The Big Picture: The Numbers

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What a change in tone from last week's episode. Amazing episode once again Bob.

To quote you in a previous Big Picture, Bob...

"This is why we can never have good things!"

Someone should force all of Hollywood to watch this Big Picture so they can get a fapping clue. As much as I may have liked Tron, it was still not that great a movie since it only had niche appeal...same with the Fast and the Furious movies.

Hell, it's probably because of this that I no longer go out to watch movies anymore. Nothing good is being made except for a few very rare exceptions like Thor.

LawlessSquirrel:
Depressing. This is probably as pure an example as there is of capitalism simply not working.

Actually, this is an example of good capitalism. People demand crappy movies, the studios supply crappy movies. Studios compete to see who can release the crappiest cash-grab.

OT:
Bob, the sooner you realize that people like crap and there's nothing you can do about it the sooner you'll lose those headaches. It's not worth worrying about.

MacNille:
True, but i'm tired of him prasing Scott Pilgrim like it's the spawn of Jesus. Do you want to know why it failed? It has a very small demographig who would go see it.

I didn't get that this time through - I thought he was explaining how Scott Pilgrim's failure had negative impact, not how Scott Pilgrim's glory should save the world.

This made me nerdrage

This is the kind of falacious argument that makes me absolutely insane. Bob is saying here that we as a movie going public should go out and see "risky" and "high road" movies in order to facillitate better movies in the future.
The problem then is that Scott Pilgrim was, simply put, not a good movie. It had ever reason to succeed, and it failed because it deserved to do so. It had big name stars, a cult director of no small acclaim, massive marketing, and a choice release spot. The only thing that could hold it back was bad word of mouth, which it got in spades because it failed to deliver.
Mountains of Madness, then, was killed because of Universal's poor business choices. It lost money on movies it shouldn't have made for so much money, and it suffered for it. If it had been serious about Moutains of Madness, it would have made other guaranteed money makers in order to support it. Warner Brothers is a pretty good show at this: they make big money schlock but can then prop up Inception. And because Inception was good, it made money.
Saying that Scott Pilgrim succeeding would have enabled Mountains of Madness is ridiculous for another reason: one is a PG-13 love film to indie kids, and the other is an R-rated cerebral horror film. There is no pressumed crossover in audience appeal here. Scott Pilgrim only could have served as a money-injection for this film, which was always going to fail.
Universal, if they want to make risky movies, has to strike a balance of sure-fire profitable projects and high brow entertainment. And we have to stop blaming the failure of all good things on Scott Pilgrim.

Last time I went to the movies, it was cheaper to buy good beer and a good pizza for $23 than for 2 tickets to see Thor at $27. That is kind of why I don't go see movies in the theaters. But Scott Pilgrim is amazing, I wish I saw that in theaters.

Aw, that's really, really lame. That movie sounded amazing!

This is the same exact reason that they made 7 SAW films: because gullible people with too much money and not enough sense/taste kept going to see them.

The original SAW film was a masterpiece of psychological suspense and horror. It kept you guessing right up until the end, literally. The second one was decent, if a little rushed. All the rest were just a filthy cash grab.

If we're lucky, Bob, Nintendo or MS will greenlight that as a game, a la Eternal Darkness. A guy can dream.

MacNille:

Ashcrexl:

MacNille:
More Scott Pilgrim bullshit? Also The expendepals was not that bad. There are worse movie out there like Twilight

don't get your knickers in a twist. bob actually has a significant point this time.

True, but i'm tired of him prasing Scott Pilgrim like it's the spawn of Jesus. Do you want to know why it failed? It has a very small demographig who would go see it.

/facepalm

Did you even watch the video? THAT WAS HIS POINT.

baconsarnie:
I totally agree with this apart from:
1. The expendables was actually a pretty good film.
2. Scott pilgrim was an incredibly poor film.

1. Expendables very unoriginal film
2. Scott Pilgrim is a very original film

That my friend is a fact, ask anyone here and they will probably agree with me. Originality should be celebrated and supported in the arts, while unoriginal cookie-cutter trash should be forgotten.

DrEmo:

LawlessSquirrel:
Depressing. This is probably as pure an example as there is of capitalism simply not working.

Actually, this is an example of good capitalism. People demand crappy movies, the studios supply crappy movies. Studios compete to see who can release the crappiest cash-grab.

OT:
Bob, the sooner you realize that people like crap and there's nothing you can do about it the sooner you'll lose those headaches. It's not worth worrying about.

I feel like if people liked "crappy movies" Scott Pilgrim would have out-grossed Avatar.

Also, Inception would have been a BO failure. We can't keep assuming that people who dislike a film are just out for garbage. Sometimes a film we love for personal reasons just isn't that good.

twaddle:
wow. That is rather depressing. This isn't exactly a movie that would be a product placement thing either. How did Scott Pilgrim fail?

All the meat headed movie goers went to go see the Expendables which opened on the same weekend instead of Scott Pilgrim.

I heard about Del Toro's Mountains of Madness movie getting axed a long time ago and I'm still pissed about it. I really hope the movie still gets made eventually.

ArBeater:

baconsarnie:
I totally agree with this apart from:
1. The expendables was actually a pretty good film.
2. Scott pilgrim was an incredibly poor film.

1. Expendables very unoriginal film
2. Scott Pilgrim is a very original film

That my friend is a fact, ask anyone here and they will probably agree with me. Originality should be celebrated and supported in the arts, while unoriginal cookie-cutter trash should be forgotten.

Originality is not a panacea for bad storytelling and flat characters.

#Yawn
#Broken record
#Boo hoo

LawlessSquirrel:
Depressing. This is probably as pure an example as there is of capitalism simply not working.

Actually, I'd argue that it's a perfect example of capitalism working, just working in a very negative way. Capitalism is about making that which makes the most money for the least effort (a lazy man's economic system really) and so movies that are lazy but make tons of money succeed like mad. Perhaps movie studios need to try and find a line between atrocious money grabs (looking at you, Pirates 4) and movies that are mass appeal.

MacNille:
More Scott Pilgrim bullshit? Also The expendepals was not that bad. There are worse movie out there like Twilight

Intentional misspelling of Expendables?

There are worse movies out there, but it seems that they share their bad traits. Predictable plot, bad action, bad acting, poorly written script, awkward character dynamics, etc, etc, etc. Having not seen Expendables, these criticisms are based solely on Twilight which is a fan pandering mess if I've ever seen one.

It's kinda sad how such a great movie like Scott Pilgrim did so badly at the box office, but even worse that it got crushed by the utter garbage that was the expendables. The thing is though, I didn't see Scott pilgrim when it was out at the cinema either. The first time I watched it was when I bought it on DVD. Makes me feel kinda guilty about it now.

I still refused to watch a crappy cash-in movie like Fast and Furious 5 though so I guess that makes it a little better.

Good episode bob, I'm not going to lie, I like your episodes like this more than I do the ones about comics and superheroes.

MacNille:

True, but i'm tired of him prasing Scott Pilgrim like it's the spawn of Jesus. Do you want to know why it failed? It has a very small demographig who would go see it.

I went to see Scott Pilgrim twice and each time I saw a wide variety of people in the audience. From 12 year old girls and even an old man. The film's intended demographic may be small, but it's charms extend way beyond that demographic. I blame poor advertising in the critical summer period for Scott Pilgrim's downfall, as well as a refusal to use 3D as a selling point.

You'll have to excuse me, I have to go beat me head against a wall for several hours.
*wham wham wham wham wham wham wham wham wham wham...*

Damn. any Lovecraft movie at all would be good enough for me. the only time I wouldn't pay 20 bucks to see one in threaters would be if Michael Bay directed Call of Cthulhu. which is a reaccuring nightmare for me.

To everyone claiming this is proof of capitalism favoring the stupid and mentally diminished, I have one word:

Inception.

Original and thought provoking movies make money, but $85 million movies targeted to a exclusive, niche audience with an uncharismatic lead will never make their money back.

Togs:
First half= geek out
Second half= on the verge of tears

Fuck you general population, fuck you very much.

Welcome, you have now truly become a member of the escapist, the most bitter forum in the world.

ArBeater:

MacNille:

True, but i'm tired of him prasing Scott Pilgrim like it's the spawn of Jesus. Do you want to know why it failed? It has a very small demographig who would go see it.

I went to see Scott Pilgrim twice and each time I saw a wide variety of people in the audience. From 12 year old girls and even an old man. The film's intended demographic may be small, but it's charms extend way beyond that demographic. I blame poor advertising in the critical summer period for Scott Pilgrim's downfall, as well as a refusal to use 3D as a selling point.

I don't know how you can possibly blame poor advertising. I thought, if anything, this movie was a victim of oversaturation. I couldn't get away from it.

Wow, that was plain, simple, brutal truth. So awesome and painful at the same time! Kudos for you Bob.

DearFilm:
To everyone claiming this is proof of capitalism favoring the stupid and mentally diminished, I have one word:

Inception.

Original and thought provoking movies make money, but $85 million movies targeted to a exclusive, niche audience with an uncharismatic lead will never make their money back.

I think that's a bad example. Inception is brilhant from a business point of view. It achieves the same things The Matrix did. It's clever and tought provoking, but at the same time have a lot of shiny lights, things blowing or falling apart! It pleases greeks and trojans.

Truth is: money, for the most part, does not come from the hands of intelligent people, but their kids. And in the kids category I'm including teenager and young or immature adults.

shadowmagus:
My only thought after watching this was "...and the exact same can be said for gaming." It's always about the bottom line.

Oh yes.

Still wish for a Mirrors Edge Sequel.

But yeah, sad that Universal has finally given up on pleasing the geek crowd. After all, they not only took the respectable risk of greenlighting the Scott Pilgrim Movie, they also took the astronomical risk of doing Serenity, wich, may i remind you, is a multi million dollar sequel to a failed tv series that still belongs to another big Movie/TV powerhouse and was destined to fail from the get go.

Problem is, for any change to happen, not only do movie studios finally need to look beyond the opening weekend incomes, but viewers also need to get tired of "safe" movies.

And the latter thing won't happen because most people don't take movies THAT seriously. Not that this is an entirely awful thing, it's least its better than being bitchy like self proclaimed "core-gamers", but it's still kinda said since those moviegoers adopt the same "safe" stance as the studios that produce the movies for them, even though many wouldn't probably feel too uncomfortable outside of thier "safe zone"

DearFilm:

Originality is not a panacea for bad storytelling and flat characters.

oooh fancy words.

Care to explain how Scott Pilgrim has bad storytelling and flat characters? because last tiem I checked, Expendables was more guilty of this crime.

It's very sad to see stuff like this happening :(

We have to sit though so much stuff thats familiar and safe rather then seeing where the imagination can take us

Let's hope that this doesn't last forever

As much as Scott Pilgrim bored me, and as much as I hated the fact that you just wouldn't let it go, hearing the news about Del Toro's project going south makes me sad...

At the very least, this time, you didn't insult the people that enjoy those other movies.

kayisking:

Welcome, you have now truly become a member of the escapist, the most bitter forum in the world.

Meh it will still get made eventually, especially knowing Del Toro, it will just half the budget with silly wobbly sets.

And it will still be awesome.

DearFilm:

I don't know how you can possibly blame poor advertising. I thought, if anything, this movie was a victim of oversaturation. I couldn't get away from it.

The only way I found out there was a movie was when I picked up the first copy of the book two days before the film was released.

they were making a lovecraft movie! and the pan's labyrinth guy was going to make it! and now they FUCKING CANCELLED IT!!

I guess the key is making good movies inside they money-maker mold. Still, as true as it is, I have noticed that random artsy movies do much better when based around morality and religion (mainly Christianity due to the demographic in the States). Take movies like Fireproof or To Save a Life. Both those movies are completely outside the cookie-cutter logic of a successful movie, but they stunned the movie community with how well they did. Fireproof stayed on the top ten box office list for four weeks despite a limited release, which is pretty much unheard of, especially for some random "indy" movie put out by some Church in the south. Meanwhile, To Save a Life has become the movie poster child for suicide prevention, being shown in schools nation wide, despite the fact that it is a "Christian" movie. Anyway, I'm not saying all movies should be Christian, but it is something to think about.

I still say Scott Pilgrim was terrible...

Usualy I watch the big picture to learn and laugh more about how comics are weird (I work in a comics store, but I still learn stuff from moviebob), but this one just made me sad.

Well, at least he got this out of the way here and we can actually hear an in-depth review on Escape to the Movies.

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