More Dark Knight Talent Arrives to Save Superman

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Burton directed the 1989 Batman and Batman Returns. Joel Schumacher directed Batman Forever and Batman and Robin. Burton's were great, Shumacher's were not. Schumacher's were still entertaining, but cheesy and dumb.

Alright; aside from Luthor (who I pray isn't that clown from the original films), Brainiac is a great choice for a villain. If this doesn't work, I can always fall back on the animated series from the 90's =/

I still haven't seen The Dark Knight...

coxafloppin:
For the love of god i hope they make him fight Doomsday or Darkseid.

Superman is the greatest superhero ever, he deserves an awesome movie.

I disagree on the 'greatest superhero ever' bit but definitely concur that he must fight a villain who is his equal or even better, on a power scale.

Recently got round to watching Wolverine and it was utter shit. The best x-man gets the worse film in the franchise. Marvel are yet to surpass Blade in terms of awesomeness. Iron Man was ok I guess but DC need to pull their socks up.

Jaredin:

Tinq:
I liked Superman Returns, but I don't think I could handle another Superman Returns. It really only worked if you considered how long it had been since we had a Superman movie.

Making me feel old remembering it...

You're not old. I mean, you've gotta be younger than 90, 93 at the most.

For the love of god, keep Jon Peters away from this project.

Like Kevin Smith said, he used to be a hairdresser, and in Hollywood you fail upward. Watch an evening with Kevin Smith for more info.

A lot of people blame him for the large gap in between films. Also did anybody else notice the lack of action in Superman Returns? Superman Doomsday was a better film.

Returns was good, but it mimiced Superman 1 too much, i.e Lex uses a missle to create a new landmass. Then again, Batman Begins mimiced Tim Burton's first Batman movie too, i.e Evil villain uses toxic gas to kill city.

You can't really do a dark and gritty Superman, he isn't the dark and gritty type.

Here's how you make Superman good again (in multiple ideas):

IDEA 1: Get the guys behind The Dark Knight to make it good.
IDEA 2: Look at what made the first two movies good (ignore the silly/stupid moments) and expand on them.

008Zulu:
Returns was good, but it mimiced Superman 1 too much, i.e Lex uses a missle to create a new landmass. Then again, Batman Begins mimiced Tim Burton's first Batman movie too, i.e Evil villain uses toxic gas to kill city.

You can't really do a dark and gritty Superman, he isn't the dark and gritty type.

Not so much 'dark and gritty' Superman, but 'dark and gritty' story and opponent. Like Manchester Black in "What's So Funny About Truth, Justice & the American Way?"

The Gentleman:
snip

I love your ideas, man. That sounds brilliant, a way, to make a gritty Superman actually work. That said, my only experience with Superman was the awesome Justice League (as well as Unlimited) cartoon.

http://splashpage.mtv.com/2010/02/18/watchmen-sequels-and-christopher-nolans-superman-are-just-rumors-says-dc-president/

It's a rumor, you got duped. As they say, don't believe everything you read on the internet.
Frankly I'm glad it's just a rumor, a "darker" Superman is just retarded, the new superman didn't work because it was a slow, boring piece of trash that made the assumption you watched 2 aged movies from 30 years before. Superman can make money as a movie title, but not with the Batman model, it just doesn't make sense for the character.

I wonder if they let Brandon Routh keep the codpiece?

I don't see why they're getting rid of Routh. He wasn't bad and it certainly wasn't his fault that the last movie wasn't... well... good. But then again the guys in charge want to distance themselves from Superman Returns so not casting Routh is obvious. Too bad.

Well it all sounds to me like it wont be an abysmal crap-wad :D
Though I am still waiting for someone to make a faithful recreation of Frank Millers 'The Dark Knight Returns'. I'd love to see Batman kicking Superman's ass on the big screen :')

Superman is really the least interesting superhero out there in my eyes; he's got a ridiculous arsenal of superpowers and only one weakness. I think it would be great if they just abandoned him already and took a look at some other superheroes.

Well I found The Dark Knight overhyped and silly and not in the good way.

Hubilub:
I don't think you can make a good movie about Superman. It just doesn't feel like a kind of hero you could make a good movie about. Then again, I've always hated Superman. How can a guy with almost no weakness constantly get surprised when the villain pulls out kryptonite for the 100th time?

Yeah, this. I hate Superman so much. And a lot of DC heroes, actually. Why? Because so often they are gods in their world, nigh untouchable. Even Batman. I mean, how often does Batman go up against a real villain with "super" powers? It's usually just some lame gimmick weapon or gun that fires gorillas or something. Even in The Dark Knight his primary opponents were:

Man with Revolver who Shoots People
Insane Man with Dobermans who Threatens to Kill People
and... The Mob. Wow. Good thing Batman was here. Lester Freamon and six months of wire-tapping could probably have put all of them behind bars. You also have to wonder how ANYONE stays arrested or how they get a charge to stick the way Batman breaks laws. You gotta figure 99% of any evidence is inadmissable in court because the Bat didn't have Search-and-Seizure warrants, was illegally tracing calls and tapping phones, etc. I wouldn't be playing the realism card, except that a Batman fan's typical response is usually "REALISM LOL" or something along those lines.

But Batman really is a God in his world. He has all the money. And youth. And martial prowess. And the cool gadgets. And you know what? He almost never steps out of this world where he is the king (at least in the critically-acclaimed movies).

I guess what I'm trying to say is that while people are quick to point out that Batman has no powers, he's STILL a Superman in his own place and time. He's still basically flawless in every way, just like Superman. Sure, he's not invincible, but he doesn't have to be since his opponents are many, many times weaker than the foes Superman faces off against.

And for that reason and others, I hate DC comics. (Although the Charles Dixon Nightwing stuff was pretty sweet).

Just make a Powergirl movie starring a porn star.

You won't even need a script

Routh was one of the few good choices Singer made in Returns, so I'm disappointed he won't be reprising the role. When he was actually allowed to be Superman (fighting criminals, saving people) instead of just stalking Lois he was very good.

I would like to see them move away from Lex this time. I know he's Superman's most iconic villain, but the animated series and Smallville have helped introduce non-comic readers to others. Plus, giving him someone to fight who can actually hurt him (without resorting to Kryptonite) will give him some decent fight scenes and might finally put an end to all the "Superman is over-powered" nonsense.

Hubilub:

I guess what I'm trying to say is that while people are quick to point out that Batman has no powers, he's STILL a Superman in his own place and time. He's still basically flawless in every way, just like Superman. Sure, he's not invincible, but he doesn't have to be since his opponents are many, many times weaker than the foes Superman faces off against.

And for that reason and others, I hate DC comics. (Although the Charles Dixon Nightwing stuff was pretty sweet).

Batman tends to be Bruce, the bourgeoise, the elite of society with all of the fame, money and power in Gotham, beating up, terrorising and imprisoning the impoverished, the disabled the mentally ill and ethnic minorities. He is also the good guy, the one we are rooting for.

If that is not social commentary I don't know what is.

Having said that I won't be watching any remake, I've not seen returns yet, I find Superman boring.

bjj hero:

Hubilub:

I guess what I'm trying to say is that while people are quick to point out that Batman has no powers, he's STILL a Superman in his own place and time. He's still basically flawless in every way, just like Superman. Sure, he's not invincible, but he doesn't have to be since his opponents are many, many times weaker than the foes Superman faces off against.

And for that reason and others, I hate DC comics. (Although the Charles Dixon Nightwing stuff was pretty sweet).

Batman tends to be Bruce, the bourgeoise, the elite of society with all of the fame, money and power in Gotham, beating up, terrorising and imprisoning the impoverished, the disabled the mentally ill and ethnic minorities. He is also the good guy, the one we are rooting for.

If that is not social commentary I don't know what is.

Having said that I won't be watching any remake, I've not seen returns yet, I find Superman boring.

Hey, I didn't say that! You totally set me up!

I'm calling Batman!

Great.....The Dark Knight was a simply AWFUL movie that RUINED Batman and now they are gonna ruin Superman as well.

Someone shoot him please?

I think superman should be a super blogger to get with the times.

bjj hero:

Hubilub:

I guess what I'm trying to say is that while people are quick to point out that Batman has no powers, he's STILL a Superman in his own place and time. He's still basically flawless in every way, just like Superman. Sure, he's not invincible, but he doesn't have to be since his opponents are many, many times weaker than the foes Superman faces off against.

And for that reason and others, I hate DC comics. (Although the Charles Dixon Nightwing stuff was pretty sweet).

Batman tends to be Bruce, the bourgeoise, the elite of society with all of the fame, money and power in Gotham, beating up, terrorising and imprisoning the impoverished, the disabled the mentally ill and ethnic minorities. He is also the good guy, the one we are rooting for.

If that is not social commentary I don't know what is.

Having said that I won't be watching any remake, I've not seen returns yet, I find Superman boring.

By that logic Batman is the villain (and I'm not Hubilub, by the way). And yet he's never portrayed in that "Team America" way, nor is it even suggested anywhere I've seen that the Bat might be evil. Quite to the contrary, in fact.

Sometimes I think a series kind of stumbles into social commentary without intending to. Or, more accurately, social commentary is very easy to see in a lot of older shows and characters. Characters that were once paragons of justice now seem more like ironic figures in the political world we live in. And the movies have done a terrible job of ever showing Bruce as anything other than the perfect man and hero. Especially the recent films.

I don't know man, all this Batman love is so unironic and downright creepy I can't help but wonder if the biggest commentary isn't the batman fanbase. I mean, kill the mental patients or get them some help-don't keep beating them up and sending 'em back to the same place they keep breaking out of! Batman seems like way more of a sociopath than somebody like Frank Castle.

Samurai Goomba:

By that logic Batman is the villain (and I'm not Hubilub, by the way). And yet he's never portrayed in that "Team America" way, nor is it even suggested anywhere I've seen that the Bat might be evil. Quite to the contrary, in fact.

Sometimes I think a series kind of stumbles into social commentary without intending to. Or, more accurately, social commentary is very easy to see in a lot of older shows and characters. Characters that were once paragons of justice now seem more like ironic figures in the political world we live in. And the movies have done a terrible job of ever showing Bruce as anything other than the perfect man and hero. Especially the recent films.

I don't know man, all this Batman love is so unironic and downright creepy I can't help but wonder if the biggest commentary isn't the batman fanbase. I mean, kill the mental patients or get them some help-don't keep beating them up and sending 'em back to the same place they keep breaking out of! Batman seems like way more of a sociopath than somebody like Frank Castle.

See, I get Frank Castle. He's a Nam vet who's been traumatised. He needs sectioning under the mental health act and given some intense therapy over a long period of time. He's only there because the system doesn't work. Often he kills the upper levels of society who can't be touched due to money/influence. Working class hero if you would, sticking it to the man.

you're right. Batman isn't team America. He is more like a feudal lord who comes from his bat themed tower to flog the odd peasant when hes been poaching game to fend off starvation. He is blatantly the good guy but the parallels are too stark of the rich elite having to keep the dregs of society in line.

It is class war and Americans love a winner, even if as an individual you are on the losing end. Look at all of the working and middle class Americans who nut hug multimillionaire capitalists. The ones who keep there minions in line with fear and cut jobs left and right. Look at the anti-union sentiments, even though most workers benefit from collective action.

Bullies prosper because they win. You expect them to end up in burger king, getting their comeupance but instead they turn into meglomaniac office managers who make their workforce's lives hell.

Personally, I'd love to see Superman fight Doomsday, or Darkseid, or Brainiac. Superman is a creature of fantasy, a brightly colored god in a world of drab mortals. He deserves godly opponents, like Doomsday (pure destruction), Brainiac (the monster lurking within all technology and the dark side of the rapid march of science), and Darkseid (the embodiment of evil as done by Jack Kirby, aka The King).

I think it could work. The villain would need some explaining and backstory, but the thing to do would be to introduce the villain, show us how very strong and evil he/she/it is, and give us the backstory later. Let the audience discover it at the same time as Superman, who is looking into it because he's desperate for a way to stop this guy.

Personally, my vote's on Darkseid. I want to see a super-powered war of the worlds.

bjj hero:

Samurai Goomba:

By that logic Batman is the villain (and I'm not Hubilub, by the way). And yet he's never portrayed in that "Team America" way, nor is it even suggested anywhere I've seen that the Bat might be evil. Quite to the contrary, in fact.

Sometimes I think a series kind of stumbles into social commentary without intending to. Or, more accurately, social commentary is very easy to see in a lot of older shows and characters. Characters that were once paragons of justice now seem more like ironic figures in the political world we live in. And the movies have done a terrible job of ever showing Bruce as anything other than the perfect man and hero. Especially the recent films.

I don't know man, all this Batman love is so unironic and downright creepy I can't help but wonder if the biggest commentary isn't the batman fanbase. I mean, kill the mental patients or get them some help-don't keep beating them up and sending 'em back to the same place they keep breaking out of! Batman seems like way more of a sociopath than somebody like Frank Castle.

See, I get Frank Castle. He's a Nam vet who's been traumatised. He needs sectioning under the mental health act and given some intense therapy over a long period of time. He's only there because the system doesn't work. Often he kills the upper levels of society who can't be touched due to money/influence. Working class hero if you would, sticking it to the man.

you're right. Batman isn't team America. He is more like a feudal lord who comes from his bat themed tower to flog the odd peasant when hes been poaching game to fend off starvation. He is blatantly the good guy but the parallels are too stark of the rich elite having to keep the dregs of society in line.

It is class war and Americans love a winner, even if as an individual you are on the losing end. Look at all of the working and middle class Americans who nut hug multimillionaire capitalists. The ones who keep there minions in line with fear and cut jobs left and right. Look at the anti-union sentiments, even though most workers benefit from collective action.

Bullies prosper because they win. You expect them to end up in burger king, getting their comeupance but instead they turn into meglomaniac office managers who make their workforce's lives hell.

Can't say much else but I agree... And that now I hate Batman more than ever. The Punisher is one of my favorite comic characters, pretty much for the reasons you mentioned. You don't often see prudent, cautious and merciless character play the "hero" in a comic book, but that's exactly what Frank is. And the comic makes no attempt to justify (MAX, anyway) the way Frank is.

And like I said, sometimes the biggest social commentary seems to be the way people in general react to a character. By all rights we should be repulsed by someone who arbitrarily assaults people who JUST escaped from a mental ward, only to return them to the SAME ward which has itself a rather spotted history (Bats could have just driven the Joker over the state line and dropped him in a REAL institution, for example). One big thing that gets me is how people play Bats as a moral character because he "doesn't believe in guns." Okay, but look at the stuff he does INSTEAD. A bullet to the head is quick and fairly painless. Instead, Bats breaks bones, snaps jaws, kicks groins, throws razor-sharp bat-shuriken, hangs people off rooftops, releases powerful fear-inducing hallucinogens, and enlists young orphan boys into his cause (forcing them to wear extremely short shorts.)

And none of it works. That is the thing. All this time and effort and brutality spent on stopping crime and, if anything, his presence just gives credence to the psychotic urges of nuts and slimeballs. I mean, Frank Castle would have put a bullet in the Joker's head, first time they met. Problem solved, and in a way it's more humane to just do that and save all the beatings and shuriken tossing and whatever else has happened between Bats and the Joker.

Superman is just... A jerk. I mean, he should be throwing his weight around to force world piece or take down real corruption, but mostly he beats up aliens from another planet that wouldn't BE on Earth except for him, or he stops purse-snatchers and the like. And he's NEVER prepared for someone to exploit his only weakness.

I know it's silly to argue realism in a comic, but in my opinion heroes should at least be... Heroic, you know?

Superman is just... A jerk. I mean, he should be throwing his weight around to force world piece or take down real corruption,but mostly he beats up aliens from another planet that wouldn't BE on Earth except for him, or he stops purse-snatchers and the like. And he's NEVER prepared for someone to exploit his only weakness.

It's a slippery slope dude. If he started doing that, he might continue along the path and become a full blown tyrant. That's why he doesn't participate in politics and why he doesn't protect the people from anything they can't deal with themselves...

Like train crashes, plane crashes and natural disasters. Think about it, if Superman existed, that stuff going on in Japan's area would never have happened (and I say that in the utmost respect to the victims and survivors, and wish for a speedy and swift recovery for Japan).

I know it's silly to argue realism in a comic, but in my opinion heroes should at least be... Heroic, you know?

I agree. Batman is a monster, but he's an interesting case. Since the Dark Knight Returns (comic), people have been writing him similar to that. However, that was a partial deconstruction. It needs to be finished for these traits to be ironed out of Batman.

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