EDGE of Asshattery

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As my surname is Edge am I due a law suit? great article

Tim Langdell:
Snip

I swear if this is real I am going to fucking drop.

Tim Langdell:
I've been reading all over the Internet about what you people are saying about me and my company. I've seen death-threats and posting of my personal information on some websites, although this site seems to be obsessed with dealing bodily harm more than anything else. Do you normally post threats and links to personal info on this message board? I got five calls this morning from people saying they are from various websites, and that they are "out to get me."

You are sorely misinformed. But it seems like people are out for blood rather than the truth.

I'll be contacting the administrator of this site to have this insulting content removed.

If you are real, then I am not glad to meet you. Please quietly delete your account and leave. You are not wanted here.

That's my opinion and I'm sticking to it!-j0z

Susan Arendt:

Neonbob:

Susan Arendt:
Hey, hey, let's stop wishing physical harm on the guy, ok? Karma, people, karma.

How about wishing horrible mental anguish on him?
It would seem fitting, seeing what he's doing to others...
Seriously, trademarking a word? No. Just...no.

Hmmmm...under the circumstances, that would seem fair. Yes, you may wish mental anguish on him.

Am I allowed to wish mental anguish on him if what I wished for might "accidentally" come true?

Tim Langdell:
I've been reading all over the Internet about what you people are saying about me and my company. I've seen death-threats and posting of my personal information on some websites, although this site seems to be obsessed with dealing bodily harm more than anything else. Do you normally post threats and links to personal info on this message board? I got five calls this morning from people saying they are from various websites, and that they are "out to get me."

You are sorely misinformed. But it seems like people are out for blood rather than the truth.

I'll be contacting the administrator of this site to have this insulting content removed.

Sir, I believe you are sorely misinformed. This is not defamation of character, this is reporting facts that are supported by links to off-site material of a man engaging in cutthroat business tactics; you have no right to censor this site, you have no power to censor the 'net. An Editorial presents a supported opinion on current events. This is what this is. You are not above criticism.

Granted, some of the posts here are not friendly. But there's a little thing called free speech, and the Internet is its bastion. You. Shall not. Pass.

Flying-Emu:
Sir, I believe you are sorely misinformed. This is not defamation of character, this is reporting facts that are supported by links to off-site material of a man engaging in cutthroat business tactics; you have no right to censor this site, you have no power to censor the 'net. An Editorial presents a supported opinion on current events. This is what this is. You are not above criticism.

Granted, some of the posts here are not friendly. But there's a little thing called free speech, and the Internet is its bastion. You. Shall not. Pass.

So, you're openly admitting that your site can post death threats?

As much as I agree with you on everything in your post (you are 100% correct), I don't feel it's right that I'm being outed in such a way. Your site has stepped into a story, read one side of it, then assumed that I am every bit as evil as the devil himself.

You can claim "free speech" all you want, but that doesn't change the fact that you have ignored the truth.

Tim Langdell:

Flying-Emu:
Sir, I believe you are sorely misinformed. This is not defamation of character, this is reporting facts that are supported by links to off-site material of a man engaging in cutthroat business tactics; you have no right to censor this site, you have no power to censor the 'net. An Editorial presents a supported opinion on current events. This is what this is. You are not above criticism.

Granted, some of the posts here are not friendly. But there's a little thing called free speech, and the Internet is its bastion. You. Shall not. Pass.

So, you're openly admitting that your site can post death threats?

As much as I agree with you on everything in your post (you are 100% correct), I don't feel it's right that I'm being outed in such a way. Your site has stepped into a story, read one side of it, then assumed that I am every bit as evil as the devil himself.

You can claim "free speech" all you want, but that doesn't change the fact that you have ignored the truth.

Did I say that they can post death threats? No. In fact, I myself am surprised that several of these people haven't been approached by the moderators. But requesting the article be removed is ridiculous, offensive, and frankly angering. If you meant the offensive comments, then by all means contact nilcypher, wilsoncrazybed, or Alex_P.

Also, the site has not stepped into the story. Shamus Young did. So... yeah. If anything, your complaints should be registered to Mr. Young rather than Pitts.

Tim Langdell:

So, you're openly admitting that your site can post death threats?

As much as I agree with you on everything in your post (you are 100% correct), I don't feel it's right that I'm being outed in such a way. Your site has stepped into a story, read one side of it, then assumed that I am every bit as evil as the devil himself.

You can claim "free speech" all you want, but that doesn't change the fact that you have ignored the truth.

Actually, death threats are looked down on, and are a report-worthy offense here on the Escapist. It's just that nobody has reported any of these users, because while they might not wish you death, they can't help but sympathize with the negative veiwpoint that these users hold towards you. Also, you have been insulted: big whoop.

This is an editorial: a piece of opinion, backed up by facts. If you feel that you have another side to the story, by all means publish a paper with the details: we would await it with bated breath. Your actions would seem to indicate that you have yourself ignored some truths: such as the truth that you should act as you wish to be treated.

Flying-Emu:
Did I say that they can post death threats? No. In fact, I myself am surprised that several of these people haven't been approached by the moderators. But requesting the article be removed is ridiculous, offensive, and frankly angering. If you meant the offensive comments, then by all means contact nilcypher, wilsoncrazybed, or Alex_P.

Also, the site has not stepped into the story. Shamus Young did. So... yeah. If anything, your complaints should be registered to Mr. Young rather than Pitts.

I find it quite comical that you'd say that the site hasn't stepped into the story. And if Mr. Young wants to write content like that, then yes, he is representing the site and setting an example. And over one-hundred comments, some of which are threats, leads me to assume the site has stepped into the story and agrees with what the author has written.

Tim Langdell:

Flying-Emu:
Did I say that they can post death threats? No. In fact, I myself am surprised that several of these people haven't been approached by the moderators. But requesting the article be removed is ridiculous, offensive, and frankly angering. If you meant the offensive comments, then by all means contact nilcypher, wilsoncrazybed, or Alex_P.

Also, the site has not stepped into the story. Shamus Young did. So... yeah. If anything, your complaints should be registered to Mr. Young rather than Pitts.

I find it quite comical that you'd say that the site hasn't stepped into story. And if Mr. Young wants to write content like that, then yes, he is representing the site and setting an example. And over one-hundred comments, some of which are threats, leads me to assume the site has stepped into the story and agrees with what the author has written.

I find it comical that you want to identify the site with its community. The site is not the community. The community is not the site. Mr. Young didn't do more than insult you in his article, which is perfectly legitimate, legal, and politically correct. What the community says is beyond his control. Oh, and notice what Susan Arendt, a staff member of the Escapist, said.

Susan Arendt:
Hey, hey, let's stop wishing physical harm on the guy, ok? Karma, people, karma.

Therefore, the site is not the one to blame. They are discouraging this behavior. Have faith that they will punish it.

The Escapist publishes Young's works because they A) Agree with what he says or B) finds his viewpoints interesting enough to include in their pages. You can get offended all you want, I don't see it doing you much good. I'll give you that the site has 'stepped into' the story. So here's your chance.

Explain your actions. Go on, I'm waiting. Justify your rabid attacks on creative, low-budget indie developers. Explain why you waited until this man could not legally defend himself.

Flying-Emu:
I find it comical that you want to identify the site with its community. The site is not the community. The community is not the site. Mr. Young didn't do more than insult you in his article, which is perfectly legitimate, legal, and politically correct. What the community says is beyond his control. Oh, and notice what Susan Arendt, a staff member of the Escapist, said.

Flying-Emu:
Therefore, the site is not the one to blame. They are discouraging this behavior. Have faith that they will punish it.

I've looked around on this site, and it seems people are only being punished if the staff does not agree with them, correct? These replies are days old now, why the wait? Oh, yeah, the staff agrees with the threats. Otherwise they'd take them out, right?

Flying-Emu:
The Escapist publishes Young's works because they A) Agree with what he says or B) finds his viewpoints interesting enough to include in their pages. You can get offended all you want, I don't see it doing you much good. I'll give you that the site has 'stepped into' the story. So here's your chance.

My chance to what? You haven't really stated anything here that I already knew.

Flying-Emu:
Explain your actions. Go on, I'm waiting. Justify your rabid attacks on creative, low-budget indie developers. Explain why you waited until this man could not legally defend himself.

I'm sick of putting this on every single site. I'd rather wait and publish one big paper on it instead of rushing into things, seeing that you people attack the smallest thing.

Tim Langdell:
*snip*

I have bookmarked EDGE Games' site and heartily await your paper. I'm not one to attack without knowing both sides of the story, although I find little way for you to escape this unscathed. I will not speak for Susan, or the site, any longer, because it's not my place.

But from what I've seen, I don't disagree with her.

Lets break it down shall we?
The quoted is a press announcement by EDGE to defend itself.

"First, no one "pulled" Mobigame's iPhone game (in the sense of EDGE Games complaining to Apple and Apple then "pulling" the game). Mobigame's game was not "unceremoniously yanked" from the U.S. and UK AppStores. No one sued Mobigame. The truth is Mobigame voluntarily withdrew their game from the Apple AppStores in the U.S. and UK. What was said was clearly an attempt to make the legitimate actions of a company look like an individual's poor treatment of a fellow indie game company. In naming their game "EDGE" Mobigame broke the law. EDGE informed Apple of the infringement and Apple sent one of their standard letters to Mobigame. Mobigame's attorney replied to EDGE at Apple's request saying that if EDGE produced evidence of its registered rights in the mark "EDGE" then she would advise her client to take the game down and rename it. EDGE supplied that proof of registered rights, Mobigame's attorney thanked EDGE and advised Mobigame to take the game down, which they did. Mobigame have so far refused to rename the game so that it can be resubmitted to the U.S. and UK App Stores, but that has been entirely their choice."

Okay, so if we are to believe everything that EDGE says (which we're going to because it still makes them look rather bad). So EDGE didn't sure Mobigames but told Apple that Mobigames broke the law? I can't say I've read the EDGE/Apple letter but it seems to me that if one says that a company has done wrong upon them , they will take legal action. So then Apple telle Mobigames of this. Of course the Mobigames attorney will ask for proof. EDGE sends their proof of ownership over A WORD. then the attorney advises her clients to take this game off the market? And who wouldn't? Any attorney worth their stones would advise a client avoid a legal duel with a giant game corporation.

"In contrast, Mobigame has been bullying EDGE by saying EDGE may not use its nearly 30-year old mark EDGE in Europe unless EDGE gets Mobigame's permission first. Last Friday EDGE refused to sign an agreement in response to Papazian's demand that EDGE do so, which is undoubtedly what led to Mobigame starting this flame war here in the U.S. with the sole intent of trying to embarrass EDGE (and me as EDGE's CEO) into agreeing to their unreasonable proposal. Indeed, that is undoubtedly why the attack was on me as an individual, and me as a Board member of the IGDA, and not on EDGE Games, since Papazian thought he could cause maximum embarrassment this way."

]Unfortunately there is no proof that this conversation took place, so I don't beleive I have any insight to put into this. However if this is true it makes Mobigames look rather bad. Although one could argue they are trying to exploit this maybe-existing loophole in attempts to salvage their game: edge (don't sue me for writing that word please).

"Third, neither EDGE, nor I, nor Future Publishing, have ever sued anyone over our EDGE trademarks. In almost 30 years in the game industry neither I nor EDGE has ever started any litigation on such issues, so it is not just a twisting of the truth to talk in terms of "the litigious habits of [...] Tim Langdell," it is flat-out not true. EDGE has only taken entirely reasonable action that is required of it by law to protect its rights. Since I personally own no trademarks, there was certainly no truth to the accusation that I have personally been trying to enforce "my" trademarks. Just to be clear, actions in trademark offices (such as the Namco Souledge issue) are not "law suits" or "litigation" they are part of standard trademark office procedures that any responsible company in the game industry is required to follow to protect their trademarks. By opposing a trademark application a company is not "suing" the other company, or "litigating," they are merely following the process the trademark office requires them to of application/publication/opposition leading to registration or refusal. EDGE has never engaged in anything other than entirely legitimate practices to protect its trademarks."

Using semantics to argue one's morality is pointless. They obviously released this statement to look better in the view of the public. The point of a patent is to make sure you ideas are not taken by others, making a loss f profit to the main inventor. Unless we are to believe EDGE Gaming invented the word "EDGE" it makes the patent bogus. EDGE knows this, they onyl sure to stall other gaming companies who just end up settling, to move their own gaming production onwards. EDGE Gaming suffers no loss by having a game called EDGE on the apple store, but that is irrelevant to them. They also will not suffer any monetary loss by having a game called "Soul Edge" on the shelf. A patent is meant to represent an idea, or what EDGE represent, not the word itself.

"Fourth, a Virginia Court document was quoted from that said that EDGE had tried to obfuscate and mislead the court. What was not mentioned (since it did not help fuel the intended goal of getting people angry with me) was that the court order in question was voided with the court later deciding EDGE had not tried to obfuscate or mislead it. There was never any question of me personally behaving badly in that court matter, but even the initial decision that EDGE had acted badly was reversed by the court."

What document? If it was just a court script, it could have been what EDGE's own Lawyers said during trail or testimony. Without any other information this entire paragraph I believe is bogus, but I'm only a mock lawyer for high school so I'm not exactly sure on this count.

"Last, in my role as CEO of EDGE I have produced all of the several hundred game SKUs EDGE has developed and published since 1979, and thus that statement was entirely true, as was every other statement I have made about my accomplishments over the years. I have never sought to claim someone else's work as my own, that accusation was only said in an attempt to defame me. EDGE has been active as an indie game developer and publisher at all times over the last several decades and has a number of games in development at this time."

EDGE is not suing people over stealing EDGE's work, if EDGE was, I'm sure people would be on EDGE's side. EDGE is suing people who are using a word, which , as I have stated before, does nothing to damage EDGE's profits. Although I can't help wonder what profits those may be since EDGE has been producing/creating any games lately from what I or many others had heard. just saying you are making game does nothing to help your standing, 3D realms said they were doing the exact same thing, and who here has a copy of Duke Nuke'm Forever?

This seems stupid now the we know that Tim was a fake.

Shamus Young:
There happens to be a crapload of stuff called "edge" out there... the Europop song

I've been to the edge
And I've been to the edge
Yes I've been to the edge
I've been to the edge
And God knows if I looked down, looked down
[Insert highly danceable beat here]
[repeat]

Ahh yes, I remember that album. Still listen to some songs from it too.

Eh.

This thread has had some interesting twists and turns in it.

By this point I have no idea what the truth of the matter is, but as a game development student, (or for that matter, anyone with an interest in creative media), these kinds of stories always annoy me.

Nothing quite as bad as someone using the legal system to abuse you...

MaxTheReaper:
Wow.
What a fucker.

I am going to find religion just so I can pray against this "Tim" person.

agreed, brb going to go pray...

scnj:

MaxTheReaper:
Wow.
What a fucker.

I came here to say nearly that exact same thing. Seriously, what kind of an asshole is that?

Yeah I'm gonna have to go with Max and scnj, you can't really articulate it better than that.

BobisOnlyBob:

EDGE Gaming:
image
(sorry, couldn't find an alternate image than the one in the article).

This is beyond hypocrisy, this is outright Registered Trademark theft.

If that image is real I'd report it to EA. They'd have a field day with that since it is a blatant abuse of imagery to steal part of the market from EA.

If I released a shoe that just 'happened' to say "N I K E" on it with spaces I'm quite sure that NIKE would destroy me. The same would happen if EA found out about that :P.

samaritan.squirrel:
May he give birth to many a pine-cone.

Posts like this don't accomplish much, please don't - Mod

Hokay. Although it was more of a joke than a wish.
Duly noted.

I don't even know what to say to this. I am simply enraged at the thought that some nonsense like this could be going on. This man needs legal action taken against HIM. I don't particularly care about indie developers or iPhone games, but that is just flat-out wrong.

Truly, I must sound like a moron because I can't think of anything intelligent to say about this. My mind is filled with various forms of "WTF?" right now.

I thought I had heard of EDGE games, then I realized it was some strange mixture of Epic Games and Edge magazine.

I think I'm going to go out and buy a copy of Mirror's Edge (a game I had no interest in until now) just to spite the rotten fools at EDGE games and Tim Langdell. I may never even play it, because I am fairly certain I won't enjoy it, but I will enjoy the thought that this "MIRRORS (a new game from) EDGE" ploy isn't going to work.

And yea, I do wish this guy bodily harm. Not death or anything, but in addition to his reputation being ruined, I hope he gets punched in the face. Actually, I take that back, because the man would obviously sue the person who punched him for copious amounts of cash and laugh about it all the way back to HIS BOARD POSITION AT IGDA. Argh!

How did his "legal" complaint even get passed? I mean, it's not like as though "Edge Gaming" is the name of another game! Who passed this kind of thing...? Anyways, I wish no physical harm on him, but someone really has to give him and his apparent crack team of ninja lawyers a reality check.

I'm particularly interested in this little bit of community service on the part of edge games:

"DEVELOPERS:
EDGE is always interested to receive game submissions and to hear from independent developers interested in working with us:
dev AT edgegames DOT com"
~ www.edgegames.com

We really should warn Tim Langdell of vapor ware scams. Someone might trick edge games into trademarking something useless!

Ugh, I just lost my desire to eat after reading about that. This Tim Langdell is a grade A douche.
It's really sad how this guy is manipulating the system like this... No correction, this is INFURIATING how he is manipulating the system like this.

"Tim Langdell sodomizes the corpses of orphaned children who he may or may not have killed with his bare hands."

This line seems to have set the tone for this thread.

Personally, I think someone should announce a game with this as it's title, then following the rush from Edge Games to threaten to sue your ass, agree to change it. The game would get a lot of press simply from having that name, and would probably be remembered for it.

Shame nobody's going to read this, since it's four pages in.

Can someone just copyright this guys name? then we can sue him every time he signs something

I think a contract should be in order. If the video game industry was run like a mob. But that is pretty ridiculous. It's interesting to think that IGDA can look at itself in the mirrors with a member like that on the council. For shame. For shame.

samaritan.squirrel:

samaritan.squirrel:
May he give birth to many a pine-cone.

Posts like this don't accomplish much, please don't - Mod

Hokay. Although it was more of a joke than a wish.
Duly noted.

That was really funny though.

Trujkin:
I don't suppose atomic wedgies fall under mental anguish :/

I think it would, the wedgie causes both emotional and physical pain, mainly because he'd be thinking "what did I do to deserve this!?"

hamster mk 4:
I have been following this story else where and am glad Shamus brought it to the escapist. I was thinking a class action law suite against Tim for lost revenue due to his legal shenanigans would do the trick. If the development community take him for every dime he owns and a couple dimes he may make in the future, it may serve as a warning to Tim and the next guy who tries to make a quick buck of someone else's work. Convincing a jury to side with a bunch of hard working programmers over a guy who lives to abuse the legal system can't be too hard right?

It can if he has a lot of very highly paid lawyers on his side. No matter how much the rest of the world can see that what he's doing is morally wrong, if you have enough money you can get away with anything. I'm going to go and wish mental anguish on him now...

Is this man Jack Thompson in disguise?

Ossum:

The last time my parents let me drive, I wrecked their karma. Now they only let me walk the dogma.

I will destroy all you hold dear.

In 1975, a little movie came out called "Jaws." In 1976 a little smaller movie came out called "Jaws of Death." "Jaws of Death" was a silly movie about a guy who has a mystical connection with, you guessed it, sharks. Similar name (including the use of the entire title of the first movie within the title of the second movie), similar intent (ride the coattales of the bigger shark movie) but a totally different plot. Did Universal, or Peter Benchley or Stephen Spielberg sue the maker of "Jaws of Death" (also known in other countries as "Killer Jaws")? No, they did not. Because they're not stupid and they're not.... Um, my Xbox MVP status prohibits my public use of expletives, so image one appropriate to this guy, and say it out loud here. There are many.

Funny, Universal didn't sue them. And strangely enough, Disney has continued to release animated movies named after public domain stories, KNOWING that competitors will release inferior products with the same titles, to capitalize on the success of the Disney flicks. From Snow White to Aladdin, from Cinderella to Beauty and the Beast, from The Little Mermaid to Pocahontas, Jungle Book, Peter Pan... companies like Starmaker have rushed out their own cheaply animated versions, with similar stories and similarly designed characters - KNOWING that Disney won't have a leg to stand on. (You'll notice that Disney bought the rights to 101 Dalmations. It was not in the public domain, so there aren't a slew of copycats out there.)

The fact that Tim Langdell is getting away with this is ludicrous. Even if they share the name or part of the name, the name of a game is not the same as the name of a studio. God help the studio that ever puts the word "Project" in their name.

It is the pinnacle of arrogance that EDGE would release "MIRRORS a game by EDGE" with Mirrors stacked vertically and in the same color as EDGE. They claim to own "EDGE" and use their font, MIRRORS is in a public domain, simple font similar to the real ME, and "MIRRORS" doesn't have an apostrophe like "Mirror's Edge."

They did it just close enough to piss everybody off, but not close enough that a lawsuit would succeed.

It worked. I'm pissed. The guys needs to be sued into oblivion. Not "Oblivion(tm)" :)

I wonder what would happen if someone release a game with "Halo" in the title, that didn't have anything to do with "Halo". Let's say, for example, a spiritual warfare game called "Halos or Horns." Sure, if it was about a ringworld... or, if someone made a game called "Ringworld", they'd have issues.

The words "War" and "Warfare" don't seem to be a problem. EA's rights to the NFL didn't keep All Pro FOOTBALL from hitting shelves.

What if you named a game "Epic Fail" or "Bungie Jumping"? "Naughty Dogsledding" might be pushing it.

BobisOnlyBob:
I'm a big fan of EDGE Magazine - it's my print complement to Escapist Magazine. In fact, when Escapist originally launched I was like "Holy crap, it's EDGE Magazine quality, online for free. Only they don't do reviews or job stuff."

Thus, the first thing I noticed before the "MIRRORS a game by EDGE" advert on his site, was the fact that the two logos - EDGE Gaming and EDGE Magazine - are practically identical!!

I also couldn't help but notice the distinct similarities between the two logos. Interestingly, in the "About the Edge" it actually makes a reference to Edge Magazine. In the years I've read that particular magazine, I've known them to have ever been involved with Edge Games, so unless I'm missing something.

Also, trying to get one other thing straight - Edge Games, have recently submitted for a trademark for the name Edge of Twilight. Given that the game Edge of Twilight has, according to the TIG Source site, been around since at least 2007, would the actual developer have not already pre-emptively made their claim against that name?

SpaceGhost2K:
I wonder what would happen if someone release a game with "Halo" in the title, that didn't have anything to do with "Halo".

Halo's Edge wouldbe sued in no-time...

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