Goth Mercenaries

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A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

NamesAreHardToPick:

Shjade:

I don't know what Damnation is so I can't comment on that comparison. As to the other...I'm not sure what to make of that. Yes, spending an evening washing dishes (which must be taking place in a MASSIVE kitchen to take all night, I guess?) with your girlfriend, assuming you two actually get along, can be as enjoyable as spending the evening with sex.

Look Damnation up on Metacritic if you haven't had it inflicted on you to any degree. The rest is horribly sad, bro. You must hold her purse a lot.

Hooray for assumptions. You asked a hypothetical and I responded. It has no bearing on my personal situation.

That you believe there's no enjoyment to be found from sharing with a romantic partner over some unimportant activity suggests a certain lack of emotional development, however. I wish you the best of luck with that.

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

Okay, now you seem to be projecting. I have no such opinion. Even though I like the game I'm not bothered by your opinion largely because you haven't actually played the game. As long as that essential piece of the puzzle is missing I think it's safe to say that you're never going to have any real credibility or plausibility on the issue.

Shjade:
Hooray for assumptions. You asked a hypothetical and I responded. It has no bearing on my personal situation.

You didn't respond, you made up a strawman to talk to instead of addressing the point of my post: given a specific partner, various activities are more or less enjoyable by nature or (in the case of game vs game comparisons) by design. Borderlands did a lot design-wise to make co-op fun in the first place and replayable afterwards.

If you feel like coming up with a point worth more than a dick joke in response, go ahead.

I was one of those Fanboys that didn't reply to the Borderlands review. I think for some of us it just wasn't worth it to be shouted down by the Yahtzee sycophants. We come here listening to rants about how creativity is the most important thing in games and how you are sick of playing sequels, but you never once mentioned the artistic style or the fact that this pushed the boundaries for FPS games in a new direction. How do you respond to a person who doesn't seem to engage with games in an deeper way anymore? I was starting to question his even having played games after the Torchlight review, overlooking the ability to hold down your mouse button for attack was really weak. Overlooking Borderlands art style, wacky humor, and weapon design clearly shows that he not only missed the point...but blatantly ignored it. Yes, the game was a loot fest with an incredibly weak story, yet that is not the compelling part of the game at all.

Here's one hint. Borderlands plays better the first time in singleplayer because you can take all your time to figure out your loot, read the side quest logs, listen to the tapes, and generally get a feel for the game. Co-op is a rush just like in Diablo 2 unless you are with friends just playing for the first time.

More and more Yahtzee is becoming an antiquated source of game criticism. He cries the foul of FEAR2 and claims that his favorite genres are dying, but you can't cry for originality and expect to get your old games every time. TF2 is the best supported PC FPS game out there. This is huge for the MP community that there are always rebalanced and free new content. You don't like the big number games but you want us to be on TF4 by now? Yes I understand that nitpicking is his job, but somewhere in those smug reviews of old there was hope at educating the masses about great video game design.

Yahtzee has lost that and just seems to want everything to be an action game where he can be badass...

Congrats, you are now part of the problem. Fear not, EA and Activision are always looking to make more reiterative games for gamers like you.

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

Okay, now you seem to be projecting. I have no such opinion. Even though I like the game I'm not bothered by your opinion largely because you haven't actually played the game. As long as that essential piece of the puzzle is missing I think it's safe to say that you're never going to have any real credibility or plausibility on the issue.

yet it bothers you deeply I dont like it

I'd like to point out a bit of a counterpoint about "all games must stand on single-player", and in fact I'm going to lead into that by pointing out what I believe to be the year that single-player began to be viewed as not as important for games that provided both multiplayer and single-player experiences.

The year was 1999. Game of the year for 1999? Homeworld. A game with a great story to be sure, but the single-player experience was a grind of gigantic proportions, and generally was viewed by reviewers as an extended tutorial to multiplayer. the other big games of the year included Quake III: Arena, and Unreal Tournament. Games which were designed as multiplayer experiences almost exclusively.

I think what separates these three examples from Borderlands, however, is that Homeworld had (again) a great story while Borderlands does not, and UT and Q3A were more easily understood as multiplayer games and they weren't expecting stories from them.

Of course, my theory could be entirely wrong seeing as how the other game of the year for 1999 was Half-Life, one of the first FPS games to have a comprehensive plot and succeed.

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

Okay, now you seem to be projecting. I have no such opinion. Even though I like the game I'm not bothered by your opinion largely because you haven't actually played the game. As long as that essential piece of the puzzle is missing I think it's safe to say that you're never going to have any real credibility or plausibility on the issue.

yet it bothers you deeply I dont like it

Very funny. Either you misread my previous post or you're just saying that to spite me. Either way it doesn't seem to reflect particularly well on you I'm afraid. If you want to bother someone who likes the game then I would suggest you write a detailed, comprehensive, and insightful critique of the game. But most importantly you should actually play the game.

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

Okay, now you seem to be projecting. I have no such opinion. Even though I like the game I'm not bothered by your opinion largely because you haven't actually played the game. As long as that essential piece of the puzzle is missing I think it's safe to say that you're never going to have any real credibility or plausibility on the issue.

yet it bothers you deeply I dont like it

Very funny. Either you misread my previous post or you're just saying that to spite me. Either way it doesn't seem to reflect particularly well on you I'm afraid. If you want to bother someone who likes the game then I would suggest you write a detailed, comprehensive, and insightful critique of the game. But most importantly you should actually play the game.

See if it didnt bother you that I didnt like it, you probloy woudlnt have even bothered on commenting it. No the amount of times you keep responding shows it botheres you. And I wont play it as I will not waste any money on it

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

psrdirector:

A1:

I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

Okay, now you seem to be projecting. I have no such opinion. Even though I like the game I'm not bothered by your opinion largely because you haven't actually played the game. As long as that essential piece of the puzzle is missing I think it's safe to say that you're never going to have any real credibility or plausibility on the issue.

yet it bothers you deeply I dont like it

Very funny. Either you misread my previous post or you're just saying that to spite me. Either way it doesn't seem to reflect particularly well on you I'm afraid. If you want to bother someone who likes the game then I would suggest you write a detailed, comprehensive, and insightful critique of the game. But most importantly you should actually play the game.

See if it didnt bother you that I didnt like it, you probloy woudlnt have even bothered on commenting it. No the amount of times you keep responding shows it botheres you. And I wont play it as I will not waste any money on it

How extremely presumptuous of you. I'm responding because I don't like to let challenging and/or confrontational gestures directed at me (or anything resembling them) go unanswered. If someone throws a punch at you it's a very natural response to fight back. So no, what's bothering me is not your opinion. It's your apparent insistence on getting in my face about it. And who said anything about spending money on the game? Just borrow it from one of your raving friends, play it while visiting them, or see if their willing to give it to you as a gift or favor or something.

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I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

Okay, now you seem to be projecting. I have no such opinion. Even though I like the game I'm not bothered by your opinion largely because you haven't actually played the game. As long as that essential piece of the puzzle is missing I think it's safe to say that you're never going to have any real credibility or plausibility on the issue.

yet it bothers you deeply I dont like it

Very funny. Either you misread my previous post or you're just saying that to spite me. Either way it doesn't seem to reflect particularly well on you I'm afraid. If you want to bother someone who likes the game then I would suggest you write a detailed, comprehensive, and insightful critique of the game. But most importantly you should actually play the game.

See if it didnt bother you that I didnt like it, you probloy woudlnt have even bothered on commenting it. No the amount of times you keep responding shows it botheres you. And I wont play it as I will not waste any money on it

How extremely presumptuous of you. I'm responding because I don't like to let challenging and/or confrontational gestures directed at me (or anything resembling them) go unanswered. If someone throws a punch at you it's a very natural response to fight back. So no, what's bothering me is not your opinion. It's your apparent insistence on getting in my face about it. And who said anything about spending money on the game? Just borrow it from one of your raving friends, play it while visiting them, or see if their willing to give it to you as a gift or favor or something.

I dont believe nay have it any more :D as its age has lead to many being destroyed, or them moving out. How ever I was not attacking you, simply commenting on that I dont think FF7 is very good, and you have changed this opinion zero, I personally have no interest of changing your opinion, while you clearly wish to change mine.

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I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

Okay, now you seem to be projecting. I have no such opinion. Even though I like the game I'm not bothered by your opinion largely because you haven't actually played the game. As long as that essential piece of the puzzle is missing I think it's safe to say that you're never going to have any real credibility or plausibility on the issue.

yet it bothers you deeply I dont like it

Very funny. Either you misread my previous post or you're just saying that to spite me. Either way it doesn't seem to reflect particularly well on you I'm afraid. If you want to bother someone who likes the game then I would suggest you write a detailed, comprehensive, and insightful critique of the game. But most importantly you should actually play the game.

See if it didnt bother you that I didnt like it, you probloy woudlnt have even bothered on commenting it. No the amount of times you keep responding shows it botheres you. And I wont play it as I will not waste any money on it

How extremely presumptuous of you. I'm responding because I don't like to let challenging and/or confrontational gestures directed at me (or anything resembling them) go unanswered. If someone throws a punch at you it's a very natural response to fight back. So no, what's bothering me is not your opinion. It's your apparent insistence on getting in my face about it. And who said anything about spending money on the game? Just borrow it from one of your raving friends, play it while visiting them, or see if their willing to give it to you as a gift or favor or something.

I dont believe nay have it any more :D as its age has lead to many being destroyed, or them moving out. How ever I was not attacking you, simply commenting on that I dont think FF7 is very good, and you have changed this opinion zero, I personally have no interest of changing your opinion, while you clearly wish to change mine.

Clearly? You continue to be presumptuous. It doesn't matter much to me what you think of the game. It won't make the slightest bit of difference. I was simply defending the game, which was not a particularly hard thing to do considering that you haven't been particularly skillful in attacking it. Rather you've mostly just been repeating the idea that you don't personally like the the game. And there's Gamefly by the way.

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I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

Okay, now you seem to be projecting. I have no such opinion. Even though I like the game I'm not bothered by your opinion largely because you haven't actually played the game. As long as that essential piece of the puzzle is missing I think it's safe to say that you're never going to have any real credibility or plausibility on the issue.

yet it bothers you deeply I dont like it

Very funny. Either you misread my previous post or you're just saying that to spite me. Either way it doesn't seem to reflect particularly well on you I'm afraid. If you want to bother someone who likes the game then I would suggest you write a detailed, comprehensive, and insightful critique of the game. But most importantly you should actually play the game.

See if it didnt bother you that I didnt like it, you probloy woudlnt have even bothered on commenting it. No the amount of times you keep responding shows it botheres you. And I wont play it as I will not waste any money on it

How extremely presumptuous of you. I'm responding because I don't like to let challenging and/or confrontational gestures directed at me (or anything resembling them) go unanswered. If someone throws a punch at you it's a very natural response to fight back. So no, what's bothering me is not your opinion. It's your apparent insistence on getting in my face about it. And who said anything about spending money on the game? Just borrow it from one of your raving friends, play it while visiting them, or see if their willing to give it to you as a gift or favor or something.

I dont believe nay have it any more :D as its age has lead to many being destroyed, or them moving out. How ever I was not attacking you, simply commenting on that I dont think FF7 is very good, and you have changed this opinion zero, I personally have no interest of changing your opinion, while you clearly wish to change mine.

Clearly? You continue to be presumptuous. It doesn't matter much to me what you think of the game. It won't make the slightest bit of difference. I was simply defending the game, which was not a particularly hard thing to do considering that you haven't been particularly skillful in attacking it. Rather you've mostly just been repeating the idea that you don't personally like the the game. And there's Gamefly by the way.

Are you volinteering to pay for me to get gamefly, why thank you, I didnt know you cared :D
Look, the graphics, even for the time to me look bad, yea I compared games that were of other generas but they were of the same generation, and to me I care more about the graphics during gameplay then of the cutsceans, witch again dont impress me. :D this is fun i must say

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I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

Okay, now you seem to be projecting. I have no such opinion. Even though I like the game I'm not bothered by your opinion largely because you haven't actually played the game. As long as that essential piece of the puzzle is missing I think it's safe to say that you're never going to have any real credibility or plausibility on the issue.

yet it bothers you deeply I dont like it

Very funny. Either you misread my previous post or you're just saying that to spite me. Either way it doesn't seem to reflect particularly well on you I'm afraid. If you want to bother someone who likes the game then I would suggest you write a detailed, comprehensive, and insightful critique of the game. But most importantly you should actually play the game.

See if it didnt bother you that I didnt like it, you probloy woudlnt have even bothered on commenting it. No the amount of times you keep responding shows it botheres you. And I wont play it as I will not waste any money on it

How extremely presumptuous of you. I'm responding because I don't like to let challenging and/or confrontational gestures directed at me (or anything resembling them) go unanswered. If someone throws a punch at you it's a very natural response to fight back. So no, what's bothering me is not your opinion. It's your apparent insistence on getting in my face about it. And who said anything about spending money on the game? Just borrow it from one of your raving friends, play it while visiting them, or see if their willing to give it to you as a gift or favor or something.

I dont believe nay have it any more :D as its age has lead to many being destroyed, or them moving out. How ever I was not attacking you, simply commenting on that I dont think FF7 is very good, and you have changed this opinion zero, I personally have no interest of changing your opinion, while you clearly wish to change mine.

Clearly? You continue to be presumptuous. It doesn't matter much to me what you think of the game. It won't make the slightest bit of difference. I was simply defending the game, which was not a particularly hard thing to do considering that you haven't been particularly skillful in attacking it. Rather you've mostly just been repeating the idea that you don't personally like the the game. And there's Gamefly by the way.

Are you volinteering to pay for me to get gamefly, why thank you, I didnt know you cared :D
Look, the graphics, even for the time to me look bad, yea I compared games that were of other generas but they were of the same generation, and to me I care more about the graphics during gameplay then of the cutsceans, witch again dont impress me. :D this is fun i must say

First, the words that leap out at me here are "to me". So now you're essentially just repeating yourself. You've already made it very clear that you personally don't like the game and that's probably never going to change no matter what anyone says. And it would seem that you don't even want that to change. I could effectively counter any way you try to attack the game but I'm not going to even bother because there's no point. And as I said before nothing you say or think is going to make the slightest bit of difference anyway. The game will still have it's wide critical acclaim, it's legions of fans, and it's significant place in video game history. And that's a fact.

Second, now I think you're just starting to troll. And if that's true (and it looks like it is) then that would mean two things. First, it would most likely mean that any realistic chance of anything resembling meaningful debate has essentially gone out the window. Second, if that's true then I'm going to start ignoring you because there's really nothing left to say. It would seem that at this point the best we can do, or perhaps the best I can do, is to simply wash my hands of this rigmarole be done with it.

Weird, that's exactly how I wanted to play WoW when I eventually got it.

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I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

Okay, now you seem to be projecting. I have no such opinion. Even though I like the game I'm not bothered by your opinion largely because you haven't actually played the game. As long as that essential piece of the puzzle is missing I think it's safe to say that you're never going to have any real credibility or plausibility on the issue.

yet it bothers you deeply I dont like it

Very funny. Either you misread my previous post or you're just saying that to spite me. Either way it doesn't seem to reflect particularly well on you I'm afraid. If you want to bother someone who likes the game then I would suggest you write a detailed, comprehensive, and insightful critique of the game. But most importantly you should actually play the game.

See if it didnt bother you that I didnt like it, you probloy woudlnt have even bothered on commenting it. No the amount of times you keep responding shows it botheres you. And I wont play it as I will not waste any money on it

How extremely presumptuous of you. I'm responding because I don't like to let challenging and/or confrontational gestures directed at me (or anything resembling them) go unanswered. If someone throws a punch at you it's a very natural response to fight back. So no, what's bothering me is not your opinion. It's your apparent insistence on getting in my face about it. And who said anything about spending money on the game? Just borrow it from one of your raving friends, play it while visiting them, or see if their willing to give it to you as a gift or favor or something.

I dont believe nay have it any more :D as its age has lead to many being destroyed, or them moving out. How ever I was not attacking you, simply commenting on that I dont think FF7 is very good, and you have changed this opinion zero, I personally have no interest of changing your opinion, while you clearly wish to change mine.

Clearly? You continue to be presumptuous. It doesn't matter much to me what you think of the game. It won't make the slightest bit of difference. I was simply defending the game, which was not a particularly hard thing to do considering that you haven't been particularly skillful in attacking it. Rather you've mostly just been repeating the idea that you don't personally like the the game. And there's Gamefly by the way.

Are you volinteering to pay for me to get gamefly, why thank you, I didnt know you cared :D
Look, the graphics, even for the time to me look bad, yea I compared games that were of other generas but they were of the same generation, and to me I care more about the graphics during gameplay then of the cutsceans, witch again dont impress me. :D this is fun i must say

First, the words that leap out at me here are "to me". So now you're essentially just repeating yourself. You've already made it very clear that you personally don't like the game and that's probably never going to change no matter what anyone says. And it would seem that you don't even want that to change. I could effectively counter any way you try to attack the game but I'm not going to even bother because there's no point. And as I said before nothing you say or think is going to make the slightest bit of difference anyway. The game will still have it's wide critical acclaim, it's legions of fans, and it's significant place in video game history. And that's a fact.

Second, now I think you're just starting to troll. And if that's true (and it looks like it is) then that would mean two things. First, it would most likely mean that any realistic chance of anything resembling meaningful debate has essentially gone out the window. Second, if that's true then I'm going to start ignoring you because there's really nothing left to say. It would seem that at this point the best we can do, or perhaps the best I can do, is to simply wash my hands of this rigmarole be done with it.

Critics are all opinion, none of them are facts, absolutely none of them. The quality of a game really comes down to opinion nothing else. You Enjoying the game is your Opinion of the game, Critics enjoying it, is again, an Opinion. No matter how widely held an opinion is, It is still an opinion. It can be a fact that it is a very popular opinion, but this does not change that it is in the end, an opinion. I have never seen really an impact from the game besides being the first FF game to be in 3-d build. Games would of gone that way in japan and the world with out it, or any other game that was the first, as it was the most obvious next step. I also think if it was released today it would not be as highly critically acclaimed, as can be seen by growing amount of people criticizing the linear stories of FF games, when it came out, people enjoyed and didn't mind the liberality, now a growing amount sees it as a great flaw and a sign of poor role-play games. I don't think that would have changed it, by evidence of FF13 responding to critics of it by basically say, So we think its what is best and so do our fans, and they do.

I also feel that me playing or not playing the game isn't really relevant, you would have still debated just as strongly, probable instead saying I was purely a hype hater trying to say I hate it to be cool because its so popular. You will deny this, and there is no way to prove anything on this with out building a time machine and testing it out, but if you did I would say this is a really pointless thing to test with a time machine.

As for me, its clearly not the biggest deal everywhere, because I did not even hear of the game until after Final fantasy 10 had come out, as my gaming interaction was mostly limited to PC and Nintendo at the time, and those I associated with also only played those systems. So I was exposed and enjoyed the older ones more, I still do. I enjoyed the old SNES rpgs often more then the ps2 and modern Generation. I find the SNES bit graphics display is much more timeless. Feel free to respond and get the final word in.

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I guess that's what makes a good game different from a great game. Namely the ability to make a long-lasting impression. I guess one such example of a great game by this token is Final Fantasy VII.

I never played FF7, and after hearing so many people say why its awsome, have no intention, to me its a boring story with bad graphics that people dont want to admit is an overdone story with bad graphics.

As for this, kings rings true I think for time to time. I usually play mmos try and meet people, usually fail as I never played well enough and got kicked out and was to cheap to play any mmo really besides Guildwars :D

Unbelievable.

Boring story? What kind of a claim is that coming from someone who hasn't actually played the game? It's like when Bob Dole criticized the movie Trainspotting before admitting that he hadn't actually seen the movie.

Overdone with bad graphics? Oh come on. This is a game that was from TWO GENERATIONS AGO. Judging it by today's standards is totally unfair and inappropriate.

I know the story, My friends who are huge fans of it rave about it and tell me all these details thinking It will make me love the game, and makes me realise its about as unorginal and uninteresting to me as they get. As for the graphics, sorry but to me they are bad judged against games of its generation and older. Mario 64 I like the looks of, SuperSmash Bros, the Zelda games, and on the Snes, Hell I like the looks of the older Snes FF games better.

Yea i think its just a game that people dont want to admit was just run of the mill at best, for some it may be great for me it looks boring and unplayable

Sorry but that's not good enough. I know from experience that experiencing something first hand can be very different from simply hearing about it. This is perhaps one of the reasons why professional reviewers and critics of stuff like video games and movies actually bother to play the game or watch the movie before giving their feedback.

And as for the graphics the words that stand out for me here are "to me" and "I like". First of all the games that you mention are from very different genres than FFVII so the comparisons aren't particularly plausible or appropriate. Second of all I'm sensing large amounts of subjectivity from you which certainly isn't helping your plausibility, especially when you start bringing up SNES games. SNES games didn't have anything that could compare to FFVII's cutscenes in particular from a technical standpoint. So in other words it seem to be more about not what actually is better but rather what you personally like better. And there's more to it I'm afraid. I also get the impression that the raving of your friends may very well have negatively influenced your opinion of the game. Or more specifically you may have grown at least somewhat sick of hearing about how good it is.

Or in other words you seem to be at least somewhat biased.

Critical acclaim of FFVII has been quite wide and almost universal. It may have at least a few detractors in this area but at least they actually played the game.

I'm sorry but I think it's safe to say that if you want your opinion on the matter to carry any real weight you will have to actually play the game and truly experience it for yourself. Only then can you plausibly and credibly make the claim that it's a bad game.

You seem to have the opinion im trying to sway anyones opinion, I just know that from my standpoint, if someone says its like FF7, I know that game is gonig to be bad, with a bland story and nothing of interest to me. I have yet to see one person say one reason that shows its good, every review ive seen of it gives me the same opinion, this game is not for me, its crap. Its slow to start, I find that annoying, its story is unoriginal, I find this game is nothing but nastolgia gone wrong, and I would bet money I would not have the same impact on me as it probly did on someone who played it when it first came out.

Okay, now you seem to be projecting. I have no such opinion. Even though I like the game I'm not bothered by your opinion largely because you haven't actually played the game. As long as that essential piece of the puzzle is missing I think it's safe to say that you're never going to have any real credibility or plausibility on the issue.

yet it bothers you deeply I dont like it

Very funny. Either you misread my previous post or you're just saying that to spite me. Either way it doesn't seem to reflect particularly well on you I'm afraid. If you want to bother someone who likes the game then I would suggest you write a detailed, comprehensive, and insightful critique of the game. But most importantly you should actually play the game.

See if it didnt bother you that I didnt like it, you probloy woudlnt have even bothered on commenting it. No the amount of times you keep responding shows it botheres you. And I wont play it as I will not waste any money on it

How extremely presumptuous of you. I'm responding because I don't like to let challenging and/or confrontational gestures directed at me (or anything resembling them) go unanswered. If someone throws a punch at you it's a very natural response to fight back. So no, what's bothering me is not your opinion. It's your apparent insistence on getting in my face about it. And who said anything about spending money on the game? Just borrow it from one of your raving friends, play it while visiting them, or see if their willing to give it to you as a gift or favor or something.

I dont believe nay have it any more :D as its age has lead to many being destroyed, or them moving out. How ever I was not attacking you, simply commenting on that I dont think FF7 is very good, and you have changed this opinion zero, I personally have no interest of changing your opinion, while you clearly wish to change mine.

Clearly? You continue to be presumptuous. It doesn't matter much to me what you think of the game. It won't make the slightest bit of difference. I was simply defending the game, which was not a particularly hard thing to do considering that you haven't been particularly skillful in attacking it. Rather you've mostly just been repeating the idea that you don't personally like the the game. And there's Gamefly by the way.

Are you volinteering to pay for me to get gamefly, why thank you, I didnt know you cared :D
Look, the graphics, even for the time to me look bad, yea I compared games that were of other generas but they were of the same generation, and to me I care more about the graphics during gameplay then of the cutsceans, witch again dont impress me. :D this is fun i must say

First, the words that leap out at me here are "to me". So now you're essentially just repeating yourself. You've already made it very clear that you personally don't like the game and that's probably never going to change no matter what anyone says. And it would seem that you don't even want that to change. I could effectively counter any way you try to attack the game but I'm not going to even bother because there's no point. And as I said before nothing you say or think is going to make the slightest bit of difference anyway. The game will still have it's wide critical acclaim, it's legions of fans, and it's significant place in video game history. And that's a fact.

Second, now I think you're just starting to troll. And if that's true (and it looks like it is) then that would mean two things. First, it would most likely mean that any realistic chance of anything resembling meaningful debate has essentially gone out the window. Second, if that's true then I'm going to start ignoring you because there's really nothing left to say. It would seem that at this point the best we can do, or perhaps the best I can do, is to simply wash my hands of this rigmarole be done with it.

Critics are all opinion, none of them are facts, absolutely none of them. The quality of a game really comes down to opinion nothing else. You Enjoying the game is your Opinion of the game, Critics enjoying it, is again, an Opinion. No matter how widely held an opinion is, It is still an opinion. It can be a fact that it is a very popular opinion, but this does not change that it is in the end, an opinion. I have never seen really an impact from the game besides being the first FF game to be in 3-d build. Games would of gone that way in japan and the world with out it, or any other game that was the first, as it was the most obvious next step. I also think if it was released today it would not be as highly critically acclaimed, as can be seen by growing amount of people criticizing the linear stories of FF games, when it came out, people enjoyed and didn't mind the liberality, now a growing amount sees it as a great flaw and a sign of poor role-play games. I don't think that would have changed it, by evidence of FF13 responding to critics of it by basically say, So we think its what is best and so do our fans, and they do.

I also feel that me playing or not playing the game isn't really relevant, you would have still debated just as strongly, probable instead saying I was purely a hype hater trying to say I hate it to be cool because its so popular. You will deny this, and there is no way to prove anything on this with out building a time machine and testing it out, but if you did I would say this is a really pointless thing to test with a time machine.

As for me, its clearly not the biggest deal everywhere, because I did not even hear of the game until after Final fantasy 10 had come out, as my gaming interaction was mostly limited to PC and Nintendo at the time, and those I associated with also only played those systems. So I was exposed and enjoyed the older ones more, I still do. I enjoyed the old SNES rpgs often more then the ps2 and modern Generation. I find the SNES bit graphics display is much more timeless. Feel free to respond and get the final word in.

""Critics are all opinion, none of them are facts, absolutely none of them. The quality of a game really comes down to opinion nothing else. You Enjoying the game is your Opinion of the game, Critics enjoying it, is again, an Opinion. No matter how widely held an opinion is, It is still an opinion. It can be a fact that it is a very popular opinion, but this does not change that it is in the end, an opinion.""

Your point being?

And I get the impression that there are game designers who may disagree with you if for example they approach the issue of quality from a standpoint of technological technicalities. It really seems to be more a matter of whether you go by reality or perception of reality.

""I have never seen really an impact from the game besides being the first FF game to be in 3-d build.""

Of course you haven't. You didn't even know the game existed until we were well into the next generation so how could you?

""Games would of gone that way in japan and the world with out it, or any other game that was the first, as it was the most obvious next step.""

That seems to be a really big piece of conjecture. And it's not quite relevant. That's not how things played out. FFVII is credited with playing a significant role in elevating the Playstation brand (which in turn seems to have paved the way for a number of other significant things) and with allowing console RPGs to find a place in markets outside Japan. And this IS a fact. This is part of the games legacy, it's status. You may feel that the game is vastly unworthy of it's status, but it still has it's status.

""I also think if it was released today it would not be as highly critically acclaimed, as can be seen by growing amount of people criticizing the linear stories of FF games, when it came out, people enjoyed and didn't mind the liberality, now a growing amount sees it as a great flaw and a sign of poor role-play games. I don't think that would have changed it, by evidence of FF13 responding to critics of it by basically say, So we think its what is best and so do our fans, and they do.""

Irrelevant. I've already told you that judging the game by modern standards is both implausible and unfair because it's not a modern game. And I think you're on a bit of a slippery slope here. One could just as easily claim that the SNES games that you love are crap because they don't compare to games like Mass Effect 2, or Uncharted 2, or Half-Life 2, or Halo 3, or any other current or last generation game you can think of.

""I also feel that me playing or not playing the game isn't really relevant, you would have still debated just as strongly, probable instead saying I was purely a hype hater trying to say I hate it to be cool because its so popular. You will deny this, and there is no way to prove anything on this with out building a time machine and testing it out, but if you did I would say this is a really pointless thing to test with a time machine.""

Nice try. But I would have given you more respect had you actually played the game. I don't always agree with or like the things that Yahtzee says about a game, but I still respect him and his opinion because he puts in the effort to be intelligent about it and perhaps most importantly he actually gives a game a try before he knocks it.

""As for me, its clearly not the biggest deal everywhere, because I did not even hear of the game until after Final fantasy 10 had come out, as my gaming interaction was mostly limited to PC and Nintendo at the time, and those I associated with also only played those systems.""

I never said that everyone liked the game or was into it, I never said that. And I didn't say that critical acclaim of it was universal either. And of course it's not the biggest deal everywhere. There will always be the haters.

But the game will always have it's status and it's legacy and nothing you or the haters say is going to change that. So I'm good.

And besides, I really don't see why you would have any reason to complain. By that same token you will always have your beloved SNES games. (For the record I also have fond memories of certain SNES games like Chrono Trigger and Final Fantasy 3. Okay, it was technically Final Fantasy 6 but it was initially released as 3 in the states.)

So you do your thing, let everyone else do theirs, and everyone's happy.

Know what I mean?

Since I have nothing better to do, I'm going to do exactly what I wasn't supposed to do. I think Yahtzee should try TF2 on the Xbox 360. There's no updates, no hats, and the controls are pretty smooth.

Sir Bames Jond:
Since I have nothing better to do, I'm going to do exactly what I wasn't supposed to do. I think Yahtzee should try TF2 on the Xbox 360. There's no updates, no hats, and the controls are pretty smooth.

I was under the impression the class updates were available as dlc, oh well.
There's always ways round the chaff if you will, like playing on stock only servers (forces all weapons to default) and modded the hats and other accessories not to be visible).
It's like your back in 2007!

Daveman:
I liked the single player too, though I was the Hunter. I loved the Sniping, it was one game where you can snipe fairly safely without worrying too much about getting rushed, though boss fights were kind of silly as a sniper, it just doesn't feel right. I didn't play it long enough to reach the level cap because I had to get back to uni. Maybe that's it.

Anyway, I don't post on ZP forums because it's either variations on "nice review, can't wait for the next", blatant fanboys and trolls. So maybe it's just a higher class of people who enjoy borderlands single player. [/snootyness]

Actually you should totally change the last part of your sentence to /sarcasm because its exactly the opposite.
ZP has some of the most intelligent fans, most of them post regularly simply to say it was a great review for so and so reason. And occasionally give their opinion for something they actually have knowledge about (because uninformed opinions are frowned upon if we've learned anything from Yahtzee's "Scribblenauts" Extra Punct article.)
Generally comment section here is better than most.
Plus you actually need to be able to read to comment here in other words have a attention span higher than the average tard.

The fanboys only say they liked it without giving a reason why.
Trolls usually try everything to get people fired up but its sometimes difficult to tell who they are, and the idiots leave the 'first!' comments at the beginning of the comment section.

TheUnbeholden:

Daveman:
I liked the single player too, though I was the Hunter. I loved the Sniping, it was one game where you can snipe fairly safely without worrying too much about getting rushed, though boss fights were kind of silly as a sniper, it just doesn't feel right. I didn't play it long enough to reach the level cap because I had to get back to uni. Maybe that's it.

Anyway, I don't post on ZP forums because it's either variations on "nice review, can't wait for the next", blatant fanboys and trolls. So maybe it's just a higher class of people who enjoy borderlands single player. [/snootyness]

Actually you should totally change the last part of your sentence to /sarcasm because its exactly the opposite.
ZP has some of the most intelligent fans, most of them post regularly simply to say it was a great review for so and so reason. And occasionally give their opinion for something they actually have knowledge about (because uninformed opinions are frowned upon if we've learned anything from Yahtzee's "Scribblenauts" Extra Punct article.)
Generally comment section here is better than most.
Plus you actually need to be able to read to comment here in other words have a attention span higher than the average tard.

The fanboys only say they liked it without giving a reason why.
Trolls usually try everything to get people fired up but its sometimes difficult to tell who they are, and the idiots leave the 'first!' comments at the beginning of the comment section.

Wow... massive blast from the past there. That comment is from over 2 years ago now. Now that's impressive. I think it's slightly too late to bother with changing it.

I'm not "dissing" ZP there or the fans, it's is just the fact that the comment section is a bit intense. I mean it's no Youtube or anything but with regards to the rest of the escapist it's pretty bad. Also the [/snootyness] was really more to do with the final sentence.

Never would've taken Yahtzee for a hipster... What am I talking about? Of course I would've taken him for one. But not in a bad way like all the peace hippies who only want people dead if they make child armies, no. Yahtzee's more of a true hipster. The only reason he won't do something is because it's cool which would make sense when you consider how much he hates FPSs. They're so popular that he feels like a conformists if he plays them hence the bad reviews.

It all makes sense now.

Thread Necromancy strikes again...

300lb. Samoan:
So Borderlands is mediocre because it doesn't give you the opportunity to show off what a non-conformist loner you are? Sounding more like a precious brat than a game reviewer here, regardless of how many people agree with you.

And truth Be told, Borderlands became Mediocre because its sequel overshadowed it. Borderlands 2 offered more guns, upgrades, mechanics, skills, characters, art design and overall more play time. I play Both games but I play Borderlands 2 way more than the first cause I enjoy it so much more. The first is fun, but the second is way more fun.

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