i was watching tv the other day and my attention was caught by the news telling another story how violence in games and tv are bad for todays youth turning them into anger management needed morons who think nothing for the life of another man and will go out killing animals or other people because they saw it done in a game or movie. The biggest examples they showed from games was GTA4 and Saints Row, then they showed man hunt. I think majority of the problem is that parents do not look at the game raitings on the damn box it is raited M for a reason it is not for 12 year olds. also the only people that are into man hunt are 12 year olds. you will not make many friends in high school or in the real world by telling people how you can kill people with a blade or a spoon *god forbid*. I do not blame the media for kids and parents being dumb enough to let there kids become blood crazy when they feel the only thing they can do is hurt people. the parents need to take responsibillity to look at the games and movies they watch and play.
what do you think the problem rlly is?

Capitals and punctuation are your friends. Okay now that's out of the way, I think I can speak for all gamers when I say that the stupidity of parents and their tendencies to blame violent video games which they bought for their young child is getting on our collective tits. The most famous and infuriating example of this was the Fox News Mass Effect fiasco. Not to mention the murder of a 14 year old over here in the UK the week Man Hunt was released. The kid happened to have been bludgeoned to death with a hammer by another kid and almost immediately the media went for Man Hunt, which neither kid had played :/

I don't know why ESRB isn't made law... it would stop these stupid lawsuits (And it doesn't affect me now!)

I blame the moronic parents for allowing their children to play M rated games and then complaining when they watch them playing them.

"I DON'T WANT MY CHILDREN PLAYING THIS FILTH!" - then DON'T BUY IT FOR THEM. You morons. There is a real reason why games are rated the way they are. It's not there for show, it's there for a reason. Does this game have blood and violence? Yes. And it tells you on the back of the box these days. Does this game have swearing? Yes. And it tells you on the back of the box these days. Does this game feature mild peril? Yes. And (sadly) it tells you on the back of the box. Noticing a pattern here?

Let's just be responsible about things and we'll avoid nurturing a nation of sociopaths and psychopaths. Which is, OF COURSE, what games are doing to us all. Now then, where's that chainsaw? And have you seen the dog anywhere?

I think majority of the problem is that parents do not look at the game raitings on the damn box it is raited M for a reason it is not for 12 year olds

Here's the thing, it sorta is since a movie that is rated PG13 (close enough to 12) is rated M as a videogame.

it's just an escape goat. people aren't happy unless there is something to blame so they go straight for games. one thing i thought of, a lot of people here (and myself included) say games do not make children go nuts. BUT, when a game has an 18 age rating, say Man Hunt, we won't/wouldn't let our kids play it. why not? if it doesnt have any effect on them, whats wrong with letting them play it just because it's age restricted. i have though about it for ages and i can think of no real reason to not let any kids i may one day have to play it (after all, it won't have any effect on them), but i still wouldn't.

The guy who killed a taxi driver because of GTA IV, or rather, he wanted to know whether it was as easy as it seemed, was actually 19-years-old, not 12, so this stereotyping that "little kids kill people because of violent video games" in your text is annoying, wrong, and not based on real facts.

And also, your lack of punctuation and paragraphs are annoying also.

Hamsterlad:
The parents need to take responsibillity to look at the games and movies they watch and play.
What do you think the problem really is?

Of course the parents need to take responsibility.
But what we have today is a wishy-washy version of parenting that has parents treating kids like adults when they are NOT. Which means less discipline and actual parenting, and more 'Get Billy what he wants because I don't want him to grow up and hate me'.

Kids do violent things because they are either violent by nature (Like a psychosis or something), or because they weren't raised well enough to know that violence rarely solves any problems (And usually creates more).

Parents need to get off their asses and discipline their kids (AND serve as a good example).
That's what needs to happen...but I'm not holding my breath.

Hamsterlad:
The biggest examples they showed from games was GTA4 and Saints Row, then they showed man hunt.

Saint's Row is too over the top to be taken seriously at all. I can't wait until our generation is in charge so everyone can calm the fuck down.

Also, most people here are writers, so type better please. It annoys us.

mike1921:

I think majority of the problem is that parents do not look at the game raitings on the damn box it is raited M for a reason it is not for 12 year olds

Here's the thing, it sorta is since a movie that is rated PG13 (close enough to 12) is rated M as a videogame.

Are you serious right now? Really? That is some piss poor logic right there. An M rating means ages 17 and up, whatever the god damn movie it might be based on was rated.

In my experiences, age sometimes doesn't matter. I know kids that are 13 and would be OK with an M rated game but I also know 18 year olds I wouldn't trust with a guitar because they'd smash it over someones head. Maturity is the factor that should decide whether or not they should get the game.

JingleheimerShmidt:

mike1921:

I think majority of the problem is that parents do not look at the game raitings on the damn box it is raited M for a reason it is not for 12 year olds

Here's the thing, it sorta is since a movie that is rated PG13 (close enough to 12) is rated M as a videogame.

Are you serious right now? Really? That is some piss poor logic right there. An M rating means ages 17 and up, whatever the god damn movie it might be based on was rated.

In the US, the same content, especially sexual content, that will get a game an M rating would be PG-13 at most if exactly the same scene was in a film.

Mass Effect is a perfect example, there's no way that would have been more than R as a movie, and that would have been pushing it.

(Incidentally, it was a 12 in the UK)

GloatingSwine:

JingleheimerShmidt:

mike1921:

I think majority of the problem is that parents do not look at the game raitings on the damn box it is raited M for a reason it is not for 12 year olds

Here's the thing, it sorta is since a movie that is rated PG13 (close enough to 12) is rated M as a videogame.

Are you serious right now? Really? That is some piss poor logic right there. An M rating means ages 17 and up, whatever the god damn movie it might be based on was rated.

In the US, the same content, especially sexual content, that will get a game an M rating would be PG-13 at most if exactly the same scene was in a film.

Mass Effect is a perfect example, there's no way that would have been more than R as a movie, and that would have been pushing it.

(Incidentally, it was a 12 in the UK)

Alright, I see where you're coming from now. But there's a reason games like Dead Space and Gears of War have the ratings that they do. Perhaps they could learn to be a bit more lenient with the ratings they give (I agree that Mass Effect was in no way deserving of an M rating), but the idea that M rated games could be equated to PG-13 movies is a dangerous generalization to fall into.

I blame the morality police, it's a common thing with people to want to ERASE rather than RESIST temptation. Basically they don't want to pay attention to game ratings, they want these games gone so they don't need to pay attention to them.

PureChaos:
it's just an escape goat......

PureChaos it is scapegoat and it refers to a goat that was symbolically burdened with the sins of the people and then killed on Yom Kippur to rid Jerusalem of its iniquities. Similar rituals were held elsewhere in the ancient world to transfer guilt or blame. Christianity reflects this notion in its belief that Jesus died to atone for the sins of mankind.

As far as blaming video games for everything that is just the price we have to pay to play. Movies, Rap, Rock, TV, and radio all went throught this stage until the old people who never new anything about them died. People are always going to blame something they don't understand for their problems as long as they don't have to blame themselves. Video Games are the most current goat. But it is getting better and in 10 years there will still be a few idiots blaming games but the majority will know and trust games. All the education in the world won't help an idiot with a purpose like Jack Thompson. So about the only thing we can do is just ignore them and hope the supreme court still believes in the First Amendmant.

Put simply, parents need to STFU and pay attention to what their little snowflakes are playing, instead of going to the store and asking for "that new game... auto-something... I KNOW! Murder Simulator Larceny 8! That's the one Billy won't shut up about! I wonder what it's about... OH, WELL, ring it up, good shopkeep!"

Should the ESRB bring in the AO title of games? or would that not matter like the M titles

the biggest problem is that the parents dont monitor the games their kids play. its not real hard to go on the internet and watch a trailer of a game or sit for a half hour and see what it is your kids are playing at home.

also i blame the news media, politicians, etc. because they use games as a scapegoat to blame for everything when they havent even played the games and have no idea what content is in them.

i would also like to add that most r rated movies contain way more mature content than most m rated games

soulasylum85:
the biggest problem is that the parents dont monitor the games their kids play. its not real hard to go on the internet and watch a trailer of a game or sit for a half hour and see what it is your kids are playing at home.

also i blame the news media, politicians, etc. because they use games as a scapegoat to blame for everything when they havent even played the games and have no idea what content is in them.

i would also like to add that most r rated movies contain way more mature content than most m rated games

well if thats the case what can we do to keep kids away from the games that are not ment to be played by kids? i say the stores by law have to card the teens so they cannot buy the game. but that isnt enough to stop the dumb ass parents to buy the game for them....

Hamsterlad:

soulasylum85:
the biggest problem is that the parents dont monitor the games their kids play. its not real hard to go on the internet and watch a trailer of a game or sit for a half hour and see what it is your kids are playing at home.

also i blame the news media, politicians, etc. because they use games as a scapegoat to blame for everything when they havent even played the games and have no idea what content is in them.

i would also like to add that most r rated movies contain way more mature content than most m rated games

well if thats the case what can we do to keep kids away from the games that are not ment to be played by kids? i say the stores by law have to card the teens so they cannot buy the game. but that isnt enough to stop the dumb ass parents to buy the game for them....

i dont think we can do anything. the gaminng community knows what games they would and wouldnt let thier kids play. the problem is that the parents arent educated on the subject enough. i think as the gaming industry continues to grow and become more mainstream there will be fewer problems becuz more people will be informed. all we can do is wait and keep supporting the industry. til then my advice to parents is buy your kids a wii. theere is fun to be had but not that many mature games

soulasylum85:

Hamsterlad:

soulasylum85:
the biggest problem is that the parents dont monitor the games their kids play. its not real hard to go on the internet and watch a trailer of a game or sit for a half hour and see what it is your kids are playing at home.

also i blame the news media, politicians, etc. because they use games as a scapegoat to blame for everything when they havent even played the games and have no idea what content is in them.

i would also like to add that most r rated movies contain way more mature content than most m rated games

well if thats the case what can we do to keep kids away from the games that are not ment to be played by kids? i say the stores by law have to card the teens so they cannot buy the game. but that isnt enough to stop the dumb ass parents to buy the game for them....

i dont think we can do anything. the gaminng community knows what games they would and wouldnt let thier kids play. the problem is that the parents arent educated on the subject enough. i think as the gaming industry continues to grow and become more mainstream there will be fewer problems becuz more people will be informed. all we can do is wait and keep supporting the industry. til then my advice to parents is buy your kids a wii. theere is fun to be had but not that many mature games

Well, sooner or later this issue is going to solve itself up, not because games have already become mainstream, but because parents will themselves have grown around video games. I am to turn 30 soon, and I could easily have a 10 year old child. Well, I would still be informed about games trust me on this, and I would know what I can allow my kid to play.
Eventually, even 60 years old people will have grown around video games and know what the deal is.

As for blaming video games for violence. It seems to me that the violent crime proportion is rising as is the world population, I see no peak occuring since video games are around, and I saw no peak months after Manhunt came out.
It is really hard to link video games with violence. If violence didn't exist before video games came out, then maybe I could see a link, but as it is, a large portion of the population is playing video games, what is so surprising about a murder committed by a person playing video games. When 100% of the population plays video games, will it still be strange that a person that plays or played a video game committed murder? Weren't there other people, doing different stuff, and comitting murders before?
What if a violin adept killed a person? Would the medias accuse the violin of causing kids to become violent? I think they should, for the sake of consistency.

Basically, they are scared, they don't know shit about video games and they are scared of the unknown. They react just like you landing face first on the boogeyman's ass. They want it out.

JingleheimerShmidt:

mike1921:

I think majority of the problem is that parents do not look at the game raitings on the damn box it is raited M for a reason it is not for 12 year olds

Here's the thing, it sorta is since a movie that is rated PG13 (close enough to 12) is rated M as a videogame.

Are you serious right now? Really? That is some piss poor logic right there. An M rating means ages 17 and up, whatever the god damn movie it might be based on was rated.

You misunderstood what I said so much I probably shouldn't respond.

Oh damn I'm late, my point was what gloating said.

JingleheimerShmidt:

GloatingSwine:

JingleheimerShmidt:

mike1921:

I think majority of the problem is that parents do not look at the game raitings on the damn box it is raited M for a reason it is not for 12 year olds

Here's the thing, it sorta is since a movie that is rated PG13 (close enough to 12) is rated M as a videogame.

Are you serious right now? Really? That is some piss poor logic right there. An M rating means ages 17 and up, whatever the god damn movie it might be based on was rated.

In the US, the same content, especially sexual content, that will get a game an M rating would be PG-13 at most if exactly the same scene was in a film.

Mass Effect is a perfect example, there's no way that would have been more than R as a movie, and that would have been pushing it.

(Incidentally, it was a 12 in the UK)

Alright, I see where you're coming from now. But there's a reason games like Dead Space and Gears of War have the ratings that they do. Perhaps they could learn to be a bit more lenient with the ratings they give (I agree that Mass Effect was in no way deserving of an M rating), but the idea that M rated games could be equated to PG-13 movies is a dangerous generalization to fall into.

If the rating is so broad, I think the ESRB needs to be re-hauled until content the average 10 year old could handle is no longer in the same category as smut that might scare the average 15 year old (there is nothing a 16 or 17 year old can't handle that they'll magically be able to handle at 18 assuming nothing big happens then except gaining rights, anyone who tells you otherwise is full of shit, hell a good percent of 13 year olds are watching porn), and until it is the rating should mean nothing at all. Something so broad is almost useless.

Buying an M rated game for your kid is basically like buying them porno. Same level of maturity required (you know what I mean).

I stand corrected, such a broad rating scale can be used to make sure people think any game with a hint of violence is comparable to a porno.

It's called education. It comes from our teachers and, more importantly, our parents--and not from the label in the corner of a video game's cover art. Parents can not, and should not, buy games for their children without knowing exactly what it is they're buying. Nor should they substitute actual parenting with video games.

Nor should they substitute actual parenting with video games.

Any parent who tries to substitute parenting with video games was probably wondering where the penis goes the night they conceived their child.

In all seriousness, if I didn't have my video games to vent my anger, I would be a much more violent person. I'm sure there's some of you who know what i'm saying.

Doc Theta Sigma:
Capitals and punctuation are your friends. Okay now that's out of the way

ESRP at Work-
So, I work at GameStop and do a damn good job at telling people loudly what is in the game they're trying to buy (Usually some form of GTA) for their child (Usually 8 or 9). Most of them are embarrassed out of buying it, and I'm glad. They can't blame me for their child becoming some animal killing rapist. I think the ESRB is a fairly good idea, just so idiots know what they're buying.

Now the Real Opinion-
That being said, I support violent games. Humans are predatory animals, and we like to kill. I like to unwind and kill pixelated things with my friends. It gives a happy, small, feeling that some primal need is being filled. A need that our society, with largely good reason, is denying. Video games are to violence as masturbation is to sex, essentially.

In short- Video games satisfy a primal need of violence because humans are violent, predatory animals. Video games = Good.

VoleurdeThym:

Video games are to violence as masturbation is to sex.

These are my favorites.

Hamsterlad:
i was watching tv the other day and my attention was caught by the news telling another story how violence in games and tv are bad for todays youth turning them into anger management needed morons who think nothing for the life of another man and will go out killing animals or other people because they saw it done in a game or movie. The biggest examples they showed from games was GTA4 and Saints Row, then they showed man hunt. I think majority of the problem is that parents do not look at the game raitings on the damn box it is raited M for a reason it is not for 12 year olds. also the only people that are into man hunt are 12 year olds. you will not make many friends in high school or in the real world by telling people how you can kill people with a blade or a spoon *god forbid*. I do not blame the media for kids and parents being dumb enough to let there kids become blood crazy when they feel the only thing they can do is hurt people. the parents need to take responsibillity to look at the games and movies they watch and play.
what do you think the problem rlly is?

The fact that each generation of parents has been lazier than the last, with a few exceptions. In the mid-90s a couple kids went on a gunning rampage through Columbine High School and blamed it on someone who had absolutely NOTHING to do with it in any way.

5 bonus points if you know who that person is.

1. I played anything and everything since I was a kid and I turned out fine. I'm a non-violent and generally nice person. I'm either freaking special or maybe there's more at work here than the corrupting influence of videogames.

2. People who do something and later claim it was because of a video game (like the GTA4 example) were severely mentally unbalanced to begin with. If it wasn't a video game that set them off, it would be something else. The better question might be why nobody stops those people? Aaaaand then we get to the nasty topic of neglect...

3. Claiming that media corrupt children's values is an overstatement. Media can only fill a void provided by the parents lack of proper care, or build upon an existing instability that was, again, the parents responsibility to prevent or repair.

Gamers are not violent by nature. Some people have violent or unstable personalities and sometimes they are also gamers. Sometimes they listen to Spice Girls. Sometimes they go to Church. Sometimes they collect stamps. Are stamps the cause of corrupting moral values?

Sometimes I miss the :rolleyes: smiley...

4thegreatergood:

5 bonus points if you know who that person is.

"Who is Manson?", for 5 points Good.

VoleurdeThym:

4thegreatergood:

5 bonus points if you know who that person is.

"Who is Marilyn Manson?", for 5 points Good.

5 points the VoleurdeThym! Marilyn Manson is the person.

Jandau:

2. People who do something and later claim it was because of a video game (like the GTA4 example) were severely mentally unbalanced to begin with. If it wasn't a video game that set them off, it would be something else. The better question might be why nobody stops those people? Aaaaand then we get to the nasty topic of neglect...

This. This nails it perfectly.

PureChaos:
it's just an escape goat. people aren't happy unless there is something to blame so they go straight for games. one thing i thought of, a lot of people here (and myself included) say games do not make children go nuts. BUT, when a game has an 18 age rating, say Man Hunt, we won't/wouldn't let our kids play it. why not? if it doesnt have any effect on them, whats wrong with letting them play it just because it's age restricted. i have though about it for ages and i can think of no real reason to not let any kids i may one day have to play it (after all, it won't have any effect on them), but i still wouldn't.

Wow I'd have to agree, but I think the difference is that the parents on the news in those stories vary in information about the game(s)compared to a gamers point of view is: They think (Hey kids go have fun with this box and anything inside.) where say you know there are things they might like and be ok with along with abear trap inside. now it's no direct threat they have to set it 1st but if your kids know it's a bear trap and dangerous it wouldn't likely be a issuse for you but you wouldn't wanna risk finding out they are not aware that it's hazardous.