difficulty toggle, or only in Very Hard. I can see why lots of people like this feature, ESPECIALLY through the first few playthroughs. I must admit it has saved my sorry ass multiple times. But now people are beginning to want more of a challenge from it, it really is a 'breather' that just gives you too much. The Esc menu gives you a breather, but it doesn't allow you to take drastic in-game actions. You can collect your thoughts, then head back into the fray knowing what you want to do.
The 'useful purpose' of this pause is quite possibly to make it easier and less frustrating for Inventory management, which is understandable. As Fallout 3 is easy-ish though, I hope an pause-disable for the Pip-Boy mod can be made with the GECK, as I think it'll add not only difficulty, but also a dash of 'realism' to it. (Unless the Pip-Boy 3000 version is a time-machine. THEN that'll be kinda understandable. And awesome.)
This is a response to Richard Groovy Pants. I must disagree that leveling isn't a reward in RPG's. Why would there even be one if you didn't? I liked to just go exploring yes, but because it was furthering that little bar in the bottom right corner, so I could get more Small Guns skill points, and another neat Perk. I wanted to raise the level cap so I could get more of them sweet sweet Perks. Being the biggest strongest badass in the entirety of the Wasteland is the best.