Create a hostile faction in a modern fps

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Near-ish future servant and military robots fighting their enslavement by mankind. They'd be portrayed tragically. For extra variety, instead of the expected New York, use Japan as the setting - you can still get an American protagonist by having the United States intervene in the conflict.

Simonism451:
A coalition of Israeli and Iranian forces who assault the US east coast. Nobody would see that one coming.

Even better, the WEST coast.

OT: The Aussies suddenly quarantine themselves without any warning. Emergency scouting dropship drops you in Melbourne to see what happened, only to find out the fauna AND flora have finally taken over.

Warning: Harder than Dark Souls.

The Vatican.

Fed up with all the heathens of the world havind protected sex and flaunting blatant aitheism in their faces, they start a secret army of assassin priests, equipped with acid holy water and hidden blades in their crosses (standard field equipment); as well as secret intelligence inside the most prominent PR companies, subverting public opinion on freedom of belief. They also have a highly trained (quite possible brainwashed) IT division, focused on spreading libel about important officials, and hacking government databases.

What I would personally like is a very limited conflict over an area of maybe 300 square miles, tops, set in a single country embroiled in civil war. The country is named and the conflict seems realistic enough, but there is no real question of morality brought into it: you just happen to be on one side rather than the other (perhaps the losing Government side, fighting off rebels as they push you back).
Then about 2/3's of the way in, the NATO intervenes against your side, and so you are now fighting NATO.

The main difference here is that you play as the losing side: every single mission you manage to complete, and yet despite your battles, the war is lost more and more, and the ending has you finally being shot and killed.

I'd pull a revolt plot, where a faction of the US military broke away from the main and is actively trying to overthrow the government. Backed by civilian militias they have split the country into a new civil war and other nations are actively trying to either help the proper government or support the rebels. Would make for an interesting game where no side is really "good." Better yet have the player choose who to side with based on the propaganda provided by both sides.

Tom_green_day:
Cannibal rednecks obviously. Or Americans, a game where they are the enemy that actually has good gameplay.

The AI would be overpowered cause we would be bombing the shit outta you

Maybe this is the Rum and Coke I just drank talking but you know what? Screw it. Lets kick the offensive shock value into high gear.

An extremist, Right Wing survivalist, anti government militia.

We all think about it, particularly us liberal leaning Americans. Imagine the catharsis of playing a soldier and fighting against some right wing extremists militia that's trying to overthrow the guv'ment with delusions of big brother and a war on Christians. Its not all that hard to imagine. And while it would be TERRIBLE for the state of political discourse, it would be pretty damn fun to play.

I think you kinda go the Cobra Commander or Ultimate Dr. Doom route...or to a lesser extent the "ten rings" from Iron Man.

Essentially create a faction not defined by national or racial boundaries controlled by a leader who actively seeks out the disenfranchised of the general populace while keeping a public persona of a legitimate multinational businessman.

Set the game several years after the enemy faction has come public, they're recognized as a threat but the extent to which their leadership has swithin the governments and businesses of the world is unknown or unconfirmed. Game starts within hours of the leader finally playing his hand, most if not all of his sleeper agents go live and start creating mass anarchy.

blah blah blah, grab some guns and make everyone who isn't you die.

Halflings! Half-demons, half-human.
Or, I dunno, elves? Dwarves? Orcs? I can do this all day!!

The Infiltraitors: A very secretive orginization exclusive to descendants of an ancient order of warriors. Known for their hacking and stealth abilities, they are also very handy in regular gunfights. True-blooded members are able to disperse their entire bodies into the shadows around so they can envelop their foes quickly and quietly. They are not afriad to use brutality to interrogate captives. Completely random, made-up, and interesting...

Year 2241. Mars and Earth are in a war brought on by Earths smug sense of superiority. They think they are better than the men and women of Mars and they resent that to the point of invasion. Who would of thought that within 100 short years a simple colony would grow to rival the might of Earth. But that does not matter now soldier. Gear up, earth needs us.

Man fighting man. A hatred and a discriminatory view of the other just because of the dirt ball they live on. How human.

ccdohl:

Why is it so bad for folks who happen to be brown skinned to be the enemies in games? If you are trying to base your game in a modern military setting, and you need a lot of enemies to fill up your levels, there are really not too many places to look. Africa, Asia, South America, and the Middle East are sort of the only places that a modern military could realistically be conceived to need to fight. Maybe Mexico, but you'd still just be fighting brown skinned people, which is bad for some reason, right? There just aren't any European terrorist states.

I mean, you can make it right wing nutjobs or a PMC or something, but the scope of the story would have to be pretty small.

All of this is assuming, of course, that the protagonist would be from the United States or some other western nation.

That was actually my point with this thread; since I've noticed a lot of people have complained about brown skinned enemies but I couldn't really make up a semi-realistic scenario outside of the locations you mentioned.

As for PMC:s I don't think that would really work because having a PMC as the main enemy runs the risk of creating a new ridiculous Umbrella Corporation.

HellsingerAngel:
So this is my crossroads: is the question tailored to the western world as a whole just the United States who anybody is a minority if they aren't pure, white bred American?

Mostly the US since that's the country most fps are based upon.

sibrenfetter:
I would love to see a game where Europe is being invaded by America and we have to fight back.

Done aaaand,

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Company_of_Heroes

done.

But you have to play as the Nazis *tear*.

And the Americans were pretty crap at invading, they only won through quantity, they had neither the best equipment nor best tactics. If they had fought as many of the Wehrmacht for as long as the Russians did on the Eastern Front, they'd have lost almost as many personnel.

Well several games have done US-military forces, actually one of the earliest FPS games, Half Life had the USMC as principal antagonists aaaand, didn't really do much to be honest. It might as well have been contrived circumstances that the Spetznaz had occupied the facility.

Really it was just hard to understand the motivation, USMC like to see they can take on anything and be the heroes, gunning down twee old scientists just seems implausible. It's just like... why?

It always just seemed like they were being manipulated or brainwashed by G-man. I think one way it could make sense is if it combined it with the plot of The Thing, how super dangerous aliens can perfectly mimic humans and a few get into the marines' trust then attack and kill a load of them. This then makes the Marines super suspicious of all the staff at Black Mesa and it only takes a nudge from G-Man to convince them all the staff are shape-shifters and must be contained and killed if necessary.

But Half Life 1 never explores that angle, it just takes the X-Files route of "herp a derp, guberment ordered me to round up and kill unarmed civilians, I don't care if I risk court martial for following what's clearly an illegal order".

Really, that's what I want, a plausible antagonist. Where it makes sense why they are trying to kill me, and an INTERESTING reason. The current situation:

>Enemy is interesting
>Enemy's antagonism makes sense

Pick one.

At the moment, any attempts to make interesting enemies have made ones that don't make sense. You can have the very boring and predictable Taliban forces or contrived circumstances why you're fighting the whole US army.

Tom_green_day:
Or Americans, a game where they are the enemy that actually has good gameplay.

Not singling you out in particular (okay, I am) but that's hardly original.

Here's a list where the combat opponents in shooters are Americans (not including zombies or criminal gangs):
-Half Life 1
-Half Life Blue Shift
-Every GTA game
-Every Saints Row game
-Half the games in COD multiplayer (one team is American, the other OpFor)
-The final act of Modern Warfare 2 in particular
-Spec Ops the Line
-Prototype 1 & 2
-Kane and Lynch
-Mirror's Edge (clearly in America, and way more shooting in this game than there should be)
-Red Faction: Guerilla (the EDF all have distinct American Dialect)
-One third of the classes in Team Fortress 2
-Bioshock (not technically part of the United States, but founded by Americans)
-Crysis 2
-Metal Gear Solid 4
-Half the Tomb Raider games (Lara shoots her way into Area 51, killing scores of US servicemen for no other reason than to steal their stuff)

These aren't obscure games. There is no shortage at all of games where Americans are the opponents.

I think it's simply the case where people DON'T NOTICE when the opponents are American, it just doesn't register even when gunning down even American cops and US servicemen. it's like watching Wile E Coyote get hit by an anvil.

I remember, way back in 1990's there was a brief slight controversy over Lara Croft being quite so gung ho killing US servicemen. But then everyone told them to sit-down-and-shut-up, it's just a game, it's not even trying to be real-to-life. I'm sorry there isn't a steady supply of Nazis throughout history that can always be there as the "ideal bad guy" as the Indiana Jones movies showed they were so good for.

An entire nation of Manbearpigs.

Liberal Zombies

They are just like the Nazi ones but their uniforms aren't as swish.

In 2020 a group of angered 18-20 year olds feel that they can topple the government due to training they received from playing Call of Duty since they were 7. You are a part of the military force who is tasked with taking down these rebels. The game is extremely easy because your opponents have no clue on how to operate a gun or how to aim since they used CoD as a training manual so they try to kill you by doing "leet 420 no scope sniper kills", running up to try and knife you, and bitch and moan that all their team mates are dying because of lag and hackers.

Why does it have to be a military shooter? An FPS where you play as an idealistic rookie cop, who gets dragged in way over her head into a world full of corruption, gang violence, serial killers and organised crime.

sibrenfetter:
I would love to see a game where Europe is being invaded by America and we have to fight back.

ccdohl:

Why is it so bad for folks who happen to be brown skinned to be the enemies in games?

It is not so much the brown skin as it is the fact that in pretty much all modern shooters we play as the American hero saving the world by going to these arab/russian/african countries. What I find especially grating sometimes is how this is portrayed. CoD MW3 has a good example. I am being attacked by 50 arabs. My team of 3 kills all of them because they blindly run into open fire, my American heros do the same but bullets merely make them trip while the enemies drop like flies. I get hit by 10 bullets, crouch down for a couple of seconds and voila all healthy again. Now I understand those type of things are game mechanics but it is getting tiring seeing always the same American soldiers cracking wisecracks inbetween firefights where they easily killed a 100 oppenents, took 50 bullets in their knees and are on top of the world.

So the mechanics themselves seem to be making a statement on race and/or nationality. I can see that to a certain extent. The Americans are basically invincible killing machines and the enemies are just there to stand in the way of their righteous cause.

While glorifying American soldiers doesn't bother me the way that it does a lot of people on this forum, I can certainly see why it might seem a bit over the top, especially since these games are so popular (I don't play them, so I don't know much about them, to be perfectly honest.)

Darren716:
In 2020 a group of angered 18-20 year olds feel that they can topple the government due to training they received from playing Call of Duty since they were 7. You are a part of the military force who is tasked with taking down these rebels. The game is extremely easy because your opponents have no clue on how to operate a gun or how to aim since they used CoD as a training manual so they try to kill you by doing "leet 420 no scope sniper kills", running up to try and knife you, and bitch and moan that all their team mates are dying because of lag and hackers.

Sounds awesome. Would buy or participate IRL.

A militia composed of former inmates. Through unspecified circumstances, all the biggest prisons in the world riot, successfully, due to some over-powering influence, band together, and wage a guerrilla war against the very concept of unified government and law enforcement

An army of 10ft demon cockroaches, that have extra plated husks, breath fire, and shoot lazers from their eyes

Tom_green_day:
Americans, a game where they are the enemy that actually has good gameplay.

See, I think that if you had a developer that actually cared about making an interesting game as opposed to techonoporn, you could have a really good game (speaking from a pure gameplay perspective) as an American force fighing insurgents. Look at Black Hawk Down or We Were Soldiers. Both deal with American forces fighting under-equipped natives, and they're both incredibly tense. You'd have a game where you're under fire from all sides, not sure when or if you're getting help, you can call down artillery and helicopters but it's not enough, every man you lose is one that you'll never get back and every man you kill is replaced in seconds. It wouldn't have to be jingoistic- We Were Soldiers is very respectful of its enemy and rather cynical about Vietnam. It's just that "modern military shooter" means "kill hundreds of people for slim justifications effortlessly with big explosions and robots."

For a modern, "realistic" FPS, I'd like to see terrorists who are actually portrayed as having sincere motives that a rational mind can comprehend. Now, that's not to say their methods are portrayed positively (because they're terrorists, you can't do that), but you can go "I see why they hold these beliefs even if they are using reprehensible methods in the name of them." Especially if they're contrasted with protagonists who are are portrayed as being flawed in their own way.

I'm sick of Manichean struggles, how about some genuine moral ambiguity?

Or let's go with a game that doesn't have that, but a more cartoonish one where the hostile faction is the good guys trying to stop you? Sort of like Dungeon Keeper, but an FPS.

On that lighter note, I'd like to see a lighter-hearted game with opponents who are painfully aware that they're antagonists in an FPS, and comment on this as best they can without breaking the fourth wall, and do things like run in terror when they're actually screwed, or when you're in a difficult situation they go "Holy shit, we can actually do this! CHARGE!"

ComradeJim270:
For a modern, "realistic" FPS, I'd like to see terrorists who are actually portrayed as having sincere motives that a rational mind can comprehend. Now, that's not to say their methods are portrayed positively (because they're terrorists, you can't do that), but you can go "I see why they hold these beliefs even if they are using reprehensible methods in the name of them." Especially if they're contrasted with protagonists who are are portrayed as being flawed in their own way.

I'm sick of Manichean struggles, how about some genuine moral ambiguity?

Or let's go with a game that doesn't have that, but a more cartoonish one where the hostile faction is the good guys trying to stop you? Sort of like Dungeon Keeper, but an FPS.

On that lighter note, I'd like to see a lighter-hearted game with opponents who are painfully aware that they're antagonists in an FPS, and comment on this as best they can without breaking the fourth wall, and do things like run in terror when they're actually screwed, or when you're in a difficult situation they go "Holy shit, we can actually do this! CHARGE!"

Whether it actually is or isn't, people will SEE moral dualism or they simply won't fight. People aren't going to risk their lives and fight so hard and kill if they don't think it's the right thing to do. They'll desert, or for a game they'll switch off. See people don't like being made to feel bad about their decisions or in future they just won't make their decisions.

War - where people suffer and die - can only exist with Manichean struggle, or at least the perception of one.

Avoiding a Manichean struggle just for the sake of it will come across as a "what a twist" kind of bullshit ending, and you just feel like a sucker, and idiot.

The thing is the zombies need to be insane cannibals beyond reasoning, not misunderstood, otherwise you are having a Shyamalan style twist at the cost of gameplay motivation, you can do that shit on film as you are just observing a character and like Macbeth you can see the protagonist do wrong. But tricking the player into doing wrong or telling them to do wrong and telling them off for it, the classic "you should kill them" then "you shouldn't have killed them... but the game wouldn't let you continue if you didn't" which makes them not want to play your game, or play it an not care.

The only way there can be Motivated conflict without moral dualism is taking out the negative consequences.

Team Fortress 2 is a pretty good Cartoonish approach to conflict, it doesn't clearly show one side as the bad guy, in fact it makes very clear through the lore that the divisions are extremely arbitrary of two brothers hiring mercs to secure inheritance of their father's fortune. Frankly, there is more likely to be a Team Fortress 2 movie than a Half Life movie, it's lore is almost as fleshed out as Portal or Half Life.

I think you'd like TF2.

It's strongly hinted that the Mercs are all subject to cloning technology, which is how multiples of the same individual can appear and live again after death, so death doesn't matter. Hence it's not a manichean struggle as the consequences of death are very clearly, brief comical discomfort of Wile E Coyote style death, then appear back at the spawn. In fact it's very much like a Tom and Jerry cartoon, huge explosions and dismemberment, they just look at the camera and go:

image

America would make for a great enemy

Like a capitalist Nazi-Germany sort of thing

Texan nationalists attempting to seperate from the Union, using violence. The protagonist is a US Army officer or a Marine or something taking part in a new US Civil War against what effectively amounts to an ultra-nationalist terrorist force. For added points the game could explore both sides of the conflict and maybe have another protagonist on the Seperatist side, and give both positive and negeative viewpoints from both characters.

Otherwise, a game set during the Troubles in Ireland - the protagonist could maybe be an IRA member fighting for what he/she percieves to be freedom for his/her homeland, or perhaps the character could be a British soldier (or even better, an MI5 operative) fighting or infiltrating locations in places like Belfast and Londonderry, and possibly even being present for the Omagh bombing. Key incidents such as the Birmingham bombing in the English Midlands could also be explored.

Not enough people know about the second one and how it still affects British politics in such a major way today, and the first one is always a possibility if enough people were to get on board such an ideal. That being said, I can't see any developer making a game about the Irish Troubles, since British developers would say it's too soon and too raw, and the USA wouldn't care because it's not another 'AMERICA! FUCK YEAH!' game praising the US troops. Apparently anything that isn't related to the USA in some way isn't worth bothering about or is completely incidental to American minds.

How about those people who like to protest at funerals? I would love a fps featuring them as primary villians.

HannesPascal:
Okay so the modern Call of Battlefield games generally have you situated in the middle east killing arabs or somewhere else running around shooting brown skinned people or russians. And it's kind of bugging me (and a lot of people on the escapist). Thing is I can't really make up who you should shoot in these games it's not like anyone would accept that Denmark started to conquer the world and you have to stop them.

So my question to you is:
Can you make up some enemy in a modern fps that isn't brown skinned, russian or something else that would count as a minority in the western world.

there you go....


fanatic patriotism.

i guess the "99%" should be enough

Two words

PANDAS!

No one will see it coming!

Maybe play as the Russians, defending the motherland from pesky Americans?

Or an army of Kim Jong Il clones attacking the team america headquarters!

Xanex:
How about those people who like to protest at funerals? I would love a fps featuring them as primary villians.

I play those missions in Saint Row like that. "Want to protest at a graveyard? How about an apache attack?!"

A private military company. Non radical and non religious terrorists. The crazy army of some crazy dictator. A crazy militant group of disgruntled american citizens.

rhizhim:

HannesPascal:
O-snip

there you go....


fanatic patriotism.

i guess the "99%" should be enough

That is awesome, except for when they detonate the bomb in public. It's as thought they're adding evil to them just to get you not to root for them, or just not want to kill them enough.

Zepherus14:
Two words

PANDAS!

No one will see it coming!

thats one word. or are you suggesting Dyscalculia would be your main villian.http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Dyscalculia
that sonofabitch claimed many good men and women...

A terrorist organization united by one non-religious ideology filled with members of every ethnicity.

lacktheknack:

Warning: Harder than Dark Souls.

Challenge accepte-wait you said flora also? Fuck that shit.

Yeah, the general debate is not just that the antagonist is <whatever>, its the protagonist is generally US/British/Australian on top, and caucasian on top of it. If you played a South Korean fighting North Koreans, no one'd probably bat an eye at it.

Beyond that, you could take any terrorist/dictator/warlord/militia/pirate to go send a spec ops team after even so, just keep race and religion out of the game of it. Its actually a bleed-over from the media in general referring to just use "extremist", "terrorist", "gang" etc, and always attaching religions or nationality on them. I'm generally surprised that the religious bodies in question don't outright pursue slander/libel suits, considering how incompatible most of these "extremist" actions are with the religious doctrines the media labels them under.

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