Hindus Criticize Smite For "Trivializing" Their Religion

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TheBelgianGuy:

Torrasque:

Stripes:
Dont you think your being a bit extreme here? Muslims dont kill people for drawing muhhamed, on the whole at least, no more than christians kill homosexuals. Considering he has no image and is purely a religious character I cant see a reaosn to draw him other than to piss off muslims, you can defend it with free speech but it wouldnt make you less of a scumbag for deliberatively being shocking and offensive which is also pretty cowardly and childish.

Woah now, I think you are living in a little bubble of ignorance here. Muslims do kill people for drawing Mohammed, they threaten to kill people just for thinking or suggesting drawing Mohammed. To support free speech and get Muslims off of their invincible high horse of "you can't insult our religion!", Draw Mohammed Day has been created.

If you want, I can show you many instances of Muslims being violent towards people that draw Mohammed, but it would require a good deal of searching and browsing that I don't feel like doing right now. Long story short, Muslims are incredibly violent towards people that draw Mohammed.

I really hope you are trolling here =|

Seriously? Not all Muslims are murderers, dude.

And not all Christians are unbearably ignorant and annoying. It doesn't change the fact that people who have drawn Mohammed, have been killed by Muslims. I don't mean to say that all Muslims foam at the mouth when they see Mohammed drawn, but some still do.

I'm sorry if you thought I meant all Muslims react the same way, I didn't mean that at all.

...And no one's raising an eyebrow over the fact that they're also including a Buddha in the roster?

I think they're just overreacting. I mean, she kind of is the God of Death, among other things. Sure, her role in Hinduism is much more complicated than that, but its not like depicting her in little clothing, with skulls, scimitars and being blue is all that out of the ordinary.

Shiva's been in Final Fantasy for over twenty years. Has the Universal Society of Hinduism ever complained about that? No? What makes Smite so special then?

honestly i think i'm inclined side with the Hindu guy just because the Hi-Rez guy sounds like a douche and there is obviously no way in hell he's going to put characters from the Abrahamic religions into the game for fear of a backlash and as such it just seems generally shitty, cowardly and exploitative.

the argument can quite easily be made that because the game will not feature characters from the Abrahamic faiths (ie those most present culturally in the creators country) it does in fact "trivialize" Hinduism because they have clearly chosen to address the obvious question of their inclusion differently.

its really up for them to explain why and someone, hopefully someone who actually knows what "journalists" are supposed to do, should ask them the very obvious question because when you are making a game full of religious characters and ignoring the two largest religions on the planet there's a bloody huge Ganesha in the room...

This story/thread makes me realize how great a religious deity fighting game could be. Like just a straight up side view 1 on 1 fighter.
Also they could use the gory finishers from Mortal Kombat!
Yay sacrilege!

This is a awesome idea for game. I don't get why Hindus are so worked up over this piece of fiction, It seems like when the Christians got all worked up by The DaVinci Code. It would be cool to see Jesus in this game though.

I don't get what the big deal, it's not like they're animating Kali to give back alley blow jobs, it's a game where she fights against other deities, that's pretty damn badass. Hell, if I were a god and someone made a game where I could fought and kicked the shit out of other gods I'd be pretty damn pleased.

Lethos:

darkstone:
Now lets see if the devs have the balls to make Jesus a playable character.

I was wondering this. They seem to be trying to avoid the giant elephant in the room.

There's no point. What's Jesus going to do, feed the enemies fish and loaves until they all get diabetes?

Now if you wanted to throw the archangel Gabriel in there, that would be pretty freakin rad. Maybe add Lucifer to the roster to add to the controversy.

Richardplex:
Saw this coming a mile away. Did think it was a bit odd for Hi Rez to include Hinduism along with dead religion's gods. Clearly, the only way to peacefully resolve this is to include Jesus as a hero.

No, they can't put Jesus in the game, he would be the biggest fucking overpowered mary sue. C'mon, he can battle-rez, duplicate anything he touches, and when shit hits the fan his dad is God, an even BIGGER mary sue than he is.

Kakulukia:
Shiva's been in Final Fantasy for over twenty years. Has the Universal Society of Hinduism ever complained about that? No? What makes Smite so special then?

The shameless sexualization SMITE's rocking with Kila is probably a factor.

Torrasque:
Woah now, I think you are living in a little bubble of ignorance here. Muslims do kill people for drawing Mohammed, they threaten to kill people just for thinking or suggesting drawing Mohammed. To support free speech and get Muslims off of their invincible high horse of "you can't insult our religion!", Draw Mohammed Day has been created.

If you want, I can show you many instances of Muslims being violent towards people that draw Mohammed, but it would require a good deal of searching and browsing that I don't feel like doing right now. Long story short, Muslims are incredibly violent towards people that draw Mohammed.

I really hope you are trolling here =|

To be fair, Islam as a whole doesn't say that it's offensive to depict Muhammad, and many old texts have depictions of him.

Edit: Sunni as a whole has a problem with Muhammad's depiction, while Shi'ite does not, as a whole, have a problem with it.

Either way, I'm pretty sure Sufis don't have much of a problem at all with the depiction, other than it being 'distasteful.' (The Wiki article doesn't specify for this sect)

Note that I could be incorrect about any of these three sects. I only know that the depiction of Muhammad isn't inherently sacrilegious according to at least one of the major sects, and certainly isn't worthy of the death penalty to them.

Edit: I was backwards. I have fixed where I was wrong, and more can be found here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depiction_of_Muhammad

The Human Torch:

Richardplex:

Berenzen:

Make it happen Hi-Rez.

Nail should be in his wrist, factually inaccurate. Otherwise that is the best thing I've seen all day.

Well, new evidence suggests that crucifictions have had the nails in the palm. They used a combination of rope and nails to keep the victim up.

The ropes would be tied around the wrists and ankles, and nails will be hammered through the palm and feet. That way if friends/family members tried to rescue the crucified victim by cutting the ropes, the victim would have a really big problem.

Good old fashioned security measure.

Anyway, OT: As much as I don't give a crap about religion and religion devotees, I wonder how, let's say: AMERICA, would reply if they included Jesus.

AMERICA wouldn't care.

Religious zealots livin in America might, though.

Syzygy23:

Richardplex:
Saw this coming a mile away. Did think it was a bit odd for Hi Rez to include Hinduism along with dead religion's gods. Clearly, the only way to peacefully resolve this is to include Jesus as a hero.

No, they can't put Jesus in the game, he would be the biggest fucking overpowered mary sue. C'mon, he can battle-rez, duplicate anything he touches, and when shit hits the fan his dad is God, an even BIGGER mary sue than he is.

Yeah, he can battle rez.. 2 days later. Not much of an issue there. Judeo-Christian god would however be overpowered, the whole 'Omni-ALL THE THINGS' thing he has going on, though he didn't really do anything in the new testament, beyond the whole "good luck with that crucifixion bro" chat he had with Jesus. And duplicate everything he touches, really? Have you seen what those other gods can do?

"Pastafarians criticize Smite for trivializing the flying spaghetti monster". Same thing, really.

freakymojo:
they better add santa claus in a suprise update during christmas.

OT: I can see why they are offended. No one wants their beliefs to be "attacked" by anyone but I am currently indifferent on the topic.

chadachada123:

Torrasque:
Woah now, I think you are living in a little bubble of ignorance here. Muslims do kill people for drawing Mohammed, they threaten to kill people just for thinking or suggesting drawing Mohammed. To support free speech and get Muslims off of their invincible high horse of "you can't insult our religion!", Draw Mohammed Day has been created.

If you want, I can show you many instances of Muslims being violent towards people that draw Mohammed, but it would require a good deal of searching and browsing that I don't feel like doing right now. Long story short, Muslims are incredibly violent towards people that draw Mohammed.

I really hope you are trolling here =|

To be fair, Islam as a whole doesn't say that it's offensive to depict Muhammad, and many old texts have depictions of him.

Edit: Sunni as a whole has a problem with Muhammad's depiction, while Shi'ite does not, as a whole, have a problem with it.

Either way, I'm pretty sure Sufis don't have much of a problem at all with the depiction, other than it being 'distasteful.' (The Wiki article doesn't specify for this sect)

Note that I could be incorrect about any of these three sects. I only know that the depiction of Muhammad isn't inherently sacrilegious according to at least one of the major sects, and certainly isn't worthy of the death penalty to them.

Edit: I was backwards. I have fixed where I was wrong, and more can be found here:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Depiction_of_Muhammad

Thats what always struck me as silly about Islam, is that there are several different factions (or groups?) of Islam, that are more or less completely different from each other. Every religion has many different sects/groups/followings, but Islam seems to have the largest different groups, and it is almost always the incredibly violent fundamentalist sect that gets depicted as the main/core following of Islam.

It would be like if Westboro Baptist Church was what most people thought of Christianity. Which would be hilarious imo.

I remember going to a Mosque sometime in highschool (gr 9 or 10?) as well as going to a Synagogue and Buddhist Temple, and the Mosque struck me as really nice, the people really quite polite. I don't remember much of what they said about the faith (the whole trip was quite boring really) but I didn't leave the Mosque thinking "WOW THOSE ISLAMIST FUNDAMENTALISTS ARE FUCKING CRAZY MAN".

Torrasque:
Thats what always struck me as silly about Islam, is that there are several different factions (or groups?) of Islam, that are more or less completely different from each other. Every religion has many different sects/groups/followings, but Islam seems to have the largest different groups, and it is almost always the incredibly violent fundamentalist sect that gets depicted as the main/core following of Islam.

It would be like if Westboro Baptist Church was what most people thought of Christianity. Which would be hilarious imo.

I remember going to a Mosque sometime in highschool (gr 9 or 10?) as well as going to a Synagogue and Buddhist Temple, and the Mosque struck me as really nice, the people really quite polite. I don't remember much of what they said about the faith (the whole trip was quite boring really) but I didn't leave the Mosque thinking "WOW THOSE ISLAMIST FUNDAMENTALISTS ARE FUCKING CRAZY MAN".

I think part of it is that the murderous Christian assholes just aren't getting the same media coverage because it's mostly happening in Africa right now. Where people are being literally burned alive for being 'witches.' It's really sick stuff. But no one cares because, again, Africa.

Plus, there are some vastly different sects of Christianity. Mormonism is one of them, which believes that, somehow, Jesus was alive in the Americas and converted a bunch of Native Americans, or something. There's Jehovah's Witnesses, which are Biblical literists that don't believe in the Trinity crap and also believe in, to an extent, resurrection and not the traditional Hell. Catholics worship the Pope, while every other sect thinks that the Pope is NOT ordained by god to lead us.

The difference between Catholicism and Protestantism is very much the same as the difference between Sunni and Shi'ite Islam. The main difference is that Protestants no longer kill tons of Catholics all of the time.

major_chaos:

Berenzen:

Make it happen Hi-Rez.

I'm a Christian and I fully approve of this image

OT: Not surprised, the first thing I though when I heard the concept for Smite was "o boy if they include any gods from religions that people actually still practice there is going to be trouble"

Jesus, Moses and John the Baptist tag-team combo!

I would also like Zamolxe in there somewhere.

The upset is understandable and I don't mock or scorn them for it. I mean, I would be offended if it was my sacred religious deity. And it comes of as very... unfortunate the way the roster goes - Dead, Dead, Dead, Dead, HINDUISM!, Dead, Dead, Dead etc. etc.

I know some people get all worked up and the developers freedom of speech and such, but they have to realise that freedom of speech doesn't mean you are immune to the conventions of common decency and tact.

Oversimplification? Bitch, please! No game can oversimplify any religion that those, which already exist and have crosses and OURE LAWRED JAYSUS CHROYST.

TheBelgianGuy:
Seriously? Not all Muslims are murderers, dude.

I was about to quote the guy before anyone jumped to this ridiculous conclusion. Nobody said "all [insert group of people] are anything", not in this thread at least. Here's the thing, there are all sorts of counterproductive or outright violent ideas in the muslim dogma, and A - people shouldn't defend those ideas because some muslims don't take them seriously, and B - a lot of muslims actually do take them somewhat seriously.

For instance, several years back, in the wake of the Danish cartoonist scandal, there was a poll done in Britain.[1] It went something like this. "A third of British muslims want to live under Sharia law and think that apostates should be put to death. 68% think that people who insult Islam should be arrested and prosecuted. 78% think that the Danish cartoonist should be brought to justice." Sounds really meek and calm, right? Note that we are talking about British muslims here.

[1] Don't ask me for a link. I'm going off of what Sam Harris cited in one of his speeches.

It does raise the question, why don't we see more Jesus Archtypes in video games?

I, as a proud Viking, believe that smiting fools as Odin is very much an enjoyable thing to do.

Hi-Rez better add Muhammad as a stealth character. Also, "ph'nglui mglw'nafh Cthulhu R'lyeh wgah'nagl fhtagn!"

Just saying.

Even Tomb Raider 3 (or one of the early ones) had Shiva has multiple small 'bosses' that you had to kill many times. I didn't see anyone complaining about that. o.O

Torrasque:

Stripes:

albino boo:

Currently they offending other peoples religions deliberately to create controversy to get themselves free advertising. They are doing that at no risk to themselves, but if they use Mohamed they would be putting their lives in danger. They could then make a legitimate case that its about freedom of expression, but as it they are just making a cheap buck out of insulting someone who won't punch back.

Dont you think your being a bit extreme here? Muslims dont kill people for drawing muhhamed, on the whole at least, no more than christians kill homosexuals. Considering he has no image and is purely a religious character I cant see a reaosn to draw him other than to piss off muslims, you can defend it with free speech but it wouldnt make you less of a scumbag for deliberatively being shocking and offensive which is also pretty cowardly and childish.

Woah now, I think you are living in a little bubble of ignorance here. Muslims do kill people for drawing Mohammed, they threaten to kill people just for thinking or suggesting drawing Mohammed. To support free speech and get Muslims off of their invincible high horse of "you can't insult our religion!", Draw Mohammed Day has been created.

If you want, I can show you many instances of Muslims being violent towards people that draw Mohammed, but it would require a good deal of searching and browsing that I don't feel like doing right now. Long story short, Muslims are incredibly violent towards people that draw Mohammed.

I really hope you are trolling here =|

You cant say all muslims are violent because its a lie brought about by ignorance of a huge group. Draw muhhamed day wasnt started to 'fight the muslim menace' it was started to piss them off by people who simply didnt like them in general for whatever reason. Should we do the same for other groups? How about we have a day where we deface images of Christ or we where 'novelty' skull caps, just to take the piss? Im sure they would get offended as well so they deserve it for not enjoying being purposefully insulted, some might even have an extreme backlash giving us proof they are all universally violent. Mocking people so broadly for the actions of such a narrow gruop is immensely childish, its not some heroic or brave fight its cowardly. If you have an issue with some one say it, be explicit. If you have any conviction you would do more than draw a picture and claim yourself a rebel.

Stripes:

albino boo:

Stripes:
Why would you praise someone for maing a muhhamed character?

Currently they offending other peoples religions deliberately to create controversy to get themselves free advertising. They are doing that at no risk to themselves, but if they use Mohamed they would be putting their lives in danger. They could then make a legitimate case that its about freedom of expression, but as it they are just making a cheap buck out of insulting someone who won't punch back.

Dont you think your being a bit extreme here? Muslims dont kill people for drawing muhhamed, on the whole at least, no more than christians kill homosexuals. Considering he has no image and is purely a religious character I cant see a reaosn to draw him other than to piss off muslims, you can defend it with free speech but it wouldnt make you less of a scumbag for deliberatively being shocking and offensive which is also pretty cowardly and childish.

Tell that to Salman Rushdie who spent years of his life under police guard after writing the satanic verses. The Iranian government has passed a death sentence on him and is still offering a bounty on his death, for the crime of writing a book with Mohamed in it. When did the last Christian suicide bomber blow themselves up on the London tube killing 57 people or when did the last Hindu crash a plane into buildings killing 4000. If you wont talk about homosexuals, how about Lutfur Rahman in Mayor of Tower Hamlets in London. His supporters put posters declaring that Tower Hamlets was a gay free zone and created an intimidatory atmosphere to such an extent that a gay couple, that I work with, moved half way across London to feel safe. Militant Islam is real and they do kill people.

Why is it ok to piss off Hindus, Buddhists and Christians but not Muslims? Hi Res are using images from their religions without fear of reprisal. Hi Res are playground bullies picking on reglions that wont fight back but running away from any risk to themselves. If they used Mohamed as well as the other religions they would be taking a brave stand for freedom of expression but as it they are just taking cheap shots at those that wont fight back.

Or maybe they just don't want their building letter-bombed?

Can you imagine the shitstorm once they include Jesus and Mohammed? Really, I would love to see that unfold.

albino boo:

Stripes:

albino boo:

Currently they offending other peoples religions deliberately to create controversy to get themselves free advertising. They are doing that at no risk to themselves, but if they use Mohamed they would be putting their lives in danger. They could then make a legitimate case that its about freedom of expression, but as it they are just making a cheap buck out of insulting someone who won't punch back.

Dont you think your being a bit extreme here? Muslims dont kill people for drawing muhhamed, on the whole at least, no more than christians kill homosexuals. Considering he has no image and is purely a religious character I cant see a reaosn to draw him other than to piss off muslims, you can defend it with free speech but it wouldnt make you less of a scumbag for deliberatively being shocking and offensive which is also pretty cowardly and childish.

Tell that to Salman Rushdie who spent years of his life under police guard after writing the satanic verses. The Iranian government has passed a death sentence on him and is still offering a bounty on his death, for the crime of writing a book with Mohamed in it. When did the last Christian suicide bomber blow themselves up on the London tube killing 57 people or when did the last Hindu crash a plane into buildings killing 4000. If you wont talk about homosexuals, how about Lutfur Rahman in Mayor of Tower Hamlets in London. His supporters put posters declaring that Tower Hamlets was a gay free zone and created an intimidatory atmosphere to such an extent that a gay couple, that I work with, moved half way across London to feel safe. Militant Islam is real and they do kill people.

Why is it ok to piss off Hindus, Buddhists and Christians but not Muslims? Hi Res are using images from their religions without fear of reprisal. Hi Res are playground bullies picking on reglions that wont fight back but running away from any risk to themselves. If they used Mohamed as well as the other religions they would be taking a brave stand for freedom of expression but as it they are just taking cheap shots at those that wont fight back.

You seriously think the terrorist attacks you listed had anything to do with religion? Notice how both attacks were on countries heavily involved in areas they do not want them, they unite under allah because thats how that part of the world functions, it was a retaliation to past and present involvement, note how the UK was attacked following personal involvement in those same countries in alliance with the US. The middle east has a long and complex history of tribal hatred and division which has nothing to do with islam (divisions within the ismlamic faith are a direct result of these past divisions), they hate involvement such as the US supporting Israel, which they believe was their land (it kind of was, they were removed from that land to make the Jewish state). Their violence is not justified but religion was not the motivator, it is politics and hatred that caused these, do not give them the ease of being victims of fanaticism as to do so paints them as something other than the villains these people are.

If you want to talk about homosexuals then im happy to have that discussion. Gays are hated by factions of every group, by race or faith or creed. Many Christians have killed homosexuals for being so. So have many Athiests, blacks, jews, whites, hindus and jedis. To single out one group and say they are the ones anti homosexual is to ignore than hommophobia is a universal problem no matter who perpetuates it. Its a shame what happened to that gay couple but it is not evidence that muslims are somehow any worse than anyone else. Ever heard of the IRA? Would you say their actions were religious or would you say that it was more a case of racial/tribal hatred and politics which caused it? They are rather similar in circumstance but somehow people dont hold them up as evidence that christians (as it was a catholic group, motivated by hatred of the irish protestants who were pro union and of the British who they believed took their land without claim to it, which we kind of did) are terrorists and inherently violent. Is it perhaps because many westerners are of those religions and know that those people are not representative, therefore the media didnt demonize them like they did with muslims? Militant anything kills people, it not something solely muslim.

Its not cowardly to use existing images of deities for a game, lazy perhaps and disrespectful in context, but not cowardly. Cowardess is not doing things which wont endanger yourself it is refusing to do something because you lack the bravery/conviction to do it. There are no existing images of Muhhamed, not in representation or physical evidence, thereofore to use his image is intentionally insulting because thats the only reason you would, it holds no other merit than shock value. Its not alright to insult anyones religion, no one ever said that. If you are going to use the actions of a minority to represent the majority then you should do that with every group, being consistent with your illogic.

Scrustle:
Oh boo fucking hoo. Get over it, your religion isn't special.

'

I bet the Christians would throw a much larger shitfit if Jesus was on the roster.

And the Muslims.. they can't take a joke at all.

I guess Hindus are going to have to deal with it. Misplaced religious symbolism is simply a fact of life in all different realms of media. But, more important than any of these concerns, people do not have a right to avoid being offended; there are no blasphemy laws on the books in most modernized nations.

I think Hindus ought to see this example in a somewhat different light. This means that their religions have achieved international exposure. And, as people understand the difference between real world and fiction, the inclusion of these characters in a video game could only lead interested gamers to read about their real religious mythos. After all, how many people ended up learning about the Sephiroth because of Final Fantasy?

Scrustle:
Oh boo fucking hoo. Get over it, your religion isn't special.

I now have more respect for them than I do for you. Nice work.

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