Konami Offers Exchanges on 360 Silent Hill HD Collection

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For fucks sake; how much are Microsoft charging to certify patches that the cheaper option is to offer a different game to all customers?

Should be a free extra game, and not a trade : /

Wait, instead of replacing it with another game that the customer didn't really want anyway, couldn't they just exchange the game with a patched on disc version? What will they do with all the turned in games anyway? Resell them?

I can understand the outrage. But there is still something weirder going on behind the scenes here. I mean why fix the problem on the PS3 but not the XBox 360? Can we reasonably suspect that there is something in the rules, policies, certification testing or business agreements with MS that discourage Konami from actually fixing the problem?

Acrisius:

antman890:

Acrisius:

Of course they will fight and lobby and do all the things they're already doing. But SOPA/CISPA/ACTA/HERPDERPA all got voted down once people heard about them. If those people are the ones who get to vote about it in the first place, well, chances are they're gonna have the same opinion they had back when all they did was hear about it. You know what I mean? We'll see what happens, but there's a serious issue today with the punishment for certain things not fitting the crime and people are not happy about it. Look at how they fine pirates and whatever. Millions of dollars. Nobody in their right mind things that's reasonable on any planet, and it's shit like that which is creating a divide between the rule of the law and the rule of personal morals. The longer it stays like that, the more the law is actually being undermined and hollowed out in the eyes of people. Can't keep going like that.

i hope your right on this. i think for something like pirating they should just ban the person from using computers (unless their day job consists of it). when ex cons are on probation they aren't allowed to assosiate with felons, it closer to that model than anything else i can think of and i think its firly reasonable. not fine them into bankruptcy.

Dude, "banning people" from using computers is like banning people from using a phone or a sending mails. By your logic, someone who has once robbed or stolen a taxi can never use taxis. People steal shit in stores all day, every day, everywhere. Do they ban people from going to stores? Insane.

then what else can you suggest? its all well and good to say that the punishment should fit the crime but what punishment is fitting of piracy? imprinsonment? hands being choped off?

faefrost:
I can understand the outrage. But there is still something weirder going on behind the scenes here. I mean why fix the problem on the PS3 but not the XBox 360? Can we reasonably suspect that there is something in the rules, policies, certification testing or business agreements with MS that discourage Konami from actually fixing the problem?

Microsoft charges obscene amounts of money for the privilege to patch games on their system, remember?

Kopikatsu:

faefrost:
I can understand the outrage. But there is still something weirder going on behind the scenes here. I mean why fix the problem on the PS3 but not the XBox 360? Can we reasonably suspect that there is something in the rules, policies, certification testing or business agreements with MS that discourage Konami from actually fixing the problem?

Microsoft charges obscene amounts of money for the privilege to patch games on their system, remember?

But this is Konami. I figure that if anyone has enough disposable income to pay for a patch, it's them.

lithiumvocals:

Kopikatsu:

faefrost:
I can understand the outrage. But there is still something weirder going on behind the scenes here. I mean why fix the problem on the PS3 but not the XBox 360? Can we reasonably suspect that there is something in the rules, policies, certification testing or business agreements with MS that discourage Konami from actually fixing the problem?

Microsoft charges obscene amounts of money for the privilege to patch games on their system, remember?

But this is Konami. I figure that if anyone has enough disposable income to pay for a patch, it's them.

A small company like Atlus just patched their newest game as fast as they could. A big company like Konami could afford any price Microsoft asks.

I don't know. I just know Konami has pretty much run Silent Hill into the ground, destroyed its once-good name, and botched the HD collection on an unheard of level. This should have been a celebration of one of the greatest horror games, and one of the greatest games in general, of all time, given as much love, effort, and attention as the most sacred of video games.

I say often that if video games were a museum, Silent Hill 2 would be its Mona Lisa. The fact that Konami cares so little that they couldn't be bothered to re-release a 10-year-old game on modern systems without making it massively inferior in nearly every way, and then couldn't be bothered to fix all its brokenness upon release, says how much they care about the brand and its passionate fans.

I see it more as

PS3 = Japanese system, patch it. Xbox = American system, eh who cares?

For the Japanese Konami.

Boudica:
While nice of them to be forthcoming with it, exchanging faulty goods that don't perform as could be reasonably expected is law in many countries.

As it is here, but the contents of a video game are treated differently because ponies. Really, all software is treated differently because ponies. but then, these days expecting functional hardware is becoming unrealistic, because consumers don't give a damn anymore and many will actually defend the horrendous practice of releasing broken crap. Ha. You thought I was going to say ponies, didn't you?

In other words:

Easton Dark:
Stand up guys. Other companies would tell people to suck it up.

Sad that that's my perception of most game companies.

You don't have to step forward to look good if the other guys are all stepping back.

BloodRed Pixel:
WHAT? A full scale product recall and exchange is cheaper than making a patch?

what is wrong with this world?

Before you get too stressed out, it's not a full scale product recall. The restrictions here are gamed in such a way to grossly reduce the number of people.

Trade-in for another Konami title? How many of those are on the Xbox? The only one I can think of is the Metal Gear collection.

Trishbot:

A small company like Atlus just patched their newest game as fast as they could. A big company like Konami could afford any price Microsoft asks.

A lot of smaller companies do it. Which always makes me wonder why people jump on these stories so eagerly. I wonder if it's all just "MICRO$OFT IS TEH DEVIL!" Or what.

So, they'd rather give free games than pay Microsoft to distribute a patch? Understandable, but not excusable. I doubt Konami would lose many customers, though.

lithiumvocals:

Kopikatsu:

faefrost:
I can understand the outrage. But there is still something weirder going on behind the scenes here. I mean why fix the problem on the PS3 but not the XBox 360? Can we reasonably suspect that there is something in the rules, policies, certification testing or business agreements with MS that discourage Konami from actually fixing the problem?

Microsoft charges obscene amounts of money for the privilege to patch games on their system, remember?

But this is Konami. I figure that if anyone has enough disposable income to pay for a patch, it's them.

It's not a matter of ability to pay, but willingness.

I would even go as far as to say that the more able a company is to pay the fine, the less willing they'd be.

Kopikatsu:

lithiumvocals:

Kopikatsu:

Microsoft charges obscene amounts of money for the privilege to patch games on their system, remember?

But this is Konami. I figure that if anyone has enough disposable income to pay for a patch, it's them.

It's not a matter of ability to pay, but willingness.

I would even go as far as to say that the more able a company is to pay the fine, the less willing they'd be.

So they're just being dicks.

lithiumvocals:

Kopikatsu:

lithiumvocals:

But this is Konami. I figure that if anyone has enough disposable income to pay for a patch, it's them.

It's not a matter of ability to pay, but willingness.

I would even go as far as to say that the more able a company is to pay the fine, the less willing they'd be.

So they're just being dicks.

They're both being dicks.

Kopikatsu:

lithiumvocals:

Kopikatsu:

It's not a matter of ability to pay, but willingness.

I would even go as far as to say that the more able a company is to pay the fine, the less willing they'd be.

So they're just being dicks.

They're both being dicks.

Good thing I already have these for the PS2, otherwise I'd be mad at these companies for dickery.

antman890:

Acrisius:

antman890:

i hope your right on this. i think for something like pirating they should just ban the person from using computers (unless their day job consists of it). when ex cons are on probation they aren't allowed to assosiate with felons, it closer to that model than anything else i can think of and i think its firly reasonable. not fine them into bankruptcy.

Dude, "banning people" from using computers is like banning people from using a phone or a sending mails. By your logic, someone who has once robbed or stolen a taxi can never use taxis. People steal shit in stores all day, every day, everywhere. Do they ban people from going to stores? Insane.

then what else can you suggest? its all well and good to say that the punishment should fit the crime but what punishment is fitting of piracy? imprinsonment? hands being choped off?

Are you confusing piracy, the act of copyright infringement by a private and civilian party, with rape, the act of forcibly having sex with another person against their will? It's a bunch of bits and bytes, it's not even theft. What do they do to kids who steal lipstick in a store? Slap on the hand, maybe a fine, or community service. And that's for THEFT! Why should piracy, something that's not even theft(neither legally nor practically), require harsher punishment? You sit here and talk about how things are bullshit, yet you're completely part of it yourself. I am disappoint.

So instead of patching a game which many people have been looking forward to play, they instead ignore the pleas of their customers and offer a different game which they actually give a shit about...

huh, so Konami released a crappy product, knowing perfectly well that it's bugged up the butt but shut their eyes and ears until the outcry was too loud to ignore and now they don't grant refunds OR fixes but allow to trade in for a game customers don't want?

That's like a multi-dimensional cock-up. Yeah, it might've been a bit expensive to patch the game but really, that would've been an investment well worth considering that it would put the brand Silent Hill back into a good light, create more loyal customers and allow future SH games to sell.

But yeah, short-term savings are SO much more worth than long-term profit.

They should be offering full refunds. You release a product that doesn't work then you should be footing the bill.

antman890:
my original point is that this type of business practice is bad, retarding and stupid and whoever came up with it is stupid, and therefore should be shot and their family should pay for the bullet. it might be business savy to save a few buck but its stupid to alienate ur customer base no matter what business ur in and thats exactly what they're doing.

understand????????????

I don't know about anyone else, but I was a little confused at first.
Luckily by the 10th question mark it sank it. Thanks.

Its a disgrace. They admit to releasing a crappy version of the game and then wont do anything to rectify it. Some people wont be able to get there money back or swap it. Most shops normally have a 1 week return policy or something. Konami can't do anything about it. Its a disgrace, it really is.

Kopikatsu:

lithiumvocals:

Kopikatsu:

It's not a matter of ability to pay, but willingness.

I would even go as far as to say that the more able a company is to pay the fine, the less willing they'd be.

So they're just being dicks.

They're both being dicks.

EVERYONE IS A DICK!

lithiumvocals:

Kopikatsu:

lithiumvocals:

But this is Konami. I figure that if anyone has enough disposable income to pay for a patch, it's them.

It's not a matter of ability to pay, but willingness.

I would even go as far as to say that the more able a company is to pay the fine, the less willing they'd be.

So they're just being dicks.

I'm thinking it is more a reaction to the process involved with patching on the XBox as opposed to the costs. We hear more than enough stories about how pointlessly onerous the XBox certification process is. I mean to patch it they would have to retest and re-certify it with the Rock Band drum kit among other things. Really?

So they have admitted that the product is unfit for sale? Time to call up UK Trading Standards!

(at least thats what i'd be saying if i'd bought it...)

faefrost:

lithiumvocals:

Kopikatsu:

It's not a matter of ability to pay, but willingness.

I would even go as far as to say that the more able a company is to pay the fine, the less willing they'd be.

So they're just being dicks.

I'm thinking it is more a reaction to the process involved with patching on the XBox as opposed to the costs. We hear more than enough stories about how pointlessly onerous the XBox certification process is. I mean to patch it they would have to retest and re-certify it with the Rock Band drum kit among other things. Really?

Konami doesn't seem like a company that is worried with protesting shitty business practices.

dear god Konami has fallen as a quality developer as of late. In terms of incompetent Japanese developers they're only surpassed by Square-Enix.

So....wait, only in South and North america? What about the rest of the world that bought it?

what games can you exchange for Silent hill HD collection?

I don't get it... how did this happen? The Metal Gear Solid HD Collection was excellent! How did Silent Hill's turn out so bad? It's great that they're offering exchanges, but since it's faulty merchandise that they themselves don't want to fix, they really should just give a refund. That'd certainly be better for public relations.

Captcha: Talk the talk

But remember Captcha, you also gotta walk the walk!

Acrisius:

antman890:

Acrisius:

Dude, "banning people" from using computers is like banning people from using a phone or a sending mails. By your logic, someone who has once robbed or stolen a taxi can never use taxis. People steal shit in stores all day, every day, everywhere. Do they ban people from going to stores? Insane.

then what else can you suggest? its all well and good to say that the punishment should fit the crime but what punishment is fitting of piracy? imprinsonment? hands being choped off?

Are you confusing piracy, the act of copyright infringement by a private and civilian party, with rape, the act of forcibly having sex with another person against their will? It's a bunch of bits and bytes, it's not even theft. What do they do to kids who steal lipstick in a store? Slap on the hand, maybe a fine, or community service. And that's for THEFT! Why should piracy, something that's not even theft(neither legally nor practically), require harsher punishment? You sit here and talk about how things are bullshit, yet you're completely part of it yourself. I am disappoint.

nononono taking a product without purchasing it is theft, be it lipstick or game. in the case of lipstick the design of the property (or product) is owned by the person that designed it (or the middle men who have ripped the rights of the product from the designer)and as such they have every right to make a profit from something they created. its the same in the case of games. someone has gone through the effort to make a game and it is their right to have it protected (all though i think middle men like EA who abuse this should have their meat and veg ripped off) BUT as you said for physical products people get a slap on the wrist while they try to bend people over the table when it come to virtual content. What im wandering is what is an acceptable punishment that would fit. im sorry if i confused you with my extreme choices but honestly im not sure what punishment would fit this crime and was curious of your opinion. all i know is that fining the gold fillings out of someones mouth is too extreme but doing nothing is just as bad.

p.s i think that for rape having hands chopped off should only be the BEGINNING of the punishment. i think that by the end of the punishment for rape the felon should be just a tourso and a head. nothing else.

WaysideMaze:
They should be offering full refunds. You release a product that doesn't work then you should be footing the bill.

antman890:
my original point is that this type of business practice is bad, retarding and stupid and whoever came up with it is stupid, and therefore should be shot and their family should pay for the bullet. it might be business savy to save a few buck but its stupid to alienate ur customer base no matter what business ur in and thats exactly what they're doing.

understand????????????

I don't know about anyone else, but I was a little confused at first.
Luckily by the 10th question mark it sank it. Thanks.

lol sorry if it was confusing. yes they bloody well should be offering refunds but thats money out of their pocket. Hell will freeze over, every cancer will be curable and humanity will have explored the entire universe before they would ever let money come out of their pocket.

FargoDog:
So wait, they'll go through with an exchange program... But won't take the time and resources to simply patch the damn thing?

What are you smoking, Konami?

It's partly Microsofts fault, they charge insane amounts of money for patches and DLC.

antman890:

Acrisius:

antman890:

then what else can you suggest? its all well and good to say that the punishment should fit the crime but what punishment is fitting of piracy? imprinsonment? hands being choped off?

Are you confusing piracy, the act of copyright infringement by a private and civilian party, with rape, the act of forcibly having sex with another person against their will? It's a bunch of bits and bytes, it's not even theft. What do they do to kids who steal lipstick in a store? Slap on the hand, maybe a fine, or community service. And that's for THEFT! Why should piracy, something that's not even theft(neither legally nor practically), require harsher punishment? You sit here and talk about how things are bullshit, yet you're completely part of it yourself. I am disappoint.

nononono taking a product without purchasing it is theft, be it lipstick or game. in the case of lipstick the design of the property (or product) is owned by the person that designed it (or the middle men who have ripped the rights of the product from the designer)and as such they have every right to make a profit from something they created. its the same in the case of games. someone has gone through the effort to make a game and it is their right to have it protected (all though i think middle men like EA who abuse this should have their meat and veg ripped off) BUT as you said for physical products people get a slap on the wrist while they try to bend people over the table when it come to virtual content. What im wandering is what is an acceptable punishment that would fit. im sorry if i confused you with my extreme choices but honestly im not sure what punishment would fit this crime and was curious of your opinion. all i know is that fining the gold fillings out of someones mouth is too extreme but doing nothing is just as bad.

p.s i think that for rape having hands chopped off should only be the BEGINNING of the punishment. i think that by the end of the punishment for rape the felon should be just a tourso and a head. nothing else.

Well bro, first off, if you're gonna have a discussion about something you have to prepared to accept facts. Piracy is what I described; the act of copyright infringement by a private, civilian party with the purpose of private use. That's what the LAW SAYS. It's NOT THEFT the way stealing a car or a watch or whatever is. Not legally, not practically. It doesn't matter what you choose to call it by buying into the lobbyists propaganda. Piracy is not theft. Piracy is copyright infringement FOR PRIVATE USE. It's the mildest form of copyright infringement, other forms being for example to copy a design or product or similar with the purpose of monetizing it and make money. You can't literally STEAL bits and bytes, you can only copy them. COPY. RIGHT. I hope you understand this now, I'm not making this up. Check a law book if you don't believe me.

Second, judging by all the wacky things you've said about punishment, I seriously doubt I'll be able to suggest a punishment that is acceptable to you. I seriously hope you're joking about the rape-thing, because that's quite frankly disturbing and not befitting of a democratic society that believes in human rights.

But if you must know what I think is a fair punishment of piracy, well, I think it should be in the same area as minor theft. It's a completely victimless crime. You're not removing any value the way you're doing if you steal something from a store. What you take from the store has definite value to the store. That exact piece of lipstick is unique. The same can't be said for bits and byes. They're just electrons. You're just copying them for private use.

I personally liked the old days compared to the new ones... Where you didn't have to update your game within the first half-hour of owning it and the campaign/ story-mode just worked. But now I feel like game producers are basically throwing they're cocks (games) out into the open to be bought, realize the cock is already fucked and can't get much out of until they fix it.

Maybe not that far... I will admit you don't really need patches or 'fixes'. I mean, if there was a patch that made BF3 playable, good, Russian Guns with recoil, I think everything would be peachy-keen. But sadly, no... I actually have yet to see patches that properly work.

I'm going to deviate off a little, as I talk about Multi-Player/ Co-Op. Now, I understand reasons to why those need patching or updates. For obvious reasons like: annoying fuckheads finding "Glitches" and "Oo', look, I'm somehow a God now and Zombies can't get me!" but that just ruins the whole 'FUN' part in the game. Why not just go online and buy a mode, that let's you run around in a world, full of inanimate enemies that only move when you shoot them? Well, I can tell you why: BECAUSE IT'S FUCKING STUPID--- Okay, I've gone off point.

But one thing I have thought of is: Konami have deadlines, yes? Do they keep to them? ... Can't tell. But what I feel like is, when they produce the HD of SH2/3, they thought to themselves "Let's see if we can still make money if we dick-around a bit." and probably "Well, we don't have anything else to do. So let's fuck up this game, send it out, then a month or two later, we'll have work to do so it looks like we're working." But then, when I think about it, it sounds like they were all 20 when they started working, now they've slowly degenerated back to teenagers when they all hit 40.

To end this point, I think I should say; patches are a game-designer's way to say "We fucked up."... Unless it actually does something or makes the game better.

Also, I believe everyone should just buy the originals off Amazon for $10/7 and be happy with themselves ._. That's what I've done.

God damn, I was looking forward to getting the HD collection! I could get it on PS3 instead of XBOX I suppose, but I rarely get a chance to play the PS3. Oh well, I'll stick to the original I guess. But this just seems lazy to me, but since microsoft would charge a hefty sum for them to patch it, I suppose it's better than nothing at all.

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