Mass Effect 3 will be incomplete

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Well I for one am happy that this premium dlc content will be available for purchase by those who do not have the Collector's Edition. If it's anything like the Kasumi dlc from ME2, then it won't be essential and won't have any real impact on the single player experience as a whole and will purely be for just spending extra time with new content for a game that you enjoy. I didn't buy any of the dlc for DA2 because I didn't enjoy the game enough, but I purchased everything for ME2 (apart from the character skins) because I really enjoyed the game. Surely that's the whole point of dlc? I suppose it depends on how you view dlc. I never feel like I've been cheated out of content through dlc because it's impossible to quantify what constitutes a complete game and therefore a waste of my time to speculate as to whether or not game content has been held back from the vanilla release. Surely by the logic of the OP, any game that has extra downloadable content is incomplete?

Hmm... Twenty-four minutes of baseless ranty nerdrage? No thanks.

Think of Legion and Shale. Both fascinating characters, both sole representatives of their kind, both more or less ineffectual to the main plot. Delightfully enjoyable additions, seamlessly dispensable subtractions.

I will probably spend a good hour exploring this Prothean's background and sociology but I doubt it will leave me lost and confused in the time before I purchase it.

Loop Stricken:

lord Claincy Ffnord:
I can perfectly understand the feelings of everyone who is very angry about this, my first reaction was anger. But then I stopped and thought about it for a bit and there is a really important point that people seem to be forgetting. Unless I'm completely mistaken it was stated early that the collectors edition would contain an additional squadmate and a mission for them. Bioware has simply made it in the form of free DLC for those who bought the collector's edition and as a bonus made it available for the rest of us right off the bat. The other important point that has been mentioned before is that it was made during gold time, so it wasnt cutting into development time at all and couldn't be released as part of the full game anyway. SO if some of you would rather they had included it as part of the full game and had to wait another month for the game to come out. Personally I am perfectly happy to pay for the DLC. The main reason behind all of the anger against it is simply the stigma against day 1 DLC along with the importance of protheans to the ME universe.

Can I be honest with you and tell you that your freshly-registered account and single post reeks of poor shilling?

Remember that thread saying 'post count is too important'?

Thanks for proving that there are still people shallow enough to disregard someone's opinion because of that.

lord Claincy Ffnord:
I can perfectly understand the feelings of everyone who is very angry about this, my first reaction was anger. But then I stopped and thought about it for a bit and there is a really important point that people seem to be forgetting. Unless I'm completely mistaken it was stated early that the collectors edition would contain an additional squadmate and a mission for them. Bioware has simply made it in the form of free DLC for those who bought the collector's edition and as a bonus made it available for the rest of us right off the bat. The other important point that has been mentioned before is that it was made during gold time, so it wasnt cutting into development time at all and couldn't be released as part of the full game anyway. SO if some of you would rather they had included it as part of the full game and had to wait another month for the game to come out. Personally I am perfectly happy to pay for the DLC. The main reason behind all of the anger against it is simply the stigma against day 1 DLC along with the importance of protheans to the ME universe.

A very well thought out first post. Welcome to the escapist. I had hoped that your first quote would not of been of someone questioning your integrity. I apologise.

Vrex360:

boag:

Vrex360:

READ THIS IF YOU AREN'T AFRAID OF MASS EFFECT 3 SPOILERS!

Having read the spoilers in the leaked script (the actual proper leaked script, not the shockingly crappy draft) I can confirm that the arguments about the Prothean being super important and essential to the plot are false.
In the original draft, he was central to the story. However in the actual script of the game his role has been decreased dramatically, to the point that there is virtually no difference between a game that DOES have him and a game that DOESN'T. To put it simply he is no longer key to the plot, and the plot goes along perfectly well without him being in it at all.
The only thing that happens if you download him is you get an additional mission and then he's a squadmate, that's it. He has no vital intel or central conflict that the game would be lost without, just a minor mission that has little to no bearing on the actual story itself and after that he, like Zaeed and Kasumi before him, just exists on the ship with nothing more to say to you.
He is not 'removed' content, he is 'tacked on' content.
Hell, I'll give you a little fun fact about his DLC mission:


That's one of the benefits of being a poster on BSN, if you can wade through the creepiness, you find out new news about Mass Effect 3 faster. It also gives you perspective on what to be pissed off about and what to dismiss as 'nothing worth worrying about' and if you ask me, while Bioware are in the naughty stool for me for a lot relating to Mass Effect 3, this isn't one of them.
Bioware redesigning established female characters just to give them sex appeal? That's something to be pissed about. Bioware relying on gimmicks to market the game? That's something to be pissed about. Bioware adding an IGN reviewer to the cast in Mass Effect 3? Something to be pissed about (arguably). Bioware still not giving any info about whether or not they've given the approval to the Play Arts Kai line of action figures? Something to be pissed about (though I would be shocked if they didn't approve of them, they look great).

Bioware making a day one DLC be a bonus mission and squadmate that has no bearing on the game story whatsoever? Not something to be pissed about. If you want, you can be pissed that Bioware decided to add something to the story that should be important but turned it into a gimmick, or pissed that Bioware would make a dumb decision like adding a prothean to the plot in the first place (I think it's dumb anyway). All I'm saying is, do a little research first and know what should and shouldn't be hated on.

I'm sorry if I've offended but I'm still really not seeing him be that important.

you are right, I retract my comment

saltychipmunk:
I remember when games were 50 dollars, then cod posted at 60 dollars and now lookie lookie , every freaking publisher is starting to post at 60 dollars what a shocker.

Oh yeah? I've been gaming for 30 years. I remember when a new RPG was $69-89. I remember only being able to buy 1-2 titles a year, if that. I remember when they'd release a "voice pack" that added voice acting to your game for $40. I remember owning a console back when there was no such thing as "used games" or renting from the video store, you bought it new for whatever godforsaken price they were asking, or you didn't buy it at all.

Now most new games cost $39-49 for me, or I can wait a few months and get them for $5-10 in a Steam sale. I can rent a $60 console game for $5, and play it to completion over a weekend. I can get fantastic, innovative games like the Minecraft or the Humble Indie Bundle for next to nothing.

The fact is this hobby has never been cheaper, and we've never had anywhere near this amount of choice available to us. Even the most obscure genres get serviced by independent developers.

You go on and keep thinking that "greed" is like, a new thing they just came up with a couple of years ago though, or that we're teetering on the edge of a terrifying slippery slope, where things like market forces and supply and demand won't exist any more, and the publishers will charge us a BILLION DOLLARS for new games and we'll HAVE to pay it because OMG.

Our completely non-essential hobby costs money. It has always cost money. It continues to cost money. Boo frickin' hoo.

BloatedGuppy:
Oh yeah? I've been gaming for 30 years. I remember when a new RPG was $69-89. I remember only being able to buy 1-2 titles a year, if that. I remember when they'd release a "voice pack" that added voice acting to your game for $40. I remember owning a console back when there was no such thing as "used games" or renting from the video store, you bought it new for whatever godforsaken price they were asking, or you didn't buy it at all.

Now most new games cost $39-49 for me, or I can wait a few months and get them for $5-10 in a Steam sale. I can rent a $60 console game for $5, and play it to completion over a weekend. I can get fantastic, innovative games like the Minecraft or the Humble Indie Bundle for next to nothing.

The fact is this hobby has never been cheaper, and we've never had anywhere near this amount of choice available to us. Even the most obscure genres get serviced by independent developers.

You go on and keep thinking that "greed" is like, a new thing they just came up with a couple of years ago though, or that we're teetering on the edge of a terrifying slippery slope, where things like market forces and supply and demand won't exist any more, and the publishers will charge us a BILLION DOLLARS for new games and we'll HAVE to pay it because OMG.

Our completely non-essential hobby costs money. It has always cost money. It continues to cost money. Boo frickin' hoo.

THIS! The whole thing!

It's been more around 20 years for me but I get you.
Thanks for making me feel so old, tho. :(

BloatedGuppy:

saltychipmunk:
I remember when games were 50 dollars, then cod posted at 60 dollars and now lookie lookie , every freaking publisher is starting to post at 60 dollars what a shocker.

Oh yeah? I've been gaming for 30 years. I remember when a new RPG was $69-89. I remember only being able to buy 1-2 titles a year, if that. I remember when they'd release a "voice pack" that added voice acting to your game for $40. I remember owning a console back when there was no such thing as "used games" or renting from the video store, you bought it new for whatever godforsaken price they were asking, or you didn't buy it at all.

Now most new games cost $39-49 for me, or I can wait a few months and get them for $5-10 in a Steam sale. I can rent a $60 console game for $5, and play it to completion over a weekend. I can get fantastic, innovative games like the Minecraft or the Humble Indie Bundle for next to nothing.

The fact is this hobby has never been cheaper, and we've never had anywhere near this amount of choice available to us. Even the most obscure genres get serviced by independent developers.

You go on and keep thinking that "greed" is like, a new thing they just came up with a couple of years ago though, or that we're teetering on the edge of a terrifying slippery slope, where things like market forces and supply and demand won't exist any more, and the publishers will charge us a BILLION DOLLARS for new games and we'll HAVE to pay it because OMG.

Our completely non-essential hobby costs money. It has always cost money. It continues to cost money. Boo frickin' hoo.

It's not that greed is "new" It's that we've slowly grown tolerant of all kinds of strange greed and excessive greed. This DLC business is a relatively new invention and it is doing what has never been done; selling content on disc for more than the original price. This is new. the examples you've mentioned the rpg's for 69. THough I'm sure they existed back then, they were NOT THE MAJORITY. New game releases are always fucking 60 bucks.

Plus its a bit ridiculous of you to say "omg voice pack" none of the games during that generation had voice actors, a voice pack back then WOULD have to cost 40 bucks. Or no one would even waste time on it. Though can you tell me which games you speak of. I'm very curious.

Here is a nice quote made by Jessica Merizan, Community Manager for Bioware, on a reddit subforum where she did a ask me anything interview today.
http://www.reddit.com/r/masseffect/comments/q2sl2/i_am_jessica_merizan_community_manager_for/

"[-]jessicamerizan[S] 191 points 4 hours ago

I think there's a lot of misinformation out there and I wish the guy who made the initial video about it would have had an open mind before jumping to conclusions based on a leak we weren't ready to address. Since I'm a BioWare employee, I know people won't automatically trust me, but I hope people will consider that it wasn't cut content from the larger game. I was in Edmonton when we were finishing the game in November/December and I was in Edmonton again last month when they were working on the Day 1 DLC. It definitely was only possible to do because the main game was in certification (which means we had to wait for people to test it and make sure everything was good etc before we could get the greenlight to sell it). I also played the game WITHOUT the DLC in my first playthrough and honestly, it's an awesome addition but I was more than happy with what I was given in the game. It's bigger and more expansive than ever. Of course, I understand the concern but I hope we can all have an intelligent conversation about it and cover what the facts are in this situation.

Hope that helps a little bit. This is an awkward format to answer this question, but I know I could explain it if you were sitting next to me on a couch with some coffee/tea ;)

also this farther down

[-]ZombieWomble 19 points 4 hours ago

The production is one issue, but I think many more people are annoyed by the particular content of the DLC - I expect that if it was a "normal" character, like Zaeed, Shale, Sebastian or Kasumi in Bioware's other titles, it would probably have been met with a shrug and some minor moaning about greedy developers.

But the choice of character is so shocking, given the rest of the ME lore, that it's mind-boggling that it was bundled into DLC. At first glance, the character sounds like they must be plot- and lore-significant, simply because they exist, and the fact that it apparently sits outside the main plotline is baffling. Which raises the question of when the idea of this character was introduced, and if it was taken from the original plans for the main game, or not. The timing of when the team worked on it is really immaterial to its impact on the world and its lore.

So, to sum all that up in a question: There is a lot of anger about the lore surrounding this character. Is it as bad as it looks? Does this character's existence really shake the lore as much as it seems they must, or is it closer in heft to Zaeed or Kasumi?

It's sad, really, because I'm now torn - ME3 really should be a day 1 purchase, given the pedigree, but if this really is significant, plot-shaking content carved off into DLC, then that's not really something that I can get behind.

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[-]jessicamerizan[S] 19 points 1 hour ago

I hope you understand that I'm in a position where to reassure you, it would require me to reveal story spoilers, something that I don't think is acceptable.

Personally, I began my career as an archaeologist (for serious!) and the events surrounding this new character speak to me. However, if it wasn't DLC, it definitely wouldn't have been in the main game. There's other things that didn't fit in the main game that may end up as future DLC.

Again, I think this is a cool edition and definitely intended as a reward for serious fans (many of whom have purchased the collector's edition so this isn't even an issue for them). However, I have played the game without it and the lore surrounding the DLC is in the game already, this character just gives their own take on it.

Was that any less vague or helpful to anyone? :P

Zeel:
It's not that greed is "new" It's that we've slowly grown tolerant of all kinds of strange greed and excessive greed. This DLC business is a relatively new invention and it is doing what has never been done; selling content on disc for more than the original price. This is new. the examples you've mentioned the rpg's for 69. THough I'm sure they existed back then, they were NOT THE MAJORITY. New game releases are always fucking 60 bucks.

Plus its a bit ridiculous of you to say "omg voice pack" none of the games during that generation had voice actors, a voice pack back then WOULD have to cost 40 bucks. Or no one would even waste time on it. Though can you tell me which games you speak of. I'm very curious.

No, they really were, Zeel. Games were really expensive back then. Especially the halfway decent ones, which, generally speaking, were the only ones you'd want to play.

Why is it ridiculous? That was the cost of "game + expansion". That was the "DLC" of that time. The reason you're seeing it more now is because the internet has matured to the point where it can function as a delivery system for this shit. Again, we are not "more tolerant of greed", and greed is not a new development.

I don't even disagree with you, Zeel, that day one DLC is brazen and greedy. Clearly it is. If they want $10 extra for some day one DLC I consider indispensible, then I guess the game now costs $69 instead of $59. Would I pay $69 for ME3? I guess I would. I bet most people would. That's how a free market works, man.

What I don't understand is the volume of your outrage. This isn't medicine for your kids, or food, or drinking water. This is a fucking video game about Space Jesus and Killer Robots. If you have to wait a few months for the price to drop, or just not play it, your life will continue pretty much undisturbed. If they priced themselves out of your interest range, don't buy it.

You're up to like 150 posts now on this issue. In the time it took you to write those posts, you could've worked for a couple of hours and gotten the DLC for free, and maybe a nice sandwich as well. Wouldn't a nice sandwich be better than all this upset? I think it would.

BloatedGuppy:

saltychipmunk:
I remember when games were 50 dollars, then cod posted at 60 dollars and now lookie lookie , every freaking publisher is starting to post at 60 dollars what a shocker.

Oh yeah? I've been gaming for 30 years. I remember when a new RPG was $69-89. I remember only being able to buy 1-2 titles a year, if that. I remember when they'd release a "voice pack" that added voice acting to your game for $40. I remember owning a console back when there was no such thing as "used games" or renting from the video store, you bought it new for whatever godforsaken price they were asking, or you didn't buy it at all.

Now most new games cost $39-49 for me, or I can wait a few months and get them for $5-10 in a Steam sale. I can rent a $60 console game for $5, and play it to completion over a weekend. I can get fantastic, innovative games like the Minecraft or the Humble Indie Bundle for next to nothing.

The fact is this hobby has never been cheaper, and we've never had anywhere near this amount of choice available to us. Even the most obscure genres get serviced by independent developers.

You go on and keep thinking that "greed" is like, a new thing they just came up with a couple of years ago though, or that we're teetering on the edge of a terrifying slippery slope, where things like market forces and supply and demand won't exist any more, and the publishers will charge us a BILLION DOLLARS for new games and we'll HAVE to pay it because OMG.

Our completely non-essential hobby costs money. It has always cost money. It continues to cost money. Boo frickin' hoo.

Remember when an Atari Cartridge for ET costed 89.99?

Kids these days.

00slash00:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Ri0vrJ-y2zM&feature=g-u-u&context=G2d57caeFUAAAAAAAAAA

basically, an extremely vital part of the mass effect lore and story has been cut out and will be sold as dlc on launch day. it will be free if you have the collectors edition but everyone else will have to pay $10 for it. now im all for giving people a reason to buy a game new but this does the exact opposite. i have no reason to buy the game new anymore because just to get the complete story i will have to buy the dlc anyway. it just strikes me as a big "fuck you" to the fans. bravo, EA, bravo.

I love the series, so I'm buying the collectors edition... one way to look at this is, the standard edition is missing content, another way to look at it is, the collectors edition has more content.

Either way, its incentive for those who've pre-ordered the game to upgrade to the collectors edition (if its even possible, my pre-order has been down for a good 9 months or so, I think), but ultimately, everyone who wants the full game will need to pay $10 more, so isn't it all equal?

Zeel:
Plus its a bit ridiculous of you to say "omg voice pack" none of the games during that generation had voice actors, a voice pack back then WOULD have to cost 40 bucks. Or no one would even waste time on it. Though can you tell me which games you speak of. I'm very curious.

Strike Commander, for one.
Were you even born then? It's a 1993 game.
This is more or less when games started having real voices.
One of the best ones I ever played back then was Gabriel Knight: Sins of the Fathers. Also 1993. Gabriel was voiced by Tim Curry. It was glorious.

Raognerrrm:
My understanding is that he will still be in the game, but the DLC will allow him to be part of your squad and give you an extra mission (or more).
Someone from Bioware also said that they started making the DLC after Mass Effect 3 had gone gold. This means it's not using up the development time, and basically gives Bioware something to do while they wait for Microsoft and Sony to test the actual game.
Thus, I have no problem with it.

What this guy said. Plus, they have said from the start that this DLC was at first intended to fan service to those who bought the CE. They just decided to release this as Day 1 DLC because so many people bought the CE.

Also, he isn't extremely relevant to the story...so...

Ya know...honestly I don't even get mad about the costume packs anymore. Sure they are "leaving" out parts of the game but its parts of the game that don't even matter. If you are that worked up about a costume pack then you are probably one of the few people interested in actually buying a costume pack.

Loethlin:

BloatedGuppy:
Oh yeah? I've been gaming for 30 years. I remember when a new RPG was $69-89. I remember only being able to buy 1-2 titles a year, if that. I remember when they'd release a "voice pack" that added voice acting to your game for $40. I remember owning a console back when there was no such thing as "used games" or renting from the video store, you bought it new for whatever godforsaken price they were asking, or you didn't buy it at all.

Now most new games cost $39-49 for me, or I can wait a few months and get them for $5-10 in a Steam sale. I can rent a $60 console game for $5, and play it to completion over a weekend. I can get fantastic, innovative games like the Minecraft or the Humble Indie Bundle for next to nothing.

The fact is this hobby has never been cheaper, and we've never had anywhere near this amount of choice available to us. Even the most obscure genres get serviced by independent developers.

You go on and keep thinking that "greed" is like, a new thing they just came up with a couple of years ago though, or that we're teetering on the edge of a terrifying slippery slope, where things like market forces and supply and demand won't exist any more, and the publishers will charge us a BILLION DOLLARS for new games and we'll HAVE to pay it because OMG.

Our completely non-essential hobby costs money. It has always cost money. It continues to cost money. Boo frickin' hoo.

THIS! The whole thing!

It's been more around 20 years for me but I get you.
Thanks for making me feel so old, tho. :(

Agreed! I really like that he highlighted our hobby is a nonessential hobby. Some people fail to realize that.

Loethlin:

Zeel:
Plus its a bit ridiculous of you to say "omg voice pack" none of the games during that generation had voice actors, a voice pack back then WOULD have to cost 40 bucks. Or no one would even waste time on it. Though can you tell me which games you speak of. I'm very curious.

Strike Commander, for one.
Were you even born then? It's a 1993 game.
This is more or less when games started having real voices.
One of the best ones I ever played back then was Gabriel Knight: Sins of the Fathers. Also 1993. Gabriel was voiced by Tim Curry. It was glorious.

I was alive, just a little too young to remember anything. I'm was old enough to play on the Snes. anything further behind is a beyond me.

Zeel:

Loethlin:

Zeel:
Plus its a bit ridiculous of you to say "omg voice pack" none of the games during that generation had voice actors, a voice pack back then WOULD have to cost 40 bucks. Or no one would even waste time on it. Though can you tell me which games you speak of. I'm very curious.

Strike Commander, for one.
Were you even born then? It's a 1993 game.
This is more or less when games started having real voices.
One of the best ones I ever played back then was Gabriel Knight: Sins of the Fathers. Also 1993. Gabriel was voiced by Tim Curry. It was glorious.

I was alive, just a little too young to remember anything. I'm was old enough to play on the Snes. anything further behind is a beyond me.

just a random question but how old are you

Zeel:
I was alive, just a little too young to remember anything. I'm was old enough to play on the Snes. anything further behind is a beyond me.

Well, HERE'S your problem!

Ok, maybe I should expand on it.
Look, you're too young to remember how brutal on the wallet it was and how things you take for granted were awesome new special features. Really, what is going on right now is nothing new. videogame industry was always like this.

BloatedGuppy:

Zeel:
It's not that greed is "new" It's that we've slowly grown tolerant of all kinds of strange greed and excessive greed. This DLC business is a relatively new invention and it is doing what has never been done; selling content on disc for more than the original price. This is new. the examples you've mentioned the rpg's for 69. THough I'm sure they existed back then, they were NOT THE MAJORITY. New game releases are always fucking 60 bucks.

Plus its a bit ridiculous of you to say "omg voice pack" none of the games during that generation had voice actors, a voice pack back then WOULD have to cost 40 bucks. Or no one would even waste time on it. Though can you tell me which games you speak of. I'm very curious.

No, they really were, Zeel. Games were really expensive back then. Especially the halfway decent ones, which, generally speaking, were the only ones you'd want to play.

Why is it ridiculous? That was the cost of "game + expansion". That was the "DLC" of that time. The reason you're seeing it more now is because the internet has matured to the point where it can function as a delivery system for this shit. Again, we are not "more tolerant of greed", and greed is not a new development.

I don't even disagree with you, Zeel, that day one DLC is brazen and greedy. Clearly it is. If they want $10 extra for some day one DLC I consider indispensible, then I guess the game now costs $69 instead of $59. Would I pay $69 for ME3? I guess I would. I bet most people would. That's how a free market works, man.

What I don't understand is the volume of your outrage. This isn't medicine for your kids, or food, or drinking water. This is a fucking video game about Space Jesus and Killer Robots. If you have to wait a few months for the price to drop, or just not play it, your life will continue pretty much undisturbed. If they priced themselves out of your interest range, don't buy it.

You're up to like 150 posts now on this issue. In the time it took you to write those posts, you could've worked for a couple of hours and gotten the DLC for free, and maybe a nice sandwich as well. Wouldn't a nice sandwich be better than all this upset? I think it would.

You almost had me until your last sentence. It's insulting to think the only reason I'm not purchasing this game for 80 bucks is because I don't want to spend the money. I had the collectors editions preordered right up until the Origins announcment. It has nothing to do with it being 'too much money'. but them going 'too far'.

My zeal is just awho I am. I am passionate about many issues. Any issue that matters to me I argue it with the same intensity. Just about who I am. insignificant or not, I will fight it.

I draw the line here, not a step further.

Zeel:

BloatedGuppy:

Zeel:
It's not that greed is "new" It's that we've slowly grown tolerant of all kinds of strange greed and excessive greed. This DLC business is a relatively new invention and it is doing what has never been done; selling content on disc for more than the original price. This is new. the examples you've mentioned the rpg's for 69. THough I'm sure they existed back then, they were NOT THE MAJORITY. New game releases are always fucking 60 bucks.

Plus its a bit ridiculous of you to say "omg voice pack" none of the games during that generation had voice actors, a voice pack back then WOULD have to cost 40 bucks. Or no one would even waste time on it. Though can you tell me which games you speak of. I'm very curious.

No, they really were, Zeel. Games were really expensive back then. Especially the halfway decent ones, which, generally speaking, were the only ones you'd want to play.

Why is it ridiculous? That was the cost of "game + expansion". That was the "DLC" of that time. The reason you're seeing it more now is because the internet has matured to the point where it can function as a delivery system for this shit. Again, we are not "more tolerant of greed", and greed is not a new development.

I don't even disagree with you, Zeel, that day one DLC is brazen and greedy. Clearly it is. If they want $10 extra for some day one DLC I consider indispensible, then I guess the game now costs $69 instead of $59. Would I pay $69 for ME3? I guess I would. I bet most people would. That's how a free market works, man.

What I don't understand is the volume of your outrage. This isn't medicine for your kids, or food, or drinking water. This is a fucking video game about Space Jesus and Killer Robots. If you have to wait a few months for the price to drop, or just not play it, your life will continue pretty much undisturbed. If they priced themselves out of your interest range, don't buy it.

You're up to like 150 posts now on this issue. In the time it took you to write those posts, you could've worked for a couple of hours and gotten the DLC for free, and maybe a nice sandwich as well. Wouldn't a nice sandwich be better than all this upset? I think it would.

You almost had me until your last sentence. It's insulting to think the only reason I'm not purchasing this game for 80 bucks is because I don't want to spend the money. I had the collectors editions preordered right up until the Origins announcment. It has nothing to do with it being 'too much money'. but them going 'too far'.

My zeal is just awho I am. I am passionate about many issues. Any issue that matters to me I argue it with the same intensity. Just about who I am. insignificant or not, I will fight it.

I draw the line here, not a step further.

even when there is proof that its wrong you still fight it

Tony me and you are not friends. Stop replying to me.

+1 for Tony, then. Chicken :>

Zeel:
Tony me and you are not friends. Stop replying to me.

Uh, didn't you criticize someone for pulling the "I don't want to argue with you anymore" card...and now you're telling someone to stop arguing with you...Hypocritical much?

erttheking:

Zeel:
Tony me and you are not friends. Stop replying to me.

Uh, didn't you criticize someone for pulling the "I don't want to argue with you anymore" card...and now you're telling someone to stop arguing with you...Hypocritical much?

Damn it dude. You and TONY a just need to get over it. EVERY TOPIC I POST ON, I get a reply from atleast one of you. No. I'm not ignoring Tony's argument. You can check for yourself. He just keeps rehashing the same thing over and over again like my fucking grandmother on thanksgiven. YOU seem to turn up at the worst times. I'll be in an argument and then you come in and just "OMG HE IZ A JRKKKKK"
enough please.
We are not friends. Lets leave it there. You have an argument to make, then make it.

Zeel:

erttheking:

Zeel:
Tony me and you are not friends. Stop replying to me.

Uh, didn't you criticize someone for pulling the "I don't want to argue with you anymore" card...and now you're telling someone to stop arguing with you...Hypocritical much?

Damn it dude. You and TONY and ANTHONY just need to get over it. EVERY TOPIC I POST ON, I get a reply from atleast one of you. No. I'm not ignoring Tony's argument. You can check for yourself. He just keeps rehashing the same thing over and over again like my fucking grandmother on thanksgiven. YOU seem to turn up at the worst times. I'll be in an argument and then you come in and just "OMG HE IZ A JRKKKKK"
enough please.
We are not friends. I do not like. You don't like me. Lets leave it there.

http://www.reddit.com/r/masseffect/comments/q2sl2/i_am_jessica_merizan_community_manager_for/?sort=hot more proof you wrong about the dlc enjoy now since its pointless to continue unless this finally makes you see the light i'll see you when the game comes out when we'll see who's right

Zeel:

erttheking:

Zeel:
Tony me and you are not friends. Stop replying to me.

Uh, didn't you criticize someone for pulling the "I don't want to argue with you anymore" card...and now you're telling someone to stop arguing with you...Hypocritical much?

Damn it dude. You and TONY and ANTHONY just need to get over it. EVERY TOPIC I POST ON, I get a reply from atleast one of you. No. I'm not ignoring Tony's argument. You can check for yourself. He just keeps rehashing the same thing over and over again like my fucking grandmother on thanksgiven. YOU seem to turn up at the worst times. I'll be in an argument and then you come in and just "OMG HE IZ A JRKKKKK"
enough please.
We are not friends. Lets leave it there. You have an argument to make, then make it.

So let me get this straight, you criticize someone for not wanting to continue an argument, but then you criticize them for being dedicated to n argument. There should be a word for a situation like this, a person that will take any route to insult someone, even if it means changing his stance on something in a nanosecond, like in Halo when you call someone a noob for doing bad and then call someone a no life for doing better than you in the next game.

We're not friends...oh darn and I...thought that we were?

tony2077:
http://www.reddit.com/r/masseffect/comments/q2sl2/i_am_jessica_merizan_community_manager_for/?sort=hot more proof you wrong about the dlc enjoy now since its pointless to continue unless this finally makes you see the light i'll see you when the game comes out when we'll see who's right

Ive posted that same link on about 5 threads with copy-pastad quotes from the person herself and everyone ignores it, lets hope they read it when you pst it.

erttheking:

Zeel:

erttheking:

Uh, didn't you criticize someone for pulling the "I don't want to argue with you anymore" card...and now you're telling someone to stop arguing with you...Hypocritical much?

Damn it dude. You and TONY and ANTHONY just need to get over it. EVERY TOPIC I POST ON, I get a reply from atleast one of you. No. I'm not ignoring Tony's argument. You can check for yourself. He just keeps rehashing the same thing over and over again like my fucking grandmother on thanksgiven. YOU seem to turn up at the worst times. I'll be in an argument and then you come in and just "OMG HE IZ A JRKKKKK"
enough please.
We are not friends. Lets leave it there. You have an argument to make, then make it.

So let me get this straight, you criticize someone for not wanting to continue an argument, but then you criticize them for being dedicated to n argument. There should be a word for a situation like this, a person that will take any route to insult someone, even if it means changing his stance on something in a nanosecond, like in Halo when you call someone a noob for doing bad and then call someone a no life for doing better than you in the next game.

We're not friends...oh darn and I...thought that we were?

The criticism was his rehashing of his argument not his 'dedication'. You can check if you want, we just go in circles.

SajuukKhar:

tony2077:
http://www.reddit.com/r/masseffect/comments/q2sl2/i_am_jessica_merizan_community_manager_for/?sort=hot more proof you wrong about the dlc enjoy now since its pointless to continue unless this finally makes you see the light i'll see you when the game comes out when we'll see who's right

Ive posted that same link on about 5 threads with copy-pastad quotes from the person herself and everyone ignores it, lets hope they read it when you pst it.

We're not ignoring it; we're all following the same threads and we see it posted twice in every single one of them.
It also reeks of marketing propaganda, so some of the more cynical members won't put a great deal of faith in it.

Zeel:

erttheking:

Zeel:

Damn it dude. You and TONY and ANTHONY just need to get over it. EVERY TOPIC I POST ON, I get a reply from atleast one of you. No. I'm not ignoring Tony's argument. You can check for yourself. He just keeps rehashing the same thing over and over again like my fucking grandmother on thanksgiven. YOU seem to turn up at the worst times. I'll be in an argument and then you come in and just "OMG HE IZ A JRKKKKK"
enough please.
We are not friends. Lets leave it there. You have an argument to make, then make it.

So let me get this straight, you criticize someone for not wanting to continue an argument, but then you criticize them for being dedicated to n argument. There should be a word for a situation like this, a person that will take any route to insult someone, even if it means changing his stance on something in a nanosecond, like in Halo when you call someone a noob for doing bad and then call someone a no life for doing better than you in the next game.

We're not friends...oh darn and I...thought that we were?

The criticism was his rehashing of his argument not his 'dedication'. You can check if you want, we just go in circles.

Rehashing his arguments...you mean that thing you've been doing since you joined this website?

Zeel:
Tony me and you are not friends. Stop replying to me.

The Escapist does have an ignore function. If you click on a user's name in a thread you get the option to add them to your ignore list.

SajuukKhar:

tony2077:
http://www.reddit.com/r/masseffect/comments/q2sl2/i_am_jessica_merizan_community_manager_for/?sort=hot more proof you wrong about the dlc enjoy now since its pointless to continue unless this finally makes you see the light i'll see you when the game comes out when we'll see who's right

Ive posted that same link on about 5 threads with copy-pastad quotes from the person herself and everyone ignores it, lets hope they read it when you pst it.

i hope so. i think i should stop since all i'm doing is going in a circle with no end in sight and the people i know in real life say it pointless as well. so fight on brave warriors for truth and justice

Loop Stricken:

SajuukKhar:

tony2077:
http://www.reddit.com/r/masseffect/comments/q2sl2/i_am_jessica_merizan_community_manager_for/?sort=hot more proof you wrong about the dlc enjoy now since its pointless to continue unless this finally makes you see the light i'll see you when the game comes out when we'll see who's right

Ive posted that same link on about 5 threads with copy-pastad quotes from the person herself and everyone ignores it, lets hope they read it when you pst it.

We're not ignoring it; we're all following the same threads and we see it posted twice in every single one of them.
It also reeks of marketing propaganda, so some of the more cynical members won't put a great deal of faith in it.

Better to believe baseless conspiracies then the words of the people who made the game?

yeah i know a lot of people prefer that.

SajuukKhar:

Loop Stricken:

SajuukKhar:

Ive posted that same link on about 5 threads with copy-pastad quotes from the person herself and everyone ignores it, lets hope they read it when you pst it.

We're not ignoring it; we're all following the same threads and we see it posted twice in every single one of them.
It also reeks of marketing propaganda, so some of the more cynical members won't put a great deal of faith in it.

Better to believe baseless conspiracies then the words of the people who made the game?

yeah i know a lot of people prefer that.

Hell of a lot more fun.

You know what makes me even more sad than the kind of business practices Bioware has chosen to take part in?
That there are actually so many people falling for and accepting their explanation. I could even accept if some people would just simply say "I don't care that they're ripping me off, I'm going to get it anyway", but this mass delusion is seriously something else.

Those "DLCs" are being set into stone very early in the project management cycle, not only the "Day1-DLC" ones, but even the ones that are set to release 1 or 2 months after Release, they're making a product plan detailing the release schedule and every piece of content, including when they announce it and when it is going to get released, anything other than minor things like "extra skins" are planned out well ahead of release.

Story and dialogues around those DLCs are being written and recorded at the same time as the rest of the content, it would (fiscally) not make very much sense to have to go back into the studio and hire all the (high-profile, high-cost) voice actors back for a few extra sentences. Examples for this with Mass Effect 3 are also rather obvious seeing as said character is all over the leaked script and as people already mentioned they announced him like 7 months or so ago without giving any details, there was also concept art and sound bits a long time ago.

Why they're constantly repeated that it is a "different team" working on it I don't know... yes there are a lot of different teams working on a lot of different aspects of the games (and different areas) at any given time during the development of such a game, you're not going to find 100+ people all working together on something.

In regards to the people saying that they only do DLC after the game has "gone gold", THINK about it... they announced they achieved gold status and are ready for pressing on 13.02: http://www.strategyinformer.com/news/16557/mass-effect-3-has-achieved-gold-master-status-finally-ready-for-pressing , the full DLC leaked on Xbox Live on 20.02: http://kotaku.com/5887092/mass-effect-3-dlc-pops-up-early-on-xbox-marketplace-spoils-plot-point , do you REALLY think that they did all the work on this in one week, I mean REALLY?

What's happening here is big companies that have noticed they can monetize certain parts of their games better and are becoming ever so more brazen in their attempts to do so, at least a few people in the industry like Kotick are outright saying it:

In the last cycle of videogames you spent $50 on a game, played it and took it back to the shop for credit. Today, we'll (charge) $100 for a guitar. You might add a microphone or drums; you might buy two or three expansions packs, different types of music. Over the life of your ownership you'll probably buy around 25 additional song packs in digital downloads. So, what used to be a $50 sale is a $500 sale today.

image

Aside from that it wouldn't even really matter if the content is done before or after release, Shale and Zaeed were "Downloadable Content" via a Code in every box too, free for everyone buying new, the same code is part of every Mass Effect 3 CE (I guess it means "Complete Edition" rather than "Collector's Edition" in this context) and it could also be part of every single SE without any major change to any code on the disk...

It seriously almost hurts my brain that there are people out there actually buying that they're doing this "extra content" for anything else than fleecing their customers.

Especially since they've been so thorough with Mass Effect 3 to make that abundantly clear for everyone:
- Important Day-15 Pay-DLC: http://kotaku.com/5887092/mass-effect-3-dlc-pops-up-early-on-xbox-marketplace-spoils-plot-point
- Collector's Edition/Deluxe Edition with even more Exklusive In-Game Content (Bonus Mission + Character, Arsenal Pack, Hoodie, Robot Dog, Squad Appearence Pack)
- Several different Pre-Order Bonuses from a varying amount of Retailers and Online Distribution platforms like Origin, e.g. AT-12 Raider Shotgun or Warfare Gear etc.
- Cross-Game Promotion to Demo of another game (Kingdom of Amalur for Launcher Weapon + Armor)
- iOS Game as "tie-in", that can supposedly alter your progress in Mass Effect 3
- The game as a whole was pushed back because EA demanded a Multiplayer-Mode for all of its games, respective there's now an "Online-Pass".
- Additional Exclusive Bonus DLC with the different Action figures, "Collect all 8 for the full experience!", the Liara figure and a whole bunch of Razer Hardware
- I could bet that before or shortly after release there's going to be even more stuff offering additional DLC or content, maybe including Dr. Pepper Codes and another one of them Facebook games or something similar.

Whoever still believes that they're doing all this with "good intentions" and it's not just a pure marketing stunt to press as much money from their existing customer base is imo blind... if one cares about it so much that one doesn't buy the game is left to every single individual and I for one decided to cancel my SW:TOR subscription and not buy Mass Effect 3, but this mass delusion is really starting to get on my nutsack.

These publishers are taking it ever one step further, in Assassin's Creed II, they cut out an entire chapter near the end of the game to release it as DLC. Same thing happened with L.A. Noire as there were several (5 I think) "cases" with main story plot-points in them as well as dialogue that were "Pre-Order Bonuses" and DLC to buy later on. In Mafia2 they cut out a few characters and "Free-Roam" gameplay they showed before to add it later as DLC. "Arrival" for Mass Effect 2 came close as it's supposed to close the gap between it and the third part. "The Missing Link" for Deus Ex: Human Revolution ties loose ends that would let the ending of the original game make more sense, same thing with the "Sebastian" DLC for Dragon Age 2.
And there's always also the thing with the "on-disc" DLC, Capcom for instance is famously known for by selling "unlock codes" to stuff that is already on the disc.
By buying into this kind of business practice you are legitimizing it and are green-lighting them to do something even worse the next time and are making gaming as a whole more expensive and worse for everyone involved than the publishers themselves...

Dexter111:

image

You know, people keep using this sliced up Mona Lisa image to try to show what the industry is doing, but it is incorrect about the whole thing.

I really should create a more accurate analogy/reflection of the dev process. I normally use the cake/muffin analogy, but I can change it around for painting as well - a lot of the background processes are similar.

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