Poll: California may ban gay teen 'conversion' therapy

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thethird0611:

Cecilthedarkknight_234:

Jegsimmons:

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1/10 either your are trying to rebuttal fox news headlines or your just trying to hard. I will keep it at this it is genetic who the hell chooses or wants to be gay due the amount of people out there that think like you? Being ousted by their parents, disowned, beat up at school, having a hard time to get a job, being called a "queer fag" online etc. No one willingly chooses that much mental break-down just to have sex with some of the same gender.

I gotta step in here real quick and say something. You sir have simply told everyone that the human brain doesnt have plasticity. Plasticity=changeable. I have my own bias on this subject, but im more not happy with you thinking we dont have a choice.

Ever heard of the Kinsey scale? Many people bring it up to prove a point of everyone having less than 100% straight or homosexual tendencies. What alot of people dont bring up is that we move on the scale throughout our life, with a trend toward heterosexuality as we get older (thats only a trend, not an absolute).

Causes of homosexuality? People will say biology, and that is true, chemical releases can sway a person to one way. The thing about those chemicals is that they can be regulated/changed by our own selves. Its not easssyyy, but we can change. How are those chemicals like that though? Its a cross from a few things. Biology from genetics (This is not saying theres a 'gay' gene, but if you biological dad and mum swayed toward homosexuality, theres a chance you will to), and life experiences. Life experiences change up the brain HUGELY.

So, theres my 2 cents after my understanding into my studies into the neuropsych side of psychology.

OT: If these camps can come up with results that prove they are working, as well as can pass an ethics board, then why shouldnt they be allowed to? But if it fails either one of those, throw em out.

EDIT: If I got anything wrong in here, please correct me politely. <------ Keyword

you just summed up what I was thinking so go to my newest post. However most of the time it's not a choice but a natural impulse due to the way a persons brain is wired at birth. No amount of therapy or correction will ever fix this with people that have that state of mind you would physically have to do brain surgery and figure out the cause if you wanted to say "cure being gay". However I will say this for the hell of it do I personally think some choose to be gay as a small rebuttal yeah I honestly do however lets say 15% of the group doesn't speak or cover the other 85% that genially act that way.

Jegsimmons:

ok, stop right there.

i am sick and damn tired of there always being a stupid ass 'bible belt' remark every time something controversial is brought up and some one doesn't agree with it because it doesn't fit there leftist agenda.

"What! people actually dont support the right to abortion! it must be the bible belt!"
"Those silly uneducated people with their guns in the bible belt!"
ect.

How about this?
Not everyone shares your opinion, not everyone agrees with what people think, not every right winger is religious or from the bible belt, not every person from the bible belt is a right winger or religious, and every time i hear someone use the term 'bible belt' to negatively stereotype people of a certain political or religious orientation, it makes me wonder where the real intolerant hicks are!

Yes the procedure is weird, yes people have the right to be gay, but at the same time, some parents may prefer there child to be straight because sometimes having a gay child....can be fucking weird! Its not like they are stoning them to death like in the mid east!

Wow, you really seem to have quite the persecution complex. Just because someone bashes your Big Book of Fairy Tales and Intolerance or criticises one of the theocratic, backwards southern states, it doesn't mean that they are bashing you.

They bash you because you think that your unfounded beliefs should be forced onto everyone (gay marriage thread) and because you think that being gay is a choice (despite overwhelming scientific consensus to the contrary).

Good, parents forcing their children into "conversion therapy" are causing serious and fundamental damage to children for life. Conversion therapy is a load of crap that doesn't work and basically just savages your mental health.

Cecilthedarkknight_234:

thethird0611:

Cecilthedarkknight_234:

......

...

you just summed up what I was thinking so go to my newest post. However most of the time it's not a choice but a natural impulse due to the way a persons brain is wired at birth. No amount of therapy or correction will ever fix this with people that have that state of mind you would physically have to do brain surgery and figure out the cause if you wanted to say "cure being gay". However I will say this for the hell of it do I personally think some choose to be gay as a small rebuttal yeah I honestly do however lets say 15% of the group doesn't speak or cover the other 85% that genially act that way.

You missed the total point of my post. The brain has plasticity! It is able to be changed! We are not hardwired from birth. It constantly evolves with our interactions and experiences. Why do you think therapy in other fields work? You change the way the neurons interact.

You know what causes resistance to drugs? (or one of the factors?). When you take a drug to release, say, AcH, the AcH goes between the neurons and fires off the next neuron. After you take that drug for a while, the post synaptic neuron grows more dendrites (the receiver). So that means you need more drugs to get the same effect. Simple example of very very very basic changes of the brains wiring.

Also, with most research, brain surgery isnt used (well hell, humans are rarely used).

thethird0611:
Yeah, I should of put that out there a bit more. I was more popping in about plasticity there. You are right though. There a quite a few studies that predict/correlate homosexuality, but nothing concrete. I am glad though that someones sees the changeability, and I quite agree with you about the difficulty. Hell, its hard for people to just quit smoking.

Quitting smoking is a very different beast. That's less a matter of changing something in your brain than it is removing a chemical dependency. It's only really applicable if just "being gay" generates a specific chemical that straight people don't have that you'd then have to train your brain to going without.

It would actually be quite a bit simpler, and would allow for "gay treatments" to actually be viable. You'd just use similar methods to what is already in use for smokers and alcoholics (though obviously it would have to be tweaked somewhat). Which, while a remote possibility, is unlikely due to the amount of research into exactly that that has been conducted.

Honestly, we're not likely to have any major breakthroughs in "what causes homosexuality" until there's a few cases of identical twins with opposing sexualities. Surprises can always happen though, so we'll see eventually I'm sure.

The Plunk:

Jegsimmons:

ok, stop right there.

i am sick and damn tired of there always being a stupid ass 'bible belt' remark every time something controversial is brought up and some one doesn't agree with it because it doesn't fit there leftist agenda.

"What! people actually dont support the right to abortion! it must be the bible belt!"
"Those silly uneducated people with their guns in the bible belt!"
ect.

How about this?
Not everyone shares your opinion, not everyone agrees with what people think, not every right winger is religious or from the bible belt, not every person from the bible belt is a right winger or religious, and every time i hear someone use the term 'bible belt' to negatively stereotype people of a certain political or religious orientation, it makes me wonder where the real intolerant hicks are!

Yes the procedure is weird, yes people have the right to be gay, but at the same time, some parents may prefer there child to be straight because sometimes having a gay child....can be fucking weird! Its not like they are stoning them to death like in the mid east!

Wow, you really seem to have quite the persecution complex. Just because someone bashes your Big Book of Fairy Tales and Intolerance or criticises one of the theocratic, backwards southern states, it doesn't mean that they are bashing you.

They bash you because you think that your unfounded beliefs should be forced onto everyone (gay marriage thread) and because you think that being gay is a choice (despite overwhelming scientific consensus to the contrary).

i dont mind criticism, what i do mind is immature people like you referring to my belief and religion as a fairy tale. or claiming we are theocratic. learn what a theocracy is, and then learn what certain 'book of fairy tales' defined western civilization as we know.

its the immature assholes you have to act like they're cool insulting another belief.
you my friend dont know shit about my religion, you know as much about i as those westboro whack jobs who contradict the messages in it. My religion is about tolerance, even if they do differ from you. And just so you know, i am not against gay marriage, i support civil unions for all people.
what im against is people who are so single minded and hypocritical they make both sides look equally bigoted.

secondly, there is no scientific consensus on the gay gene, thats bullshit. everyone knows that. and i find it insulting to gay people, because it suggest they are weak willed and cant make a choice for themselves. Thats why i like the idea of sexuality being a choice, because it makes who ever chooses what, a strong willed individual.

http://www.onenewsnow.com/Culture/Default.aspx?id=205608

http://www.opposingviews.com/arguments/science-doesnt-support-the-gay-gene-theory

thethird0611:

Cecilthedarkknight_234:

thethird0611:

...

you just summed up what I was thinking so go to my newest post. However most of the time it's not a choice but a natural impulse due to the way a persons brain is wired at birth. No amount of therapy or correction will ever fix this with people that have that state of mind you would physically have to do brain surgery and figure out the cause if you wanted to say "cure being gay". However I will say this for the hell of it do I personally think some choose to be gay as a small rebuttal yeah I honestly do however lets say 15% of the group doesn't speak or cover the other 85% that genially act that way.

You missed the total point of my post. The brain has plasticity! It is able to be changed! We are not hardwired from birth. It constantly evolves with our interactions and experiences. Why do you think therapy in other fields work? You change the way the neurons interact.

You know what causes resistance to drugs? (or one of the factors?). When you take a drug to release, say, AcH, the AcH goes between the neurons and fires off the next neuron. After you take that drug for a while, the post synaptic neuron grows more dendrites (the receiver). So that means you need more drugs to get the same effect. Simple example of very very very basic changes of the brains wiring.

Also, with most research, brain surgery isnt used (well hell, humans are rarely used).

i should say i know the Resistance to drugs i take some myself lets just for y disorder "i will be the guinea pig here". The mind does build x amount Resistance over time to that chemical release say that my dopamine levels are to low and it's used to bring them up. Over a course of five years I have to completely change my meds for y disorder because of the resistance that was built up.

My mind has also evolved or changed over time due to reading to gain larges amounts of information from the net and working a job for six years. However it's different for person's sexuality take transgender for example where the brain develops as female or male but the body does the complete opposite instead. That can not be changed no matter of yelling, therapy or drugs can change the way a person's brain gets wired. However your brain has the option to change if you let over time just like my views on so many issues.

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