Fanboy:

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Fanboy:
Master chief was gay.

I wouldn't feel weird playing a homosexual character in a video game, so long as the game isn't centered around the fact that said character is homosexual. However, I don't think the majority of gamers are ready for something like that, and it would only reach a very limited audience.

I think it would be better to keep the character's sexuality secret, then spring it on the fanbase after the game has become successful. Kind of like what J. K. Rowling did with Dumbledore.

But Dumbledore's sexuality never came out in the story and appeared to have no impact on the plot at all.

Neither did master chiefs.

The game doesn't have to be different because of the character's sexuality. Would metroid be any different if Samus was just some dude? No, it wouldn't, but the angle that she was a woman did make the game more popular.

But what I mean is, at no point was the character's sexuality touched upon at all... ever. it was just declared later, so why bother at all.

I3uster:
Fallout 3 had a gay couple no one noticed, flak & shrapnel

Yeah I think the subtlety there was good, even though Shrapnel looked like Freddy Mercury.

But I'm going to be perfectly honest, with all the bad slashfics going on about just about every male character in everything (especially video games), the world is clearly not mature enough for any sort of gay protagonist in a video game. Hell if they suddenly made a protagonist in a long-running series gay, you'd have thousands of fangasming yaoi fangirls/fanboys thinking that somehow their crappy writing and art forced that change.

Though there was Fear Effect...

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But what I mean is, at no point was the character's sexuality touched upon at all... ever. it was just declared later, so why bother at all.

Publicity? There's no other real reason, besides just doing it for kicks.

AceDiamond:

I3uster:
Fallout 3 had a gay couple no one noticed, flak & shrapnel

Yeah I think the subtlety there was good, even though Shrapnel looked like Freddy Mercury.

But I'm going to be perfectly honest, with all the bad slashfics going on about just about every male character in everything (especially video games), the world is clearly not mature enough for any sort of gay protagonist in a video game. Hell if they suddenly made a protagonist in a long-running series gay, you'd have thousands of fangasming yaoi fangirls/fanboys thinking that somehow their crappy writing and art forced that change.

Though there was Fear Effect...

Well most fifteen year olds think lesbians are "hot". I donīt think they would buy games with "male" gay main characters.

Nimbus:

new_age_reject:

The_root_of_all_evil:
Does it really matter that much what a character's sexual preference is? Gordon Freeman could quite easily be homosexual, but would it change any part of Half Life 2?

This, there just isn't really a way that you can insert a particular sexuality into a game without it seeming gimmicky.

I'm thirding this. I mean, how would stuff like this even come up whilst fighting aliens. "Eat lead Alien Scum! Also, I'm gay!"

Well, a non-cinematic shooter like Half-Life 2 isn't quite the best example; an RPG could do it quite well, but humans haven't quitee advanced to the point where such would be "burned at the stake" both commercially and critically. There'd be no easy way to sell it to the majority, especially since straight relationships are so silly anyways. Gays would need to be held to a higher standard if they were show us that, really, Ivy (from Soulcaliber) or one of those sickeningly cliche Final-Fantasy romances is, in fact, not the best we can do.

minoes:

AceDiamond:

I3uster:
Fallout 3 had a gay couple no one noticed, flak & shrapnel

Yeah I think the subtlety there was good, even though Shrapnel looked like Freddy Mercury.

But I'm going to be perfectly honest, with all the bad slashfics going on about just about every male character in everything (especially video games), the world is clearly not mature enough for any sort of gay protagonist in a video game. Hell if they suddenly made a protagonist in a long-running series gay, you'd have thousands of fangasming yaoi fangirls/fanboys thinking that somehow their crappy writing and art forced that change.

Though there was Fear Effect...

Well most fifteen year olds think lesbians are "hot". I donīt think they would buy games with "male" gay main characters.

Very true. I was saying it primarily as a joke, since I don't think anybody remembers those games for anything but the lesbianism.

minoes:
Zangief and Eagle from Street Fighter are gay and they were created in the late 80īs. They are also far from stereotypical.

That my friend is the 80's. Its very easy to get the two confused. I know. Personally it wouldn't make much of a difference for me.

I think that the reason for the lack of homosexuality in games is that most hardcore gamers would rather play a character that is very masculine than a gay or feminine guy. It seems like the expectation is that homosexuals cant be made into hardcore characters. I may be mistaken, but wasnt Leon Kennedy (resident evil 4) gay. I just think that if they could make a main character gay, without it being a stereotype or some big plot element...or a big secret, nobody would notice the difference.

blackcherry:

minoes:
Zangief and Eagle from Street Fighter are gay and they were created in the late 80īs. They are also far from stereotypical.

That my friend is the 80's. Its very easy to get the two confused. I know. Personally it wouldn't make much of a difference for me.

Certainly. There wasnīt any real indication this characters were gay outside their profiles (and even those were vague).

Are games straight enought?

Seriously how many characters are openly straight or have any sexual content whatsoever
most characters don't even speak or even human (Kirby)
Simple fact is most people are not Gay so its hardly surprising that most characters are straight.

I think Jade Empire is the only game that allows you any combination you like (Male + Silk Fox/Dawn Star/Sky, Female + Sky/Silk Fox).

Of course, Bioware's inability to write a male love interest who isn't a tit didn't help.

Zangief and Eagle from Street Fighter are gay and they were created in the late 80īs. They are also far from stereotypical.

Zangief is a Bear. Not exactly a sterotype per se, but a notable gay subculture (Large hairy gay men who tend to like other large hairy gay men).

Valkyria Chrocnicles has a few homosexual characters in it. their abilities have a chance to increase if their near same-gender characters. the male homosexual character is VERY stereotypical... i noticed that very quickly. theres also a female homoesexual character, but she's not so obvious.

I might answer this from an FPS perspective.

In FPS, immersion is often the case, more so than in any films. The developers want you to believe that you are the character in the game. You are gordon freeman, you are Master Chief etc.

Now if that character was gay, would you feel a little squeemish? Maybe it's just my instinctive homophobia speaking, but I would feel rather odd hitting on male characters. However I wouldn't feel odd having male characters hit on me. I don't mind playing characters who have lore behind them about them being gay, but once my character starts making passes at other characters, I would probably draw the line there.

My point being, in films or books, you are reading about a character, you might identify with them on certain levels, but you still are at an arms length watching from a different perspective. It isn't as awkward to watch a movie about a gay main character, Where as in an FPS you are directly in the controlling seat, making it awkward (at least it would for me).

So therefore if my character started hitting on characters without my control who were male, I wouldn't really enjoy it so much from the immersion standpoint. And so I perhaps wouldn't purchase the game. And as sexuality is not a key part of gaming, I suppose not many game companies are willing to take the risk of going for a particular demographic?

As for the other genres, sexuality just isn't as important in gaming, as gaming is about blowing the crap out of each other, or jumping on clouds, collecting coins. Not hitting on people.
How much of perceived lack of gayity is just as a result of assuming the characters you play are heterosexual?

Pyronox:
As for homophobes, even if you don't act like it or think you aren't, I'm sure about 99% of guys are afraid that a gay guy will hit on them at some point. (You know it)

From my experience, that is one astronomically massive exaggeration. Perhaps that is because of our different premises, but I doubt this kind of fear is that widespread even in the manly country of Canada. ;)

I think there is a decent amount of homosexuality in the world of gaming. I would not mind more though.. but in some cases there is a risk of making it feel.. unrealistic because it is not proportional to the real world, or at least I think some people would feel this. Even if I (an anime and manga fan) would definitely not protest to more lesbianism. Oh, how I enjoyed Mass Effect. Hrm.

Anywho, many of my friends are homosexual (my best friend is so damn happy with another of my friends), and I love their free-spiritedness. One should always follow one's own premises, and I tend to think homosexuals are more.. open-minded than most. It could be a fresh breeze if someone portrayed homosexuality in a character as a release. I would like that.

1337mokro:

And in any deathmatch shooter there are NO women? Halo, all men...

Do your research. Halo is one of the few multiplayer shooters that lets you play as a female. This is probably because the armor causes them to be indistinguishable.

This thread wanders dangerously close to Rule34 territory. With the rare exception (e.g. RPG plot points) video game characters don't... actually... have sex... or functional genitalia... you know that, right?

1337mokro:
The fact that in games romance never gets past the part of conversation or implied actions to avoid the 50 foot 18+ stamp, most of the gayity would quickly revert to lesbian relationships. Most gamers a male and most gamers are teenagers

I don't understand the intended semantics of the first sentence, or why lesbian romance would be less "gayity" than man-on-man romance. Anyway, that last part is not right. Most gamers are not teenagers, and the teenagers/gamers ratio will drop further as time goes on.

http://www.theaveragegamer.com/averagegamers/

As games stand now, we see the occasional flirt in dialog, and even though game worlds are unproportionally inhabited by young single people, there is the occasional couple as well (as in, there are both a Mr Smith and a Mrs Smith to be found inside Smith's Magic Shoppe in the village, or the old man in a cabin gives you a quest to hunt down the undead who killed his wife).

It wouldn't hurt if a small portion of those flirts came from a character of the same sex, and if the undead occasionally ate a half of a gay couple. These changes would not add sexuality into games, so that's one possible objection down.

I do think there should be deeper sexuality written in games, but it's a separate question.

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Fanboy:

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[quote="Fanboy" post="9.83123.1150537"]Master chief was gay.

I wouldn't feel weird playing a homosexual character in a video game, so long as the game isn't centered around the fact that said character is homosexual. However, I don't think the majority of gamers are ready for something like that, and it would only reach a very limited audience.

I think it would be better to keep the character's sexuality secret, then spring it on the fanbase after the game has become successful. Kind of like what J. K. Rowling did with Dumbledore.

But Dumbledore's sexuality never came out in the story and appeared to have no impact on the plot at all.

Neither did master chiefs.

...
Master Chief isn't gay, dude.

TheNamlessGuy:
"Gay people", or Homosexuals (<- Correct term, acording to my homosexual friends),

You can tell your friends that they are wrong.

on topic: Well, give these things time. As sad as it is the ignorant masses need time to realize being gay is as normal as being blond or black...A few years ago games were mostly populated by white-only people, now you'll see lots of black people as well... It's not a gaming oriented phenomenon, it's a social one. Give them time.

The_root_of_all_evil:
Does it really matter that much what a character's sexual preference is? Gordon Freeman could quite easily be homosexual, but would it change any part of Half Life 2?

It's not so much about what the sexual preference of a character is. There is something there, too, which is that a lot of gamers like to see themselves represented in a game they play - or at least feel included. So having homosexual characters can help include homosexual gamers.

The bigger issue, though, is how a game deals with homosexuality. If you stick a flamboyant, effete, homosexual male in your game, it isn't necessarily a good way to do things. Granted, there *are* people who act like that, but it isn't the norm, and it seems like you really have no intention of displaying homosexuality as anything other than a cheap prop. On the other hand, you can have a very normal, subdued, homosexual character or relationship in your game and have it flow beautifully into the story. Take Fiona and Mickey from The Longest Journey. They are a wonderful couple running the boarding house where April lives. That they are a lesbian couple is not the focus, and their relationship is dealt with in a natural, fluid way. There's no deliberate call-out, you just hear them talk about eachother like any couple in a long-standing relationship would do, and they both happen to be women. As a result, their involvement in the game isn't awkward, gimmicky, or a PR stunt - they're just part of the tapestry that is The Longest Journey, and the game is better for it. Not because they are lesbians, but because they feel so right and support the story so naturally.

The thing is, does it really matter? I mean, it's like throwing in the token not-white dude into a game to appeal to the PC crowd. While this might sound a bit boorish, think about it. Wouldn't be a touch MORE offencive to act like you have to cover your bases with minority group A, even if it doesn't fit in with what the character would do/situation?

Apologies if I offend, it is unintentional.

Fanboy:

Hunde Des Krieg:

Fanboy:
Master chief was gay.

I wouldn't feel weird playing a homosexual character in a video game, so long as the game isn't centered around the fact that said character is homosexual. However, I don't think the majority of gamers are ready for something like that, and it would only reach a very limited audience.

I think it would be better to keep the character's sexuality secret, then spring it on the fanbase after the game has become successful. Kind of like what J. K. Rowling did with Dumbledore.

But Dumbledore's sexuality never came out in the story and appeared to have no impact on the plot at all.

Neither did master chiefs.

The game doesn't have to be different because of the character's sexuality. Would metroid be any different if Samus was just some dude? No, it wouldn't, but the angle that she was a woman did make the game more popular.

Teenage boys are more interested if the character they are playing as has a supermodel body than if they are gay. Furthermore as you seem so interested in the subject why don't you provide some evidence of how master chief is gay?

Xojins:

MessiahOfPants:
To be honest, stereotyping isn't exactly a bad thing. Over stereotyping is. Making a guy sound and act flamboyant isn't bad. I know many guys in the gay community that are like that. That being said, not all gays act flamboyant and not all lesbians are butch. I thought in Indigo Prophecy they added a gay character nicely. I think it's only bad when you make fun of the gay/lesbian character in a hurtful way.

It depends on who you ask. I have many gay friends, all of whom would feel differently about that kind of stereotyping. If you had one gay character in a game who was very flamboyant, that creates the image that all homosexuals act in such a manner, which emphasizes (perhaps unintentionally) that homosexuals are different from everyone else. If it was a gay character that was just a regular, average guy or girl, it wouldn't add that negative connotation.

Anyone who gets their world view from video games deserves to have a mal-formed world view. Ditto TV, music and movies. People should know better than that.

hypothetical fact:
Furthermore as you seem so interested in the subject why don't you provide some evidence of how master chief is gay?

Well he sure seems to love tea-bagging in multiplayer matches. :P

LewsTherin:
The thing is, does it really matter? I mean, it's like throwing in the token not-white dude into a game to appeal to the PC crowd. While this might sound a bit boorish, think about it. Wouldn't be a touch MORE offencive to act like you have to cover your bases with minority group A, even if it doesn't fit in with what the character would do/situation?

You mean: though game developers currently systematically ignore a large part of the populace, allow them only token roles or use them completely out of proportion, that should be ignored because there's a risk that when more diverse characters were created, someone might be inspired to wrongly add a token character which might be offensive?

The way to deal with this is that game writers and artists take a hard look at their own possible bias, and create a more diverse cast in the first place. Ethnicities, sexes, builds, ages, subcultures, etc. Once there are explicit reasons to cut down on that diversity, *then* it should be adjusted for. Maybe the setting won't allow something, like a free black man in the United States in 1700s. Fine, make him a white German immigrant instead. Or maybe it turns out that for the sake of the plot, a character needs to be a crack shot with a rifle, and the original design where one of his arms is paralyzed is not going to be OK. Scratch the paralysis.

Or even that the developer decides that they "just want" a young, single and beautiful woman in a prominent NPC slot rather than a married middle-aged man. Maybe it's a gut feeling that the game will be more entertaining (craft) or better represent a vision (art). Or the same decision is made on the grounds that customer research shows the game will sell better (business). I'm not out to crucify anyone for making this kind of decision, but it's a lot better if it's made explicitly and with a sense of purpose.

The alternative is a cookie cutter cast of NPCs that originates from routine ("it's always been done this way") and unconscious developer bias. That's also when you get token characters: the cast starts to look too obviously homogenic, and the token characters are sprinkled on top as a band-aid.

This thread has an interesting point. I can only recall one set of lesbian characters up from memory in games, but this isn't so suprising to me. Characters in games are hard to make.

To be honest, I don't see more homosexual characters being included for a while in games, and there are two reasons:
1)Our society is uncomfortable with sexuality, a lot more so than with violence. And we're still working on the "violence in videogames" thing.
2)Sales. These days, games are big business, and risky ideas are hard to acquire funding for. It's safer to stick with conventional models than to break the mold, and risk offending people and losing money that you desperately need.

I had another thought, but it escapes me. I'll write more if it comes back.

Back up. The idea that there are few gay characters is based on the assumption that any character who doesn't do anything to suggest they are gay is straight. But who's to say that Master Chief, Gordon Freeman, Link, Samus Aran etc. are heterosexuals?

Someone above mentioned sexual tension between Gordon Freeman and Alyx Vance, but a) that's only implied, and b) it all comes from her side; Freeman, being the classic blank-canvas protagonist, makes no overt response, so for all we know Alyx's (implied) love could be unrequited: he might be pining for Barney.

(It's just an example. If one of the listed characters really does demonstrate their heterosexuality, ok, but it doesn't change my general point.)

On the OTHER hand...

Most games are about combat, and how many army commandos are openly homosexual?

Most games characters seem to be asexual; at least, unless there's a specific love interest for them. I've never played them, myself, but you could probably count the Fable games as having a fairly low-key representation of homosexuals (citation needed?). It would be difficult to have a gay character without having it feel forced and implemented specifically for sexual tension - probably not always something you're looking for in a character's dynamics.

Vamp in metal gear played for both teams if you get my drift (it was revealed in MGS2)

Yea! Lets make a game about marines! Or the navy! On a serious note I wouldn't care. As long as he doesn't thrust it in my face (bad pun). If he mentions hes gay or you see his boyfriend I won't care. Even male nudity wouldn't bother me. But if they start getting handsy and I'm in first person I would have to go rehabilatate myself through beer and porn.

EDIT: I notice that it could be homosexual as in the female sense and I have nothing against that. But I can't be bothered to change the post.

There are "gays and lesbians". Fable 2, Fallout 3, GTA4 (Bernie). Generally it's avoided because it's unimportant.

Most games have gravity...

OOH! Read that wrong!