Having read through this, I just want to say two things.
Number one: The Final Fantasy series is generally fine, in my opinion. They're not my favorite jRPG series(MegaTen for that, kthx), but they get the job done. They usually do things a little differently in each game, and are always trying something out. I'm not a huge fan, but I'll make time in my schedule to play one.
Number two: I think most of the FF hate comes from 'It's popular, now it sucks'. This doesn't mean the game is perfect, but there's a backlash that pops up against popular things and FF is consistently popular. The rest is 'they changed it, now it sucks.' Most of the ideas to 'save' FF would make it considerably worse. Why? Because it's all 'I WANT FF4/5/6 AGAIN'. No. Stop it. Enjoy the older games for what they were. Enjoy the newer games for what they are. If you don't like it, fine. Awesome. Your call. But don't hate it because it's not the exact same thing they were doing six games ago.
To save the Final Fantasy series, they need to go almost bankrupt with only enough money to make one more game and for it to be bomb sales-wise but not necessarily gameplay/story-wise. Basically, it needs to END and to end well.
waffletaco: To save the Final Fantasy series, they need to go almost bankrupt with only enough money to make one more game and for it to be bomb sales-wise but not necessarily gameplay/story-wise. Basically, it needs to END and to end well.
So it needs to be a game that's unpopular enough for you to like it and still be cool?
waffletaco: To save the Final Fantasy series, they need to go almost bankrupt with only enough money to make one more game and for it to be bomb sales-wise but not necessarily gameplay/story-wise. Basically, it needs to END and to end well.
So it needs to be a game that's unpopular enough for you to like it and still be cool?
Plenty of people can like it. I just want SE to think it's a bad idea to make another one and to move on.
waffletaco: To save the Final Fantasy series, they need to go almost bankrupt with only enough money to make one more game and for it to be bomb sales-wise but not necessarily gameplay/story-wise. Basically, it needs to END and to end well.
So it needs to be a game that's unpopular enough for you to like it and still be cool?
Plenty of people can like it. I just want SE to think it's a bad idea to make another one and to move on.
It'll take more than one doing poorly to make Squeenix stop making the games. It's their flagship product.
Personally, one of the reasons I like the FF games is because it lets them mess about with all of their side projects. Though I still want Einhander 2.
waffletaco: To save the Final Fantasy series, they need to go almost bankrupt with only enough money to make one more game and for it to be bomb sales-wise but not necessarily gameplay/story-wise. Basically, it needs to END and to end well.
So it needs to be a game that's unpopular enough for you to like it and still be cool?
Plenty of people can like it. I just want SE to think it's a bad idea to make another one and to move on.
It'll take more than one doing poorly to make Squeenix stop making the games. It's their flagship product.
Personally, one of the reasons I like the FF games is because it lets them mess about with all of their side projects. Though I still want Einhander 2.
See, I want Einhander 2 too! It's like they abandon anything for a surefire quick buck. I said the quoted thing above because I would hope that when they abandon their flagship product, they would return to forgotten gems or create something else.
waffletaco: To save the Final Fantasy series, they need to go almost bankrupt with only enough money to make one more game and for it to be bomb sales-wise but not necessarily gameplay/story-wise. Basically, it needs to END and to end well.
So it needs to be a game that's unpopular enough for you to like it and still be cool?
Plenty of people can like it. I just want SE to think it's a bad idea to make another one and to move on.
So you want the series to Fail.
Well at least it's better than "I wanna save the successful series!" From what? Success?
As a question do you play Final Fantasy? if not, then honestly why do you care? If so whats to stop them from making more JRPG's just not with the name Final Fantasy, they could have done that with any of them because (GASP) THERE NOT SEQUELS! So basically you want a Company to FIRE people you don't like. You want the company to suffer and people to lose their jobs over you not liking the Name Final Fantasy.
Think about it people. will be no different if they change the name to something else. They are NOT Sequels. They are individual games that stand alone. And there is such potential for growth and so many people want to FUCK with that potential out of being nostalgia ridden idiots who think they know business.
You don't know business you don't know whats good for the company or for gaming. You are selfish immature BRATS.
waffletaco: To save the Final Fantasy series, they need to go almost bankrupt with only enough money to make one more game and for it to be bomb sales-wise but not necessarily gameplay/story-wise. Basically, it needs to END and to end well.
So it needs to be a game that's unpopular enough for you to like it and still be cool?
Plenty of people can like it. I just want SE to think it's a bad idea to make another one and to move on.
It'll take more than one doing poorly to make Squeenix stop making the games. It's their flagship product.
Personally, one of the reasons I like the FF games is because it lets them mess about with all of their side projects. Though I still want Einhander 2.
See, I want Einhander 2 too! It's like they abandon anything for a surefire quick buck. I said the quoted thing above because I would hope that when they abandon their flagship product, they would return to forgotten gems or create something else.
Suddenly, I like you much more. Not that I'd actually formed an opinion on you yet, since I won't do that over one post. But anyone who wants Einhander 2 and isn't a total jerk is fine with me!
waffletaco: To save the Final Fantasy series, they need to go almost bankrupt with only enough money to make one more game and for it to be bomb sales-wise but not necessarily gameplay/story-wise. Basically, it needs to END and to end well.
So it needs to be a game that's unpopular enough for you to like it and still be cool?
Plenty of people can like it. I just want SE to think it's a bad idea to make another one and to move on.
So you want the series to Fail.
Well at least it's better than "I wanna save the successful series!" From what? Success?
As a question do you play Final Fantasy? if not, then honestly why do you care? If so whats to stop them from making more JRPG's just not with the name Final Fantasy, they could have done that with any of them because (GASP) THERE NOT SEQUELS! So basically you want a Company to FIRE people you don't like. You want the company to suffer and people to lose their jobs over you not liking the Name Final Fantasy.
Think about it people. will be no different if they change the name to something else. They are NOT Sequels. They are individual games that stand alone. And there is such potential for growth and so many people want to FUCK with that potential out of being nostalgia ridden idiots who think they know business.
You don't know business you don't know whats good for the company or for gaming. You are selfish immature BRATS.
Well first off, I'll admit I haven't played a final fantasy game since X-2, but I will say that I am looking forward to XIII. I haven't turned my back on the series but I'm not asking for a brand spankin new jrpg by SE but with a different name; I'm asking for a new genre for them to tackle or something like Einhander 2.
Well first off, I'll admit I haven't played a final fantasy game since X-2, but I will say that I am looking forward to XIII. I haven't turned my back on the series but I'm not asking for a brand spankin new jrpg by SE but with a different name; I'm asking for a new genre for them to tackle or something like Einhander 2.
They tried doing other Genres a long time ago. Turns out they suck really badly at them. Their Primarily a JRPG company you don't fuck with what your good at.
And maybe Einhander 2 is less about them not doing it, and more about a sequel not being planned, even if they STOP Final Fantasy there is no guarantee they would make it. Just like a Third Chrono game is unlikely because they can't get the dream team together.
Unless you want a Silent Hill Homecoming game then by all means.
Also they really are progressing, people are just to blind to see it.
Onmi: They tried doing other Genres a long time ago. Turns out they suck really badly at them. Their Primarily a JRPG company you don't fuck with what your good at.
And maybe Einhander 2 is less about them not doing it, and more about a sequel not being planned, even if they STOP Final Fantasy there is no guarantee they would make it. Just like a Third Chrono game is unlikely because they can't get the dream team together.
Unless you want a Silent Hill Homecoming game then by all means.
Also they really are progressing, people are just to blind to see it.
Actually, they're generally pretty good at whatever they put their mind to. Just to list a few...
Einhander Bushido Blade 1 & 2 Kingdom Hearts Radiata Stories FRONT MISSION FFT The _____ of Mana series. Brave Fencer Musashi
And yes, some may say 'ACTION/STRATEGY RPG = RPG', but they're not really. Too different from all but the most basic levels.
Onmi: They tried doing other Genres a long time ago. Turns out they suck really badly at them. Their Primarily a JRPG company you don't fuck with what your good at.
And maybe Einhander 2 is less about them not doing it, and more about a sequel not being planned, even if they STOP Final Fantasy there is no guarantee they would make it. Just like a Third Chrono game is unlikely because they can't get the dream team together.
Unless you want a Silent Hill Homecoming game then by all means.
Also they really are progressing, people are just to blind to see it.
Actually, they're generally pretty good at whatever they put their mind to. Just to list a few...
Einhander Bushido Blade 1 & 2 Kingdom Hearts Radiata Stories FRONT MISSION FFT The _____ of Mana series. Brave Fencer Musashi
And yes, some may say 'ACTION/STRATEGY RPG = RPG', but they're not really. Too different from all but the most basic levels.
Wow I forgot Bushido Blade was made by Square but I would like another Bushido Blade game. I believe the games made after 2 had health bars? Why?
Also, I loved Front Mission 1 and 3. I didn't play 2 for some reason.
Onmi: They tried doing other Genres a long time ago. Turns out they suck really badly at them. Their Primarily a JRPG company you don't fuck with what your good at.
And maybe Einhander 2 is less about them not doing it, and more about a sequel not being planned, even if they STOP Final Fantasy there is no guarantee they would make it. Just like a Third Chrono game is unlikely because they can't get the dream team together.
Unless you want a Silent Hill Homecoming game then by all means.
Also they really are progressing, people are just to blind to see it.
Actually, they're generally pretty good at whatever they put their mind to. Just to list a few...
Einhander Bushido Blade 1 & 2 Kingdom Hearts Radiata Stories FRONT MISSION FFT The _____ of Mana series. Brave Fencer Musashi
And yes, some may say 'ACTION/STRATEGY RPG = RPG', but they're not really. Too different from all but the most basic levels.
You pretty much said what I was about to, anyway they are all apart of the RPG genre, they are Sub-genres in themselves.
Onmi: They tried doing other Genres a long time ago. Turns out they suck really badly at them. Their Primarily a JRPG company you don't fuck with what your good at.
And maybe Einhander 2 is less about them not doing it, and more about a sequel not being planned, even if they STOP Final Fantasy there is no guarantee they would make it. Just like a Third Chrono game is unlikely because they can't get the dream team together.
Unless you want a Silent Hill Homecoming game then by all means.
Also they really are progressing, people are just to blind to see it.
Actually, they're generally pretty good at whatever they put their mind to. Just to list a few...
Einhander Bushido Blade 1 & 2 Kingdom Hearts Radiata Stories FRONT MISSION FFT The _____ of Mana series. Brave Fencer Musashi
And yes, some may say 'ACTION/STRATEGY RPG = RPG', but they're not really. Too different from all but the most basic levels.
You pretty much said what I was about to, anyway they are all apart of the RPG genre, they are Sub-genres in themselves.
Actually, Einhander and Bushido Blade have no RPG elements in them. Einhander is a scrolling shoot-em-up and Bushido Blade is a fighting game.
waffletaco: Wow I forgot Bushido Blade was made by Square but I would like another Bushido Blade game. I believe the games made after 2 had health bars? Why?
It was made by another company, with none of the original people from the other two games. They just bought the name and slapped it on.
Onmi: You pretty much said what I was about to, anyway they are all apart of the RPG genre, they are Sub-genres in themselves.
Einhander Bushido Blade 1 & 2 FRONT MISSION
RPGs?
Wut?
Do you not actually know what an RPG is?
The others I can sorta give you, but those are not in any way shape or form RPGs.
Onmi: Sorry that was a misuse of Grammer on my part.
What I meant was, Yes your right that Action RPG's and Strategy RPG's are Sub-Genre's of RPG's, but they are all together RPG's.
Yeah that was a brainfart on my part.
Oh, well. It was confusing because you didn't delete the games that weren't RPGs from the list. It made me assume that you were talking about all them.
Mr.Pandah: The name sells. Its not about the saving Final Fantasy as a series, its about saving each individual games. I really don't feel they need any saving at all though. I think 9 and 10 were both masterpieces in their own right, but when I played 12 I couldn't even bring myself to finish the opening scene. The Battle System just felt so...unnatural to me. I didn't care for it. I think its the Sum of its Parts that make each Final Fantasy something to be enjoyed.
agreed until the last sentence i enjoyed all of them but FFXII
Final Fantasy is what got me into gaming, it's why I bought a PS2 AND why I bought a PS3, I will likely NEVER give up on Final Fantasy until Wada himself comes and shits in my cereal and tells me he hates me. Though he probably would do that if there was a profit in it.
Honestly there's no series to save. Final Fantasy is a brand name under which a lot of very different games have been placed.
In terms of keeping the brand relevant though, FFXII was as brave an entry in the series as one could expect. That said, Yasumi Matsuno's obsession with intricate gameplay systems, innovative as they are, probably prevented FFXII from making the necessary strides towards greater western mainstream acceptance.
In order for Final Fantasy to be saved, it needs two in the chest and one in the head.
Hyperbole aside, that is my opinion. I feel that it is time for this legendary series to actually be final. I have heard the same thing said about similar franchises (i.e. Zelda, Mario, Metroid, and even Halo). By now, Final Fantasy has reached the benchmark that is reasonable for them to reach; after all, few games have (inappropriately) touched the video gaming world more than FFVII. Nowadays, all Final Fantasy games are forced to be fan service. If they try something new, they get slammed for it. I think Square Enix needs to take more time in releasing their new JRPG series (i.e. infinite undiscovery).
Oh, and pardon the jokes. Irish tried to be as civil as possible.
Less plastic surgery in the women. More cloths on the women.
Now let me qualify this because it bears some explaining- I like scantile clad hawtness as much as the next guy. But I CHALLENGE any game developer to make an attractive female character that 1. Does not have breasts large enough to count as d6 bludgeoning weapons, and 2. Wears realistic armor. That knight chick from Soul Calibur 4 (possibly the only Soul Calibur female that wasn't horrifying) is a great example.
You mean like Faith from Mirrors edge?
I will come out and say it I LOVED X-2. The battle system was superb it served similar to the good 'ol materia system of VII but also added a high speed aspect to it without destroying the feel or having game breaking quickenings like XII.
The problem of X-2 was the feel. The western setting worked in the origional 2d games but it does not in the new games and it just felt wrong tacking on all the iconic FF names to airships and the like.
Final Fantasy XIII looks like it captures the correct style of Final Fantasy but is still doing a lot of new things.
Final Fantasy XIII looks like it captures the correct style of Final Fantasy but is still doing a lot of new things.
Whats wrong with New things? Progress is the power of humanity, for the series to progress and venture into new territory's is a good thing, with an unknown outcome but still good.
Without progress all games would be from atari, as fun as Pacman and Tetris are, they do not last forever.
For Final Fantasy to continue it's train of success, and more importantly to survive the years it MUST become innovative with more progress!
Let me clarify by stating that I love the old games, I really do, but when I wanna play that I'll play them, I don't wanna be playing FFXIV and be saying "Well fuck me i'm just playing 6 again" 6 was an awesome game don't get me wrong, but it's awesome cause it's well... 6. I want each game to be original, if that means taking a risk, then yes, without innovation we wouldn't have ATB.
tendo82: Honestly there's no series to save. Final Fantasy is a brand name under which a lot of very different games have been placed.
In terms of keeping the brand relevant though, FFXII was as brave an entry in the series as one could expect. That said, Yasumi Matsuno's obsession with intricate gameplay systems, innovative as they are, probably prevented FFXII from making the necessary strides towards greater western mainstream acceptance.
Let us not forget that he had a NERVOUS BREAKDOWN right in the middle of development leaving it up to the director of the much maligned SAGA frontier series to pick up the slack. There is actually a point (I have identified it as when you set out for The Stillshrine of Miriam) where the game starts to lag something fierce. No more innovative game mechanics, no more interesting dungeons, just lots and lots of MMO esque geography.
tendo82: Honestly there's no series to save. Final Fantasy is a brand name under which a lot of very different games have been placed.
In terms of keeping the brand relevant though, FFXII was as brave an entry in the series as one could expect. That said, Yasumi Matsuno's obsession with intricate gameplay systems, innovative as they are, probably prevented FFXII from making the necessary strides towards greater western mainstream acceptance.
Let us not forget that he had a NERVOUS BREAKDOWN right in the middle of development leaving it up to the director of the much maligned SAGA frontier series to pick up the slack. There is actually a point (I have identified it as when you set out for The Stillshrine of Miriam) where the game starts to lag something fierce. No more innovative game mechanics, no more interesting dungeons, just lots and lots of MMO esque geography.
That's when the story's pacing went and got fucked. it's still his overall original idea, but badly paced and implemented.
I would really like it if they created a new, three-dimensional protagonist. All of the recent ones seem like flat, pretty-boy rehashes of previous FF heroes, like Cloud and Squall.
I'm not sure we should save it, I loved a good deal of the series, but I think we need to let it go. There's nothing worse than letting something great turn to shit because you refuse to end it and drag it out. I think the magic is gone, and for me at least the romance is long over.
Onmi: Again the all important point. Why do people think it needs 'Saving' again?
Because some fanboy of the old said so. I pointed at the metacritic scores, and they're on your side. Telling Square to change their direction of game production is like telling Ford to switch to making desk chairs.
Onmi: Again the all important point. Why do people think it needs 'Saving' again?
Because some fanboy of the old said so. I pointed at the metacritic scores, and they're on your side. Telling Square to change their direction of game production is like telling Ford to switch to making desk chairs.
From TVTropes.org (God I love this fucking Website)
# Your Mileage May Vary (People see this as one of the best games Square has created or unworthy of being called a Final Fantasy game, especially in regards to the battle system.)
* Of course, they've said the latter about every single Final Fantasy title since VII VI IV.
Let us not forget that he had a NERVOUS BREAKDOWN right in the middle of development leaving it up to the director of the much maligned SAGA frontier series to pick up the slack. There is actually a point (I have identified it as when you set out for The Stillshrine of Miriam) where the game starts to lag something fierce. No more innovative game mechanics, no more interesting dungeons, just lots and lots of MMO esque geography.
See, as far as I can tell, Final Fantasy XII is just Knights of the Old Republic with decent scripting tools for your characters' actions rather than a pathetically short action queue.
Let us not forget that he had a NERVOUS BREAKDOWN right in the middle of development leaving it up to the director of the much maligned SAGA frontier series to pick up the slack. There is actually a point (I have identified it as when you set out for The Stillshrine of Miriam) where the game starts to lag something fierce. No more innovative game mechanics, no more interesting dungeons, just lots and lots of MMO esque geography.
See, as far as I can tell, Final Fantasy XII is just Knights of the Old Republic with decent scripting tools for your characters' actions rather than a pathetically short action queue.
Why are you Quoting me? That was Pedro.
and I haven't played Kotor so I can't say anything about that comparison.
Having read through this, I just want to say two things.
Number one: The Final Fantasy series is generally fine, in my opinion. They're not my favorite jRPG series(MegaTen for that, kthx), but they get the job done. They usually do things a little differently in each game, and are always trying something out. I'm not a huge fan, but I'll make time in my schedule to play one.
Number two: I think most of the FF hate comes from 'It's popular, now it sucks'. This doesn't mean the game is perfect, but there's a backlash that pops up against popular things and FF is consistently popular. The rest is 'they changed it, now it sucks.' Most of the ideas to 'save' FF would make it considerably worse. Why? Because it's all 'I WANT FF4/5/6 AGAIN'. No. Stop it. Enjoy the older games for what they were. Enjoy the newer games for what they are. If you don't like it, fine. Awesome. Your call. But don't hate it because it's not the exact same thing they were doing six games ago.