CryTek turns from Piracy to Used Sales - Next-gen used games block "would be absolutely awesome"

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"It's also a little flattering because people are willing to bother download these 10GB files or whatever the game takes because they think it looks great. We obviously want to avoid that this time, but even if we can convert 25 percent of those gamers into paying customers [you have an extra million sales]."

No, if you convert 25% of them into paying customers you'd have an extra hundred thousand or so sales. Please try and learn the most basic elements of logic before you open your mouth Hojengaard, you're embarrassing the entire human race like this.

Edit: Actually I can tell I'm going to have to clarify this one. If you convert a million pirates into paying customers that's a million people who would potentially buy your game. They've shown enough interest to click on a torrent link, but getting them to pay full price for it? a 10% conversion rate on that would be amazingly good.

ResonanceSD:
Ha! The EA rot kicks in. Goodbye, formerly mediocre, now terrible, franchise.

Where were you when Crysis 2 was released?

Before Crysis 2 came out, Crytek was crying about how piracy fucked their sales with their first game (it sold well, by the way). In a stunning stroke of irony, they sold as many Crysis 2 copies through all three platforms as they did the original only on the PC. And lo and behold, now they have something else to blame their failure on.

Vault101:
dont fuck with consumers

they don't like it

DRM breeds piracy

dunno about that, but at least avoiding DRM has pretty much no influence on the number of pirated games (total guess, but considering how quickly things get cracked it shouldn't affect the crowd of torrenting people in any way) while being a lot cheaper : D
(plus you get sympathy points from gamers because you "think of your customers". of course.)

....price games at a quater of he price they are now... problem solved

ways to fix used game problem.
1. Make all distributors pay you r a surcharge of each used sale of your game; This way they aren't make an obscene profit for no work and you get a little something back; This way customers aren't screwed and gamestop is.
2. Stop whining and admit that the free market exists.

Your welcome.

I'm concerned about this "used game block" rumour... there was a period life where used games were all I could afford and I'm sure its still like that for many... So... Why would they do that to people?!?

Meh in a time where you have THQ, EA, and Nintendo showing big losses, (and other companies probably heading that direction) when Gamestop is showing big gains, do you honestly blame these companies for trying to get that money that gamestop has?

"We're the most profitable media industry on the planet. But it's not enough."

How can anyone defend these people? Gamer entitlement? It's COMPANY ENTITLEMENT that is ruining this industry!!

Allthingsspectacular:
It's weird that [second-hand] is still allowed because it doesn't work like that in any other software industries

It's so odd that someone who is at a position in their job that requires them to be a smart person would say something so incredibly stupid.

Books
DVDs
CDs

I get that you may just be used to PC software, but damn was that a dumb thing to say.

I hope you realize that calling someone stupid when you're wrong is...
Not a single one of those is software
The guy is absolutely right on the software part, you can't get a used copy of windows, photoshop, etc.
Herp de derp?

As a PC gamer, where used games barely exist in any form, I agree and say that people should HTFU and deal with the changing market. It's inevitable, so who even cares what Crytek's opinion is?

Well, if this industry wants to go the way of the music industry, that's fine by me.

i don't see why people are surprised, used games are bad for their business and until something better comes along their options for getting more money from people who buy games second hand are either a) dlc which people hate them for or b) try to limit how possible it is for people to buy used games which people also hate them for

Dandark:
I had never really heard much of Crytek other than the fact they made Crysis but since I did start hearing news about them it seems to have mostly been bad.

Then again, they are owned by EA. Of course they will whine about piracy and think banning used games is a good idea.

T-t-t-they're owned by EA.....?

Aaaaaaaagghhhh.....I don't like this....this means one of EA's ilk stole my Timesplitters developers....if TS4 ever does come, it'll be all EA'd beyond recognition, but hopefully I'm wrong.

I buy used games whenever a game stops being sold on the shelf. Like old PS2 games or launch titles that don't get shipped in anymore.

I'm a menace to society for wanting to buy old games and not the new watered down crap you see on the shelf now.

Someone spank me, I've been naughty.

Elmoth:
"We're the most profitable media industry on the planet. But it's not enough."

How can anyone defend these people? Gamer entitlement? It's COMPANY ENTITLEMENT that is ruining this industry!!

Well because a large part of people use that argument to justify worse things. They want money for their work.

Pirates will go "they are big evil faceless corps" all the time in attempt to justify what they do. Sorry you have no rights to their work.

How do you go about doing that? "You'd have to ask someone who knows something about that, because it's not me," the Crytek man said.

Well I think we've found a reason why this guy shouldn't be developing games, he doesn't know that listening to the customers complaints might help.

Terminate421:
4 million pirates? Crytek don't deserve that.

No they don't deserve to have their game pirated at all however they didn't secure they game well enough that it was leaked a month before launch(? correct me if I'm wrong please). Additionally, they made a lot of people upset boarding anger with Crysis 2 which may have caused a substantial amount of them.

Vault101:
dont fuck with consumers

they don't like it

DRM breeds piracy

Yes and no. Consumers don't like to be messed around and DRM =/= breed piracy, boats do that. Piracy isn't directly caused by DRM but I can see it in the case of Crysis 2. Only five installations allowed? The hell Crytek?

I don't see anything wrong with what they're doing. If the market and the consumers are determined to try to fuck them, they might as well fight it.

Dexter111:
http://www.computerandvideogames.com/344972/crytek-next-gen-used-games-block-would-be-absolutely-awesome/

Now that they're done bitching about piracy on the PC and have turned their gazing eye more towards the console market, they apparently found another stepchild to beat on.
Well, maybe they're not done bitching about piracy either quite yet after all:

Asked if he'd like to see Microsoft and Sony introduce anti-used game measures, as has been rumoured for Xbox 720 and PlayStation 4, Hojengaard added:

"From a business perspective that would be absolutely awesome. It's weird that [second-hand] is still allowed because it doesn't work like that in any other software industries, so it would be great if they could somehow fix that issue as well."

Boosting sales on PC is arguably an even greater priority, given that Crysis 2 was named the most pirated game of 2011, with the PC version alone illegally downloaded somewhere in the region of four million times.

"It's very flattering and upsetting at the same time," Hojengaard said of the situation. "Obviously you miss so much revenue, it's so clear that a lot of people want to play your game but they don't really want to pay for it, which is unfortunately really disappointing.

"It's also a little flattering because people are willing to bother download these 10GB files or whatever the game takes because they think it looks great. We obviously want to avoid that this time, but even if we can convert 25 percent of those gamers into paying customers [you have an extra million sales]."

How do you go about doing that? "You'd have to ask someone who knows something about that, because it's not me," the Crytek man said.

well what did you expect?

when you ask a company if they want to have more money, they always start to sing:

endtherapture:
Maybe they should make a decent game (like Crysis 1 or Far Cry) then it would sell loads, instead of this consolised Crysis 2 bullshit.

they had good gameplay and the graphics at that time were impressive,
but you cant play one level of any of them without questioning someones... age.
the script was written with wax crayons and finger paint.

rhizhim:

endtherapture:
Maybe they should make a decent game (like Crysis 1 or Far Cry) then it would sell loads, instead of this consolised Crysis 2 bullshit.

they had good gameplay and the graphics at that time were impressive,
but you cant play one level of any of them without questioning someones... age.
the script was written with wax crayons and finger paint.

I'd honestly prefer a great shooter with awesome gameplay as opposed to a mediocre CoD-clone with a "deep" story that in actuality was a clusterfuck.

Anyway, Psycho in Crysis was my bro. In Crysis 2 our "bro" was some scientist dude who kept swearing and saying "man" and some dude called Chino who had no personality.

Tubez:

Tuesday Night Fever:

It's weird that [second-hand] is still allowed because it doesn't work like that in any other software industries, so it would be great if they could somehow fix that issue as well."

The massive number of used DVDs, used Blu-Rays, and used CDs I've bought over the years say otherwise. Sure, they aren't technically software, but they're still a form of electronic media produced for entertainment just like video games.

And that's not even factoring all of the other second-hand stuff I've bought over the years from many other industries, none of which being as whiney as the games industry to the best of my knowledge.

Pretty much all digital software(that isnt freeware) has activation keys or something similar. I honestly do not see the big deal but then again I use my pc so I might have just gotten used to it.

Yeah but you have a keyboard on PC so activation keys are just a minor annoyance (but the honest to god DRM is still annoying as hell). Trying to put in an activation key using an on-screen keyboard and a controller is a suicide inducing task.

Oh for fuck sake the here we go again. The same group of people trying to make used game sales some sort of fucking right.

They use excuse after excuse, they threaten piracy, and they throw the biggest hissy fit since the religious flipped their shit over gay marriage in California.

GET OVER IT.

They have a right to limit resale, period. You knew this when you bought a platform owned by a fucking CORPORATION. So stow the fucking pity party, and quit crying. Video games are NOT LIKE OTHER MEDIUMS.

Also don't bitch about being "poor" and not being able to afford a "million dollar computer." Computers are at max 900$ if you intentionally splurge. Any higher and you were scammed at fucking best buy. If you can afford a console and can pay for 60$ games every time, you are not poor. If you really were, you would have more pressing problems like food and bills than to bitch about a luxury.

This topic is more beaten, and more annoying than the Mass Effect 3 threads. Its the same regurgitated crap.

I wouldn't even want to play Crysis if it were free. I dislike first persons shooters and even for the genre it seems bland, pointless, and generic. When I hear the name, the emotion I get is "everything that has ever scared me off of PC gaming". FPS gamers looking for that "next tier" of FPS game to push their hardware.

Corporations really need to realize the value of interest and the consequence of killing it. If someone is very uninterested in playing your game, they won't play it at all. If someone is kinda uninterested in playing it, they might play it over at a friend's house if they're bored. If someone is a little interested, they might pirate it and play it for free(possibly to find out they love it and buy several copies), someone might be very interested in it and buy it day one, not even knowing if the game will be all that good, and be called "fanboy" or "fangirl" or "fantard" or whatever for it, and some people will be infatuated with something and spend all the money the can on it.

Like I am with Tales.

But eliminating used sales is just going to make people even less interested in your product, and therefor more niche. Do you really want to make Crysis more niche than it already is?

Why am I even in an FPS topic? I can't stand FPS games.

Grunt_Man11:
What did they do? They partnered up with local used dealerships, (and/or opened up their own), and sold the used cars themselves!

They put a little marketing ploy to encourage people to buy the "certified pre-owned" cars, and started making money off of used sales.

Seriously, how can these game developers and game publishers be so bad at running a business?

Here's an idea. Offer incentives to people for sending their used games straight to the developer or publisher, instead of say Gamestop.
"Gamestop will only give you $5 for that used game of ours? Well mail it to us and will give you $15 for it, or $10 plus a discount code for DLC."

Plus, the retailers and publishers are essentially in a race to screw each other

New game that came less than 2 months ago? The retailers gets pocket change as profit, publishers get the big piece

Used game? Retailers get every cent.

Someone, a major retailer or publisher, needs to come forward and ask "Hey, how about we enter a deal where the publishers get a noticeable but relatively small chunk of the used sales, and at the same time the publishers will release their games at a slightly lower price?"

It's just wacky that these publishers give places like Gamestop exclusive pre-order bonuses and such, then turn around and whine about used sales ruining their profits when they're the ones encouraging business at Gamestop!

Dryk:
He used the word "convert"... doesn't he know that forceful conversion doesn't take?

Landshark1:
Meh. I don't see why Devs feel the need to completely destroy the Used Game market instead of just working around it. If there's one thing EA did right it was their way of working around used game sales through the Cerberus Network in Mass Effect 2.

I don't know about that, I always thought that paying money for the privilege of being able to buy DLC was kind of dumb.

EDIT: I'm also wondering if the piracy rate of their games would drop if Crytek started releasing free benchmarking software

The DLC available only on the Cerberus Network was extra stuff that didn't affect the main game such as weapons, a character, and some side quests, and all of that was free. The DLC that cost money didn't require the Cerberus Network to get, according to the wiki. So it's more like paying money for the privilege of being able to get extra stuff for free, And I prefer methods like this compared to Devs telling the world that used games are satan's spawn.

TheKasp:
So, would one of you gents point me towards the high street stores that promote used sales of books and music instead of the new products? Because in gaming I can point you the the blight that is the reason why those guys harp on used sales = GameStop, GAME and others.

Books, music and other such products are a different case entirely. The new prices are low enough that the margins on used sales wouldn't make it worth it. In the case of books in particular, physical wear and tear is more of an issue when reselling.

But just the same, even though there are no large brick and mortar stores facilitating used sales, there are smaller local stores all over the place that do it, and do well at it. Not to mention sites like Amazon facilitating used sales as well.

As to the comments from CryTek, I'm not surprised to see yet another developer not considering how much used sales can help drive new sales. Someone has to buy the game on day 1 to trade it back in within a week, and I'm betting those players, who will make up the single largest chunk of sales whether people are buying used or not, are trading in their games so they can afford to play these things on day 1.

Norrdicus:

It's just wacky that these publishers give places like Gamestop exclusive pre-order bonuses and such, then turn around and whine about used sales ruining their profits when they're the ones encouraging business at Gamestop!

I can field this part.

The reason they do this is because if they want to release, say a preorder bonus for bestbuy, gamestop demands something as well, if gamestop doesnt get what they want they refuse to stock the game.

Publishers know how many people use those dreadful stores, so they give them something as well to shut them up.

Another symptom of this is higher priced PC games for multi console releases. Look at steam, a good number of PC only games release for 45-50 dollars, when it is being released on Xbox or PS3 it has to be priced at 60 dollars for the release, otherwise gamestop wont stock it because they dont want to be undercut anywhere.

This guy is missing the point. If used sales are blocked, nobody wins. Retailers have to downsize, fewer places sell new games, and those new games suddenly become more expensive because they aren't selling at nearly the volume they could have potentially.

Physical sales are important, and simply lopping off a major source of profit or rendering it useless will not help.

I sometimes think that people in the industry do not think before they speak, despite being involved with how it operates.

Thoric485:
Hah, Crytek.

4.5 million for Crysis+Warhead as PC exclusives just wasn't good enough for them, so they flipped off their audience and tried to market to consoles, with illusions of CoD-grade sales.

I hope they enjoy their dying franchise and inevitable EA buyout.

Yeah, its kinda funny really. They had their awesome, loyal fanbase right there and then they just threw it away. And now they turn around and bitch.

Fuck you Crytek. I feel sorry for those 4 million pirates, Crysis 2's campaign wasnt even worth downloading illegally.

I could make another comment on publishers whining and crying over used games, but CryTek and all of them have missed one crucial point about this "used game blocking" shtick. Unless Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo all agree to do it, no one will. Microsoft is not going to risk releasing the next X-Box with used game blocking only to have Sony release the next Playstation without it and vice versa. No one is going to want to be first on this and potentially kill their latest generation of hardware.

No doubt Sony, Microsoft and Nintendo would all love to make used games go away, but there's only so much they're going to risk over this and letting a competitor get a huge sales advantage in hardware is to big a risk for these guys.

Rack:
"It's also a little flattering because people are willing to bother download these 10GB files or whatever the game takes because they think it looks great. We obviously want to avoid that this time, but even if we can convert 25 percent of those gamers into paying customers [you have an extra million sales]."

No, if you convert 25% of them into paying customers you'd have an extra hundred thousand or so sales. Please try and learn the most basic elements of logic before you open your mouth Hojengaard, you're embarrassing the entire human race like this.

Edit: Actually I can tell I'm going to have to clarify this one. If you convert a million pirates into paying customers that's a million people who would potentially buy your game. They've shown enough interest to click on a torrent link, but getting them to pay full price for it? a 10% conversion rate on that would be amazingly good.

You should really not insult somebody and then proceed to explain yourself with faulty logic. If you convert 25% of four million people into paying customers you have an extra million sales. The keywords here are PAYING CUSTOMERS. You dont need to take an additional conversion rate on something that has already had a conversion rate taken on it.

There is a second hand market for pretty much everything. Why do game developers have the audacity to think games should be an exception?

SmashLovesTitanQuest:

Thoric485:
Hah, Crytek.

4.5 million for Crysis+Warhead as PC exclusives just wasn't good enough for them, so they flipped off their audience and tried to market to consoles, with illusions of CoD-grade sales.

I hope they enjoy their dying franchise and inevitable EA buyout.

Yeah, its kinda funny really. They had their awesome, loyal fanbase right there and then they just threw it away. And now they turn around and bitch.

Fuck you Crytek. I feel sorry for those 4 million pirates, Crysis 2's campaign wasnt even worth downloading illegally.

Their so called "Loyal" fanbase wasn't enough to keep the company afloat. Crysis didn't make its money back.

More importantly... whats with the anti-console spewing?
I am quick to take the people who are called "Pc-elitists" to defence, but this additude is pretty hard to defend.

Draech:
Their so called "Loyal" fanbase wasn't enough to keep the company afloat. Crysis didn't make its money back.

Thats on them then. It sold more than enough copies.

Draech:
I am quick to take the people who are called "Pc-elitists" to defence, but this additude is pretty hard to defend.

What anti-console spewing are you talking about?

The only reason why I would pirate a game would be because of availability. Steam has actually helped with this a lot. Games that would otherwise be really tough to get ahold of is now really easy to get.

But there are many titles out there that aren't as easy to get.

...And there are some titles that are bound to Origin.

See, working for Gamestop has taught me that you should really blame the game not the consumers. The second most common used game we have is Crysis 2, and while I enjoyed the game it clearly wasn't good enough to hold people's attention.

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