Boy Scouts to allow girls, starting in 2018

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http://www.cnn.com/2017/10/11/us/boy-scouts-will-allow-girls-to-join/index.html

http://www.npr.org/sections/thetwo-way/2017/10/11/557144847/in-major-shift-boy-scouts-says-it-will-begin-allowing-girls-to-join

The title is pretty self explanatory. I think it's a step in the right direction, but one of the concerning details I'm seeing is that the BSA is going to leave it up individual packs whether they want to remain all boys, go coed or create girl specific divisions.

Not entirely surprising, the GSUSA doesn't like this move, and has accused the BSA of essentially trying to poach girls to combat falling enrollment numbers.

Should just merge the Boy and Girl scouts organizations and make it just Scouts and stop with any sort of segregation, gender or otherwise.

maybe girls can actually do fun scout stuff now instead of selling cookies

Saelune:
Should just merge the Boy and Girl scouts organizations and make it just Scouts and stop with any sort of segregation, gender or otherwise.

I don't say this often, but I agree with what Saelune said. I'm definitely girls being able to join in Boy Scout activities...but I wonder if they'll bother changing the name to reflect the fact that there is no gender barrier. If not, this is pretty much symbolic, because what are the chances parents are going to sign up their daughters for Boy Scouts?

Seems crappy that they didn't consult the Girl Scouts about this, that it's just an attempt to swell dwindling attendance ranks- I somehow doubt that boys will be able to join the Girl Scouts. But I do understand one of the motives, that being making it easier for parents to simply drop off all of their children to one organization.

Jux:
Not entirely surprising, the GSUSA doesn't like this move, and has accused the BSA of essentially trying to poach girls to combat falling enrollment numbers.

Well, the girl scouts could always try to open up their ranks to boys. Or if they're so concerned that girls would want to join the BSA, they could always change what they do.

but one of the concerning details I'm seeing is that the BSA is going to leave it up individual packs whether they want to remain all boys, go coed or create girl specific divisions.

Well, a lot of troops are very localized and there's a very real concern that parents desiring a non-coed situation would rather pull their boys out and join some other organization.

Saelune:
Should just merge the Boy and Girl scouts organizations and make it just Scouts and stop with any sort of segregation, gender or otherwise.

The BSA and GSA are far too different politically and I don't see the marriage as a happy one.

@CM156: Then Boy Scouts should drop the boy part and be the inclusive one, until the Girl Scouts, surviving solely due to the cookies, eventually just becomes a cookie company.

thebobmaster:

I don't say this often, but I agree with what Saelune said.

Well, I mean, there is a difference between agreeing with me and saying you agree with me.

I agree with lots of people without ever stating it...because whats the point in a long quote chain of "I agree with your agreement of what I said"?

the December King:
Seems crappy that they didn't consult the Girl Scouts about this, that it's just an attempt to swell dwindling attendance ranks- I somehow doubt that boys will be able to join the Girl Scouts. But I do understand one of the motives, that being making it easier for parents to simply drop off all of their children to one organization.

Girl Scouts doesnt own the copyright to the concept of girls being scouts. I doubt Burger King needed to ask Taco Bell permission to sell Tacos. (Though dont equate that metaphor to what I think of this, since I think this is a good idea, I dont think BK Tacos is though)

the December King:
Seems crappy that they didn't consult the Girl Scouts about this, that it's just an attempt to swell dwindling attendance ranks- I somehow doubt that boys will be able to join the Girl Scouts. But I do understand one of the motives, that being making it easier for parents to simply drop off all of their children to one organization.

They're different organizations, they shouldn't have to consult them really?

Fairly similar reason the merge idea doesn't seem that good if you go below the surface, different people running them etc, not easy to just merge it. Not as if they're different branches of the same organization, they're different organizations

CM156:

but one of the concerning details I'm seeing is that the BSA is going to leave it up individual packs whether they want to remain all boys, go coed or create girl specific divisions.

Well, a lot of troops are very localized and there's a very real concern that parents desiring a non-coed situation would rather pull their boys out and join some other organization.

Real concern insofar as trying to keep maximum numbers really, not for getting rid of the silly gender segregation in the scouts

It's worth noting that there was already a co-ed Scouting program called Venture Scouts, which puts a greater emphasis on outdoor activities such as backpacking trips. That being said, I'm certainly not opposed to dropping the gender barriers in Scouting.

Jux:

The title is pretty self explanatory. I think it's a step in the right direction, but one of the concerning details I'm seeing is that the BSA is going to leave it up individual packs whether they want to remain all boys, go coed or create girl specific divisions.

Troops, not packs. Boy Scouts are divided into Troops, which are subdivided into Patrols. In Cub Scouts they're Packs and Dens.

undeadsuitor:
maybe girls can actually do fun scout stuff now instead of selling cookies

Believe it or not, Girl Scouts actually have the upper hand in that category. Girl Scouts sell cookies, Boy Scouts sell popcorn. The former is by far the better deal and usually more likely to actually be eaten.

Scouts in Australia have been co-ed for a while now.

Yes, sex occurs. No, I didn't get any of it.

The Decapitated Centaur:

CM156:

but one of the concerning details I'm seeing is that the BSA is going to leave it up individual packs whether they want to remain all boys, go coed or create girl specific divisions.

Well, a lot of troops are very localized and there's a very real concern that parents desiring a non-coed situation would rather pull their boys out and join some other organization.

Real concern insofar as trying to keep maximum numbers really, not for getting rid of the silly gender segregation in the scouts

Well, many of these scouting groups run through churches or other religious organizations, who don't want teenage boys and girls together in the woods with low amounts of adult supervision.

CM156:

The Decapitated Centaur:

CM156:

Well, a lot of troops are very localized and there's a very real concern that parents desiring a non-coed situation would rather pull their boys out and join some other organization.

Real concern insofar as trying to keep maximum numbers really, not for getting rid of the silly gender segregation in the scouts

Well, many of these scouting groups run through churches or other religious organizations, who don't want teenage boys and girls together in the woods with low amounts of adult supervision.

I mean, that's fairly silly regardless, but yes, I know, I acknowledged the point is keeping maximum numbers

Well GSUSA will never have to worry since they're the only legal crack dealers in America.

CM156:
Well, many of these scouting groups run through churches or other religious organizations, who don't want teenage boys and girls together in the woods with low amounts of adult supervision.

But...where else we we get our found footage horror movies from?

Asita:
Troops, not packs. Boy Scouts are divided into Troops, which are subdivided into Patrols. In Cub Scouts they're Packs and Dens.

You're right. As a former scout I remembered that, but when I was reading the article they stated 'packs', and I got to thinking my memory was just faulty on the terminology. Good catch.

Why the hell would you call it BOY scouts...if GIRLS are in it.

It's time to abolish both organizations and just combine them into one Scouts group.

Tanis:

It's time to abolish both organizations and just combine them into one Scouts group.

So the Venture Scouts?

Thaluikhain:

CM156:
Well, many of these scouting groups run through churches or other religious organizations, who don't want teenage boys and girls together in the woods with low amounts of adult supervision.

But...where else we we get our found footage horror movies from?

High School?

...Actually, come to think of it, that might be amusing.

*Camera turns on and pivots to the face of a teary kid* "To whoever finds this, know that we did this for extra credit. We didn't count on getting lost on the field. I don't even know how we got lost on a field. But it's been three days now. I don't think we're even in the same school and...they're hunting us." *sudden drumming* "Oh god...they're coming." *Camera falls to the ground, and the kid's fleeing form is glimpsed...followed several seconds later by a swarm of cheerful kindergarteners.* "HELP!"

Zontar:

Tanis:

It's time to abolish both organizations and just combine them into one Scouts group.

So the Venture Scouts?

Yeah, they already do that. Sea Scouts too.

I think its maybe a problem with how many view the girl scouts today compared to how it started. I know little of the program outside of give me a Ton of Samoas to keep me happy. If I had to guess, maybe they want to do more rough and tough stuff and they don't have much of that in the other?

I think in general there should be groups for girls, groups for boys, and a mix. Frankly guys are different from girls and vice versa in a lot of ways and need their own groups to do their things. But we are not a mono gendered race so mixing the two is also awesome as there are plenty of things we can do hand in hand (like vote for anyone else in three years). Also, having worked at a scout camp over several summers, you don't know how much you miss femininity...till you remember both genders' showers share the same drains, and you only have one guy with Jesus hair so you can't blame him every time it clogs.

Are the girl scouts now recieving boys or is this one of the cases people only care about inclusivity if it's male organizations?

inu-kun:
Are the girl scouts now recieving boys or is this one of the cases people only care about inclusivity if it's male organizations?

The Girl Scouts and Boy Scouts are separate organizations.

Apparently the Girl Scouts accept trans-girls, but not boys who identify as boys.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/transgender-boy-allowed-to-join-girl-scouts/news-story/b5035dd98c227015f0aaad1773658ad2

Edit: Though the article keeps referring to them as a boy :/

Saelune:

inu-kun:
Are the girl scouts now recieving boys or is this one of the cases people only care about inclusivity if it's male organizations?

The Girl Scouts and Boy Scouts are separate organizations.

Apparently the Girl Scouts accept trans-girls, but not boys who identify as boys.

http://www.dailytelegraph.com.au/transgender-boy-allowed-to-join-girl-scouts/news-story/b5035dd98c227015f0aaad1773658ad2

Edit: Though the article keeps referring to them as a boy :/

[pat on the shoulder over the web]. Give them time. Give them time. If I can get over my shock of Jesu Okaku turning into a good looking guy, so can they over the subject.

I don't really know what the scouts do. Playing in the woods apparently. I think getting rid of the gender segregation here is a good thing.

CM156:
Well, many of these scouting groups run through churches or other religious organizations, who don't want teenage boys and girls together in the woods with low amounts of adult supervision.

Do these people believe they'll prevent these teenagers' having sex? I mean it might work in some cases but I doubt it'll work all that often. More importantly I don't see why you would want to do that to begin with. Now you've succeeded in denying your teenagers a good time. What did that accomplish? Just tell them to use a condom and do it with consent from both parties and leave them to figure out the rest. That seems like a more healthy and realistic approach.

In non-retarded countries there are no Boy scouts and Girl scouts. They are just Scouts.

The Decapitated Centaur:

They're different organizations, they shouldn't have to consult them really?

Fairly similar reason the merge idea doesn't seem that good if you go below the surface, different people running them etc, not easy to just merge it. Not as if they're different branches of the same organization, they're different organizations

I wasn't aware of that- it just seemed logical to me that they were part of the same brand.

Saelune:

the December King:
Seems crappy that they didn't consult the Girl Scouts about this, that it's just an attempt to swell dwindling attendance ranks- I somehow doubt that boys will be able to join the Girl Scouts. But I do understand one of the motives, that being making it easier for parents to simply drop off all of their children to one organization.

Girl Scouts doesnt own the copyright to the concept of girls being scouts. I doubt Burger King needed to ask Taco Bell permission to sell Tacos. (Though dont equate that metaphor to what I think of this, since I think this is a good idea, I dont think BK Tacos is though)

I mean, it might not own the copyright, but it certainly best represents the concept. Also? I really did assume the organizations were both more intertwined/related than they actually are. My bad.

Asita:

Thaluikhain:

CM156:
Well, many of these scouting groups run through churches or other religious organizations, who don't want teenage boys and girls together in the woods with low amounts of adult supervision.

But...where else we we get our found footage horror movies from?

High School?

...Actually, come to think of it, that might be amusing.

*Camera turns on and pivots to the face of a teary kid* "To whoever finds this, know that we did this for extra credit. We didn't count on getting lost on the field. I don't even know how we got lost on a field. But it's been three days now. I don't think we're even in the same school and...they're hunting us." *sudden drumming* "Oh god...they're coming." *Camera falls to the ground, and the kid's fleeing form is glimpsed...followed several seconds later by a swarm of cheerful kindergarteners.* "HELP!"

Sounds like 13 Reasons Why.

Pseudonym:
Do these people believe they'll prevent these teenagers' having sex? I mean it might work in some cases but I doubt it'll work all that often. More importantly I don't see why you would want to do that to begin with. Now you've succeeded in denying your teenagers a good time. What did that accomplish? Just tell them to use a condom and do it with consent from both parties and leave them to figure out the rest. That seems like a more healthy and realistic approach.

It does seem more healthy and realistic, but that's never been an important point.

bastardofmelbourne:
Scouts in Australia have been co-ed for a while now.

Yes, sex occurs. No, I didn't get any of it.

Life can be so unfair!

I wonder if over-all enrollment has steadied, declined, increased in Australia.

Isn't the point of gender segregation for the scouts so that they can have a fairly single gender space where they don't feel social pressure involved in such a mix?

Have the Australian scouts become Gynocentric, dropping historically stereo typically male activities in favor of activities meant to feminize them?

Not sure where I can even start looking for information on this.

Gorfias:
Have the Australian scouts become Gynocentric, dropping historically stereo typically male activities in favor of activities meant to feminize them?

Yeah, I'm going to guess it's a "no" there, because that's verging on absurd hysteria.

http://www.scouts.com.au/

Looks like the same old, though seemingly with more of an emphasis on abseiling and canoeing.

Saelune:
Should just merge the Boy and Girl scouts organizations and make it just Scouts and stop with any sort of segregation, gender or otherwise.

I said this back when I was in scouts. I was 8 and now I'm 30.

Besides, whats the worst that can happen?

Gorfias:
Have the Australian scouts become Gynocentric, dropping historically stereo typically male activities in favor of activities meant to feminize them?

Uhhhh... u wut m8?

Can we get some context to where the hell this came from?

Gorfias:
Have the Australian scouts become Gynocentric, dropping historically stereo typically male activities in favor of activities meant to feminize them?

Dude, you need to admit to yourself that you have some unsorted baggage when it comes to women. This is not a healthy thing to think.

Avnger:

Uhhhh... u wut m8?

Can we get some context to where the hell this came from?

In the Manosphere. Can't find the particular youtube video I watched about it today but it brought up concerns of mine when I first heard this was happening. There is a huge concern out there that women want/have always wanted to shut down communication by men to men. That they are invading male spaces to keep them from talking to each other. An early example:

https://www.gopetition.com/famous-petitions-in-history/232/the-women-s-petition-against-coffee-1674.html

Ostensbily anti coffee, the Manosphere thinks it actually anti-male communicating together.

The video worried that not only was a male space being invaded (I'm hesitant to agree with this: The Boy Scouts are hemorrhaging membership. This may have been done to bolster it). Another issue the video brought up I didn't think about: will female membership mean that the boys start getting lectured in "toxic masculinity". Etc.

There's an argument that there should be no boy and girl's scouts but just scouts. Sounds good, but I worry that boy's may still need a male space to just be themselves.

BeetleManiac:

Dude, you need to admit to yourself that you have some unsorted baggage when it comes to women. This is not a healthy thing to think.

Brother (sister?) you said a mouth full. EDIT: About the baggage. And my thoughts and feelings sure as hell don't seem healthy. But the concerns I reference, in a world were "man spreading" is a thing and cat calling in France may soon violate criminal law? Etc. My advice to men and boys: be vigilant.

EDIT: This is one of the videos I did see today...

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