The Big Picture: Off the Charts

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D_987:
but they aren't strong stories with a sense of character like Bioshock.

I'd say that is pretty subjective. I *have* Bioshock and it didn't grab me anymore than a 'generic' JRPG. Not saying it's beneath JRPG stories - far from it, but that is simply an opinion being stated there rather than fact.

95% of Western developers can't do write a good story if it was handed to them already complete as he said its good FOR a western developer. Compared to say I don't anything with a mute protagonist and not trying to piss people off here but pretty much all console "exclusives" and what not generally have bad story as with the Call of duty games but that doesn't stop the from being fun. He's just saying compared to the average (in all honesty 85%+) of western video games Uncharted is good story wise.

I was suprised to see Bob talk about the Uncharted movie in this positive way just because it has a director with potential - and the reason I'm surprised is that in his Prince of Persia : The Sands of Time movie review - he said : the first good videogame movie has been made - ( he said good movie not fantastic - I personally love it, but anyone who doesn't like it can still admit that compared to the piles of s*** that Uwe Boll makes out of videogames like Alone In The Dark and Bloodrayne - the Prince of Persia movie was at least treated with respect and can be a fun film for most people)- okay back to MovieBob - so he stated that while the first good video game movie has been made - he's not happy because it's just a story like the 1001 arabian nights - and he would like to see a good game movie - that is based around a game world that's more original to gaming - his example was a good Mario movie that would take place in the Mushroom Kingdom so the movie would have that feeling of really coming from the game.
But even if this director makes a good movie out of Uncharted - it will be (as Bob said something like an Indiana Jones movie) - which also isn't anything really new. I know Bob knows this, but somehow the praise of chance because of the director was a little odd to me.

The only game I ever played that really had a good STORY was Mass Effect. When they make a movie of that, if they screw up, there's no way in hell they can blame the source material.

OT: The Uncharted movie will suck, the end.

I gotta admit, I cracked up hard at the comment that "Hollywood doesn't respect aaaaaanything."

I also have to agree heavily with the notion that Transformers didn't suck because they didn't stick to the continuity, it's because of Michael Bay.

So yeah, it's not hard to see why people think a game movie will suck, given how bad most are, but it's also a little early to drop this one. Not that I'm all that excited for it, anyway. Id rather see that Green Lantern movie...

>.>

Good director, wonder why he's wasting his time with this steaming pile of a property.
uncharted plot was bleh, but at least they had zombies for no clear reason.

GreigKM:
Um, Bob, you do know that Valve and Bioware are western developers, right?

Wait, did you seriously just mention Valve in terms of an in-game story? They've always had horrible stories. Even Half-Life has a bland story and I love those games. In fact they made my favorite game L4D and that has almost no story at all. Biowares stories are convoluted and incredibly non-linear (exception being Mass Effect). I really think Bob is right, Western game developers can only make a good story in terms of gameplay and advancing the player from one action intensive conflict to the next. If you look at the stories in comparison to a movie story... they fall pretty flat. But I don't think they're as bad as Steven Seagal movie plots. Nothing is as bad as those...

Meh, Uncharted has always been a third rate National Treasure anyway. Which in turn is a second rate Indiana Jones.

Okay Bob, one thing you did that kinda bothers me. You can't call out Uncharted for having a story that is "good by western game standards, meaning it's about a Steven Segal movie" and then put up Solid Snake in the picture of games that could make good movies. (Unless that was some joke I didn't get) Hideo Kojima's writing isn't any better than what's in Uncharted, and it's far sillier. I won't make claims that Uncharted has exceptional story telling, but it has reasonable enough for what it is. Uncharted is basically exactly what you said it was, a new age Indiana Jones. And it's writing is very much similar to the three Jones movie. (SHUT UP, KINGDOM DIDN'T HAPPEN.)

As for the flak Russell is getting, he pretty much brought it on himself. With his synopsis of what he thinks the story should be come, and to a lesser extent his amusing reactions to being asked why Nathan Fillion isn't onboard. Which is to say, his said this: "How is Nathan Fillion?" verbatum.

I don't really see any way a Mario movie could work. Metal Gear Solid or Zelda though would be awesome.

I'm not the kind of guy who gives a movie the benefit of the doubt, I'm more of the kind who don't bother to speculate, but instead read/watch reviews once it comes out and then decides whether or not to see it.

This pretty much danced around the point that most Uncharted fans have with the movie adaptation. Not that it's going to be a bad movie but that it is, as stated, a movie that sounds like it will have little to nothing to do with the game. In fact, I don't know that I've ever heard anyone complaining about the Uncharted movie's likely quality at all except in the general sense that videogame movies are usually poor. The whole point is that, if a movie maker wants to use a videogame property (or any existing IP, really), they should have some interest in and respect for the source material regardless of it's quality.

Personally I always give video game films a chance. However what really pissed me off is not casting Nathan Fillian (I know this has been said before) I genuienly had no idea who he was until I found out Mark was being cast instead. So I checked Nathan Fillian out and he seems like a stand up guy to do the Uncharted film.

Am I the only that thought the Silent Hill movie was good? It wasn't great, but it certainly captured some the atmosphere and was a good story. (Though a bit confusing at the end.)

Jennacide:
Okay Bob, one thing you did that kinda bothers me. You can't call out Uncharted for having a story that is "good by western game standards, meaning it's about a Steven Segal movie" and then put up Solid Snake in the picture of games that could make good movies. (Unless that was some joke I didn't get) Hideo Kojima's writing isn't any better than what's in Uncharted, and it's far sillier.

I think you're missing the point. That a story isn't well-told in the game doesn't mean it has no movie potential. Like he said in another video, the book that the Godfather is based on isn't that good, but it still made for a great movie. I think that was his main point about Uncharted as well. He didn't think it had such a good story, but he still didn't think people should neglect the possibility that it could work out.

It's not so much about not adapting the game faithfully, but more about adapting the characters. as far as I can tell from Uncharted's history, it is quite simply not about a family of treasure hunters. If it was even remotely linked to that idea, that'd be great, but it's not. So what is the point of the adaptation? Can it be a good film, sure, but it's not a video game film.

We're not pissed off that the story is different, Bob.

We're pissed off because Mark Wahlberg (who was in another certain video game movie that bombed) claimed he was set to play Nathan Drake over nerd idol Nathan Fillion who perfected the role that the character of Drake excels at.

Yet Halo, which actually has a large, morally dubious epic with interesting characters (in the books, and games if you look for clues), along with STEVEN SPELIBURG wanting to direct a movie version, doesn't meet any of those things in moviebobs eyes?

Jennacide:
Okay Bob, one thing you did that kinda bothers me. You can't call out Uncharted for having a story that is "good by western game standards, meaning it's about a Steven Segal movie" and then put up Solid Snake in the picture of games that could make good movies. (Unless that was some joke I didn't get) Hideo Kojima's writing isn't any better than what's in Uncharted, and it's far sillier. I won't make claims that Uncharted has exceptional story telling, but it has reasonable enough for what it is. Uncharted is basically exactly what you said it was, a new age Indiana Jones. And it's writing is very much similar to the three Jones movie. (SHUT UP, KINGDOM DIDN'T HAPPEN.)

As for the flak Russell is getting, he pretty much brought it on himself. With his synopsis of what he thinks the story should be come, and to a lesser extent his amusing reactions to being asked why Nathan Fillion isn't onboard. Which is to say, his said this: "How is Nathan Fillion?" verbatum.

This confused me too. Uncharted actually makes a lot more sense as a movie than the games he referenced with that picture.

Mario and Zelda have more or less the same plot. Yes, they're great, creative, innovative, fun games, but they have very little to do with their actual plots. The things that make them work as games are also what would doom them as movies.

As for Metal Gear Solid, it's practically a movie already, but it's also so bad that it makes my organs cringe with fury.

On a side note, this is bothering me: What is your avatar from? I could swear I've seen it somewhere before but I just can't quite figure it out.

Hey, everyone's already off-topic.

Uncharted should be fairly hard to screw up as a movie, since one could essentially channel the Indiana Jones movies and throw on the charm and story of Uncharted.

mireko:

Jennacide:
Okay Bob, one thing you did that kinda bothers me. You can't call out Uncharted for having a story that is "good by western game standards, meaning it's about a Steven Segal movie" and then put up Solid Snake in the picture of games that could make good movies. (Unless that was some joke I didn't get) Hideo Kojima's writing isn't any better than what's in Uncharted, and it's far sillier. I won't make claims that Uncharted has exceptional story telling, but it has reasonable enough for what it is. Uncharted is basically exactly what you said it was, a new age Indiana Jones. And it's writing is very much similar to the three Jones movie. (SHUT UP, KINGDOM DIDN'T HAPPEN.)

As for the flak Russell is getting, he pretty much brought it on himself. With his synopsis of what he thinks the story should be come, and to a lesser extent his amusing reactions to being asked why Nathan Fillion isn't onboard. Which is to say, his said this: "How is Nathan Fillion?" verbatum.

This confused me too. Uncharted actually makes a lot more sense as a movie than the games he referenced with that picture.

Mario and Zelda have more or less the same plot. Yes, they're great, creative, innovative, fun games, but they have very little to do with their actual plots. The things that make them work as games are also what would doom them as movies.

As for Metal Gear Solid, it's practically a movie already, but it's also so bad that it makes my organs cringe with fury.

On a side note, this is bothering me: What is your avatar from? I could swear I've seen it somewhere before but I just can't quite figure it out.

Hey, everyone's already off-topic.

Exactly how I feel. And while I'll debate you actually probably could make a passable Legend of Zelda movie, Mario was tried and let's never try that again. There are so few games I feel could actually pass as movies and still remain reasonable to the subject matter if you stayed with it. One of the only ones in the past 10 years would be Bioshock. If you made the movie long enough, you could feature all of the core story and issues with stuff like the Little Sisters, show off the Big Daddies and splicer abilities, and /could/ come out with a good movie. (And a much better ending than we got.)

As for my avatar, it's an FFXI Elvaan that looks just like how I made my elvaan girl. Artist is a fellow named Neriwasabi. Advance warning, his work is almost entirely porn.

hmm...a very compelling argument but im still going to kill it with fire.

mireko:

This confused me too. Uncharted actually makes a lot more sense as a movie than the games he referenced with that picture.

Mario and Zelda have more or less the same plot. Yes, they're great, creative, innovative, fun games, but they have very little to do with their actual plots. The things that make them work as games are also what would doom them as movies.

As for Metal Gear Solid, it's practically a movie already, but it's also so bad that it makes my organs cringe with fury.

On a side note, this is bothering me: What is your avatar from? I could swear I've seen it somewhere before but I just can't quite figure it out.

Hey, everyone's already off-topic.

Yeah it does translate very well to a movie as the plot is very concise and easy to convey in an hour and a half, and the action/characters will be enough to carry it along nicely :)

Mario would be terrible movies as Mario is about platforming not story, Which is why the Mario movie was so different and a total bastard child of the games. Although still stupidly entertaining if you expect a B-Movie. Zelda has a little more hope as the story and adventure could translate a little better but I think to do it properly one would have to do Ocarina of Time and break it up into a trilogy of movies, while running the risk of a total flop on the first two movies. Essentially I think Zelda needs to be longer than a given hour and a half or even 2 and a half hour movie, but then parts would feel like filler, so it is a very fragile project.

MGS should never have a movie simply because of its own nature. And yeah the plot is hugely taxing when trying to make any sense of it.

kael013:
"For a western developer"...
BioShock, Red Dead Redemption, Mass Effect, Dragon Age, Halo, Assassin's Creed, mother. fucking. HALF-LIFE!
I could go on, but really, what's the point? I knew this would fall on deaf ears when I saw the characters on the "potentially good movies" slide (Hint: 2 Nintendo franchises, 1 Konami, and I didn't recognize the other).

Dont worry, they are ALL from the other side of the world.

And how in the hell can Super Mario be a good movie? Im sorry but I fell like I am being trolled when I watch this.

"An Uncharted movie?" I thought to myself the first second I heard about it. "But, Uncharted practically already is a movie. It's a fun game that tries to feel like a film as much as possible, their TV spots boast that fact even. Making a movie on that is like trying to emulate the distinct flavor of imitation crab with real crab meat."

But if what you say is true; if the movie is going to be something much different, just with the word "Uncharted" slapped on, then I'm somewhat optimistic.

Gunnyboy:
The Transformers movies are everything you can ask for really. Yeah they focus on a human, but so what? The Transformers are involved all the time and there's tons of action. I do think it comes from people romanticizing the cartoon. Like Bay is the devil for having the twins, but they were LESS offensive than an Arab country named CARBOMBYA in the cartoon. (And I say this as someone who hated the 2nd.)

Bay > Russell.

And I'm out

Yeah, I think Bay's been unfairly maligned for the Transformers movies myself. Looking at the old show, it's equally as stupid. And yet as you say, despite that, it's somehow above criticism for some reason. The Bay movies are big, dumb fun, but yet I can watch them as an adult (at least the first one) and not feel guilty because of it. I can't quite put a reason why, but somehow the way it was done made it acceptable for me to enjoy them, whereas I'd be embarrassed if someone caught me watching the old cartoon.

And like it or not, Bay to me really was a pretty good choice. Ask yourself, what's the main draw of Transformers? If you answered, "Giant robots beating the hell out of each other and shit blowing up," then you'd be right. Since Bay's forte is blowing shit up, he was the right person for the job. Some directors are just good fits for the material whether anyone agrees with it or not.

Another example: I know a lot of people were upset also when the news was announced that Darren Aronofsky wasn't going to direct the next Wolverine movie. Personally, I was okay with that, as while the thought of him directing it was intriguing, I just didn't think he was ultimately right for the material anyway. Like Ang Lee with Hulk, he probably would have tried to make it into something that it wasn't (I kept thinking of Black Swan or The Wrestler with a healing factor). And while I know that there are other directors out there who could do much worse (*cough*Ratner*cough*), I also think there are plenty of other directors that would be better qualified to make the kind of Wolverine movie people would really want.

As to the main topic, I haven't played either Uncharted game, but since I bought a PS3 recently and have been looking for some good games, after this, I'm thinking maybe I should.

HankMan:

Srdjan Tanaskovic:
So Baz Luhrmann is making a movie based on The Great Gatsby

thats bad how?

It's in 3D
That's never a good sign

3DS

Luykus:
"for a western developed video game" ?!

Because the JRPGs really have good plot lines. All I have to say is BIOWARE! Even Dragon Age II (Their worst storyline) was gold compared to other games.

And Uncharted had a good plot, you might know that if you bothered to play it!

Key distinction: Uncharted has a good storyline. It has an predictable plot. Story and plot are two different things. Story is what happens. Plot is how the story unfolds. Once I knew the story, "A lone man goes one a world spanning journey to find an ancestors treasure," I knew where the plot elements were going to show up. I played the game like it were a movie and I predicted every single plot point that came up.

If you think that All JRPGs are like a Final Fantasy game, then yes your derisive chiding is correct. In general, Final Fantasy stories try to be character driven, but you have a sense that these character have no control over their lives. That feeling exists in all of the games in the series, with Final Fantasy 13 is the most blatant of all.

However, if you expand your definition to include other games, then you will find better stories in them. Radiata Stories, Valkyrie Profile, Persona 3 and 4, Demon's Souls, Disgaea, Rogue Galaxy, Odinsphere, Shin Megami Tensei in general. All of those games have better stories than Final Fantasy series in general. Plus the plots are revealed in a more gradual manner.

As for Bioware having good stories, well, since the told the same story 10 times, they are bound to have perfected it by now. Bioware makes the same story over and over again. It does not matter if you are in a Tolkeinesque Fantasy, Deep Space, Mythic China, Star Wars Universe, or on Faerun because the plot is the same.

"You are a hero with a mysterious past. Sometimes you have amnesia, other times you were just abandoned as a child. Soon after you start your adventuring life, you are swept into a conspiracy that have dire ramifications for ______________. The evil that you need to face is so vile that you need to stop it. But along the way, you have to face moral decisions that will affect the outcome of the game slightly."

That the plot of all Bioware games in a nutshell.

I'm sorry, but I don't think I can take someone's opinion on potentially good video game adapted movies seriously if one of his potential "great" stories would be those derived from Super Mario. Seriously... what the hell? There is no story. Why would that be a good idea?

People make fun of Uncharted for it's story, and while I've only played the second, I will say it has some of the best fleshed out characters in a video game I've ever played. That is to say, it actually has fleshed out characters. Seriously, what makes an Indiana Jone's story better? I can't honestly answer that question, as I've only seen the first and that was an EXTREMELY long time ago. But, I liked the story for Uncharted. It's not complex or anything, but it's fun and it gives a chance for the characters to have some witty or funny dialogue. Plus,I always love the idea of going to lost or fictional cities (like Elderado or Atlantis).

+1 for "I'm just peeved that it's not Mal (Nathan Fillion)" He just has the perfect blend of wise ass and bad ass.

And while I'm sure Marky Mark will do a fine job, Funky Bunch or no, he'll just be a second best option.

As for the movie, I'm certainly willing to give it the benefit of the doubt. As Bob said, this is the first video game adaptation that's being led by someone who actually knows wtf they're doing (as far as I know.)

Good vid. Better than the PC one prior to this.

The point that he made that I'd like to emphasize is that games are games, and Movies are movies. Movies, for the most part exist as s story telling medium and nothing else, whereas Games are not. Games CAN be a story telling medium, but it is not by any means necessary for it to be good or fun.

Video games are actually a lot more like Music than they are movies. A story in a video game is as necessary as lyrics in a song. It gives the game meaning, but it is not necessary for the game to be artistic.

Im a big time mario fan and I can't tell you how long I've wanted a CGI movie trilogy writen by nintendo themselves.

Addressing the hate for the Uncharted series and storyline...

What really grabs me about Uncharted's story is not so much its premise, characters, or dialogue. What really grabs me is the structure. Particularly in the second installment, the game makes a point of putting the player in the middle of massive, dramatic, over-the-top, action-packed set pieces that force the player to respond to real-time complications on a genuinely threatening scale, much like an action movie does to its protagonist.

I've been talking about adapting story principles to games for a long time now, and Uncharted does a pretty darn good job of making it feel like a movie experience. Just as a movie changes the stakes of the moment in both the short term and long term, the Uncharted game changes the stakes for the player and succeeds in making those complications flow into the gameplay. There's one moment in the game where the player is fighting enemies in a collapsing building, and the player must fight to jump out at the last second without breaking out of gameplay. In this way, tension builds up and releases in an epic moment of player-controlled action. Its pacing and its dramatic set pieces throughout the game really work for me.

With moments like that, I can tolerate a so-average premise and unsympathetic characters. What the game does to me as a player trumps that entirely. I even come to like the characters I'm interacting with.

Gunnyboy:
Am I the only that thought the Silent Hill movie was good? It wasn't great, but it certainly captured some the atmosphere and was a good story. (Though a bit confusing at the end.)

No, I thought the Silent Hill movie was good too, just like I think the Super Mario Bros movie was good, and the Van-dam/Raul Julia street fighter flick was good too.

Super mario would of just been an hour montage of some fat italian guy in red overalls running around, then 30 minutes of the last castle and ending. Instead we got a dystopian "what-if" story that was good, yet still screamed "Super Mario". But hey, maybe people hated the movie because Luigi actually had a role, and wasn't just some cardboard cutout in the background.

And coming from a self-proclaimed Nintendo Fanboy and Sony hater, its unsurprising how we reacts. He completely skips over the valid arguments so he can rant about something everyone agrees with anyways. We were never worried about the director himself, we are worried by the blatant lack of attention he's spent on the actual game. Uncharted isn't about a family of slightly-fancier museum cops, despite what his "turn on" is telling him. The game doesn't treat itself like some A-list flick, it embraces the obvious inspirations from B-list films and Indiana Jones.

I don't want to see another "Night at the Museum" flick with Walhburg instead of Stiller.

That slap against uncharted's story made me angry but overall good episode. Movie is still likely going to suck because it sounds like it doesn't want to be based on uncharted. Oh, and a family? Really?

darthotaku:
I've seen alot of people bashing Moviebob about his "For a western developer" line, and I think it's funny that they bring up the same five games.

Name five eastern games that people will generally agree have a great story. The reason we use the same examples is because not everyone will agree on inFamous, and those who don't will ignore the post based on one example that didn't resonate with them.

As for eastern games, the best examples that come to mind with great story are the Persona games and Legend of Zelda games, and most people wouldn't even agree on that.

darthotaku:
Most games that I play for a good story aren't western made games because western games put more emphasis* on making a profit rather than making a touching story and gameplay.

Citation needed. You generalized all western games, when a vast amount of them are actually trying to affect their audience. Video games have approximately the same amount of drivel no matter what country you get them from.

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